Can you prove that Allah is not the one true God?

burritos · 03-14-2007, 05:53 PM

excerpted from Sam Harris's, Letter to a Christian Nation,

"Why don't you lose any sleep over whether to convert to Islam? Can you prove that Allah is not the one, true God? Can you prove that the archangel Gabriel did not visit Muhammad in his cave? Of course not. But you need not prove any of these things to reject the beliefs of Muslims as absurd. The burden is upon them to prove that their beliefs about God and Muhammad are valid. They have not done this. THey cannot do this. Muslums are simply not making claims about reality that can be corroborated. This is perfectly apparent to anyone who has not anesthetised himself with the dogma of Islam.

The truth is, you know exactly what it is like to be an atheist with respect to the beliefs of Muslims. Isn't it obvious that Muslims are folling themselves? Isn't it obvious that anyone who thinks that the Koran is the perfect word of the creator of the univers has not read the book critically? Isn't it obