Reality Check

[hyo silver]

Originally Posted by Stev0

I have an even better solution than public transportation - I can (and do) walk to work.

Atta boy, Stev0!

[Mawcawfee]

Originally Posted by RadGash

Everyone on this board is here PRIMARILY (I assume) because we are concerned about the pollution automobiles spew into our air and have made a big financial commitment to curtail our contribution to this problem.

I'm not. Automobile pollution (per vehicle) has been reduced by about 99% in the U.S. versus 30 years ago. I am concerned about using less gasoline (and therefore oil), since the money mostly goes to foreign countries and funds dictatorships and hordes of terrorist troglodytes. Preserving natural resources and protecting the environment is just icing on the cake. I am also attracted to the high technology of the Prius, its huge cruising range, and the convenience of far fewer visits to the gas pump.

I solved the "driving less" issue by starting my own company and mostly working from home. Walking down the hallway sure beats my previous commute of an hour each way in heavy traffic.

[F8L]

Originally Posted by Mawcawfee

I'm not. Automobile pollution (per vehicle) has been reduced by about 99% in the U.S. versus 30 years ago. I am concerned about using less gasoline (and therefore oil), since the money mostly goes to foreign countries and funds dictatorships and hordes of terrorist troglodytes. Preserving natural resources and protecting the environment is just icing on the cake. I am also attracted to the high technology of the Prius, its huge cruising range, and the convenience of far fewer visits to the gas pump.

I solved the "driving less" issue by starting my own company and mostly working from home. Walking down the hallway sure beats my previous commute of an hour each way in heavy traffic.

Don't forget that we have added a huge amount of vehicles over that period of time so it is almost a wash. 99% is a bit of a stretch.

That is a killer commute!

[Mawcawfee]

Originally Posted by F8L

Don't forget that we have added a huge amount of vehicles over that period of time so it is almost a wash. 99% is a bit of a stretch.

That is a killer commute!

Yes, the number of vehicles on the roads is a lot higher now. But even 99% less per vehicle is a tad understated. Per a recent study (a legitimate one, not from Detroit) that I listened to a radio discussion about last week, per vehicle emissions are 99.5% less than in 1970, thanks to technology like catalytic converters, miniaturized electronics, exhaust recirculation, VVT, etc. That's remarkable. Hybrids like the Prius will only improve the situation.

[F8L]

Looking at historical EPA Emission Standards:

Page 2 shows historical standards. Not sure if that is such a drastic improvement as you claim but it is large. Do you have any sources for the content on the radio show or is it streaming audio so I could take a listen? I'd like find out more about this.

[Mawcawfee]

I wish I did, but no. The show was on WMAL in D.C. If I have time and their website lists the show archive, I will try to find it. I was working at the time, so not really paying attention to which show/timeslot it was. The 99.5% number really caught my attention for a few minutes of the discussion, though.

FYI. I spent a few minutes looking at the EPA data at the link you provided. I don't see data from 1970, so I will use the pre-1973 data for cars (labeled pre-1968 on EPA chart) . The old hydrocarbon data was tracked somewhat differently than the new. Improvements since 1970:

Tier 2, Bin 7
HC reduction (HCHO new, THC old) = (8.8 - 0.018)/8.8 = 99.8%
CO reduction = (87 - 4.2)/87 = 95.2%
NOx reduction = (3.5 - 0.15)/3.5 = 95.7%

Tier 2, Bin 5
HC reduction (HCHO new, THC old) = (8.8 - 0.018)/8.8 = 99.8%
CO reduction = (87 - 4.2)/87 = 95.2%
NOx reduction = (3.5 - 0.07)/3.5 = 98%

Tier 2, Bin 3
HC reduction (HCHO new, THC old) = (8.8 - 0.011)/8.8 = 99.9%
CO reduction = (87 - 2.1)/87 = 97.6%
NOx reduction = (3.5 - 0.03)/3.5 = 99.1%

So it would seem the 99.5% number in the study must be referring to hydrocarbon emissions, although the carbon monoxide and nitrogen oxide improvements are just as impressive nonetheless.

[F8L]

Originally Posted by Mawcawfee

I wish I did, but no. The show was on WMAL in D.C. If I have time and their website lists the show archive, I will try to find it. I was working at the time, so not really paying attention to which show/timeslot it was. The 99.5% number really caught my attention for a few minutes of the discussion, though.

No worries, if you happen across it PM me. Those numbers would have caught my attention too.

[F8L]

I should have done the math before posting. lol

Thanks for clearing that up. Should theoretically we should be able to calculate the difference by the cars added to the road since 1970 then and come up with an impact figure? I really hate math btw.

[fish_antlers]

Originally Posted by RadGash

Everyone on this board is here PRIMARILY (I assume) because we are concerned about the pollution automobiles spew into our air and have made a big financial commitment to curtail our contribution to this problem.

Not me.... I bought the prius because I happen to think it's a cool car. I have no motivation whatsoever to "save" the environment and I wholeheartedly disagree with the concept of manmade "global warming".

Am I a minority? If I am, it's unfortunate - a car as cool as this shouldnt be relegated to envirofreaks and granola heads IMHO.

BTW... I own a chainsaw, so sue me!

[F8L]

Originally Posted by fish_antlers

Not me.... I bought the prius because I happen to think it's a cool car. I have no motivation whatsoever to "save" the environment and I wholeheartedly disagree with the concept of manmade "global warming".

Am I a minority? If I am, it's unfortunate - a car as cool as this shouldnt be relegated to envirofreaks and granola heads IMHO.

BTW... I own a chainsaw, so sue me!

Cool, way to spew your uninformed opinion within your first post. You can go drown yourself now.

*edit*

That wasn't very nice I apologize.