Forget global warming: Welcome to the new Ice Age

amped · 02-25-2008, 11:29 PM

I found the claims interesting and the ability of the scientists to apply the Scientific Method to correct assumptions admirable. More testing and data, please, and soon...if funding can be found to test the theory that could impact current funding for competing agendas.

"And remember the Arctic Sea ice? The ice we were told so hysterically last fall had melted to its "lowest levels on record? Never mind that those records only date back as far as 1972 and that there is anthropological and geological evidence of much greater melts in the past."

"But if environmentalists and environment reporters can run around shrieking about the manmade destruction of the natural order every time a robin shows up on Georgian Bay two weeks early, then it is at least fair game to use this winter's weather stories to wonder whether the alarmist are being a tad premature."

"We missed what was right in front of our eyes," says Prof. Russell. It's not ice melt but rather wind circulation that drives ocean currents northward from the tropics. Climate models until now have not properly accounted for the wind's effects on ocean circulation, so researchers have compensated by over-emphasizing the role of manmade warming on polar ice melt.

Forget global warming: Welcome to the new Ice Age

F8L · 02-26-2008, 12:49 AM

You realize you just sent us to a link for a controversial news source owned by a very controversial media conglomerate right? lol

I'm all for new evidence but I'm not about to try an obtain it from a newspaper or hyperbole ridden news source with an agenda. Instead I'll keep an eye on the papers that are published and the comments from other scientists concerning ones that are not published.

amped · 02-26-2008, 01:07 AM

Although I got it from a reputable news site, I wasn't sure so hedged my lead-in.

At least the quoted excerpts seemed benign. Is Prof. Russell a fraud? I really don't know, but the quotes and claims about record low temps were noteworthy from my layperson's perspective.

F8L · 02-26-2008, 01:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by amped

Although I got it from a reputable news site, I wasn't sure so hedged my lead-in.

At least the quoted excerpts seemed benign. Is Prof. Russell a fraud? I really don't know, but the quotes and claims about record low temps were noteworthy from my layperson's perspective.

I honestly couldn't tell you if Prof. Russell is a fraud or not. I'm usually inclined to give professors the benefit of the doubt but I still question even the highest authority on a subject simply because history has shown enough of them to have been wrong yet everyone listened due to their status as an authority. I'll give Ales Hrdlicka (1869-1943) as an example of someone who was bent on disproving or downplaying new evidence to support a theory. He played a pivotal role in shooting down any new evidence that might prove that humans inhabited North/South America prior to 13,000yrs ago. As a very prominant figure in anthropology he held much sway.

icarus · 02-26-2008, 01:54 AM

The fools mistake is to confuse weather with climate. The coldest (hottest, driest, wettest) season on record is weather. The coldest (etc) decade, century, etc is climate.

To confuse todays weather with climate change is crazy. The climate models suggest that the extremes of weather will increase with projected climate change. Climate change DOESN'T mean nothing but warming, but rather warmer in some places, colder in others. Same for dry/wet. Climate change will change the weather, the weather doesn't change the climate.

Icarus

Godiva · 02-26-2008, 01:57 AM

It's about climate change.

Climate

Change

burritos · 02-26-2008, 02:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Godiva

It's about climate change.

Climate

Change

Too

difficult

for

some

to

understand.

amped · 02-26-2008, 03:38 PM

Do

You

Still

Beat

Your

Wife?

That's how I and a substantial part of the scientific community view the "climate change" argument.

Alric · 02-26-2008, 03:53 PM

This is one of those occasions when looking at the data helps:

That last dip is a little scary...

richard schumacher · 02-26-2008, 04:02 PM

It's been cold in the interior of continents because more heat has been going into melting polar ice, and the chilled air then comes south. Don't fret, it will be nice and warm again this summer and the sea ice will reach a new low.

For discussion of global warming by atmospheric physicists and climatologists see
RealClimate

02-25-2008, 11:29 PM	#1
amped Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: The Gorge OR Posts: 2,318 My Car: 2010 Prius Model: IV Package: Solar Roof Thanks: 32 Thanked 79 Times in 53 Posts Friends: 0	Forget global warming: Welcome to the new Ice Age I found the claims interesting and the ability of the scientists to apply the Scientific Method to correct assumptions admirable. More testing and data, please, and soon...if funding can be found to test the theory that could impact current funding for competing agendas. "And remember the Arctic Sea ice? The ice we were told so hysterically last fall had melted to its "lowest levels on record? Never mind that those records only date back as far as 1972 and that there is anthropological and geological evidence of much greater melts in the past." "But if environmentalists and environment reporters can run around shrieking about the manmade destruction of the natural order every time a robin shows up on Georgian Bay two weeks early, then it is at least fair game to use this winter's weather stories to wonder whether the alarmist are being a tad premature." "We missed what was right in front of our eyes," says Prof. Russell. It's not ice melt but rather wind circulation that drives ocean currents northward from the tropics. Climate models until now have not properly accounted for the wind's effects on ocean circulation, so researchers have compensated by over-emphasizing the role of manmade warming on polar ice melt. Forget global warming: Welcome to the new Ice Age __________________ "The men that American people admire most extravagantly are the most daring liars; the men they detest the most violently are those who try to tell them the truth." -- H L Mencken

02-26-2008, 12:49 AM	#2
F8L Collecting Data on Nature Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Sacramento, CA. Posts: 5,447 My Car: 2005 Prius Model: Package: #4 Thanks: 20 Thanked 185 Times in 134 Posts Friends: 35	Re: Forget global warming: Welcome to the new Ice Age You realize you just sent us to a link for a controversial news source owned by a very controversial media conglomerate right? lol I'm all for new evidence but I'm not about to try an obtain it from a newspaper or hyperbole ridden news source with an agenda. Instead I'll keep an eye on the papers that are published and the comments from other scientists concerning ones that are not published.

02-26-2008, 01:07 AM	#3
amped Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: The Gorge OR Posts: 2,318 My Car: 2010 Prius Model: IV Package: Solar Roof Thanks: 32 Thanked 79 Times in 53 Posts Friends: 0	Re: Forget global warming: Welcome to the new Ice Age Although I got it from a reputable news site, I wasn't sure so hedged my lead-in. At least the quoted excerpts seemed benign. Is Prof. Russell a fraud? I really don't know, but the quotes and claims about record low temps were noteworthy from my layperson's perspective.

02-26-2008, 01:54 AM	#5
icarus Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: quetico, on/bellingham, wa Posts: 1,207 My Car: 2007 Prius Model: Package: #7 Thanks: 9 Thanked 50 Times in 39 Posts Friends: 0	Re: Forget global warming: Welcome to the new Ice Age The fools mistake is to confuse weather with climate. The coldest (hottest, driest, wettest) season on record is weather. The coldest (etc) decade, century, etc is climate. To confuse todays weather with climate change is crazy. The climate models suggest that the extremes of weather will increase with projected climate change. Climate change DOESN'T mean nothing but warming, but rather warmer in some places, colder in others. Same for dry/wet. Climate change will change the weather, the weather doesn't change the climate. Icarus

02-26-2008, 01:57 AM	#6
Godiva AmeriKan Citizen Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: San Diego, CA Posts: 10,342 My Car: 2005 Prius Model: Package: #1 Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post Friends: 7	Re: Forget global warming: Welcome to the new Ice Age It's about climate change. Climate Change

02-26-2008, 03:38 PM	#8
amped Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: The Gorge OR Posts: 2,318 My Car: 2010 Prius Model: IV Package: Solar Roof Thanks: 32 Thanked 79 Times in 53 Posts Friends: 0	Re: Forget global warming: Welcome to the new Ice Age Do You Still Beat Your Wife? That's how I and a substantial part of the scientific community view the "climate change" argument.

02-26-2008, 03:53 PM	#9
Alric Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 1,259 My Car: 2007 Prius Model: Package: #8 Thanks: 0 Thanked 18 Times in 12 Posts Friends: 0	Re: Forget global warming: Welcome to the new Ice Age This is one of those occasions when looking at the data helps: That last dip is a little scary...

02-26-2008, 04:02 PM	#10
richard schumacher Destination: Eschaton Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: United States Posts: 5,507 My Car: 2004 Prius Model: N/A Package: #6 Thanks: 99 Thanked 93 Times in 66 Posts Friends: 0	Re: Forget global warming: Welcome to the new Ice Age It's been cold in the interior of continents because more heat has been going into melting polar ice, and the chilled air then comes south. Don't fret, it will be nice and warm again this summer and the sea ice will reach a new low. For discussion of global warming by atmospheric physicists and climatologists see RealClimate Last edited by richard schumacher; 02-26-2008 at 04:05 PM.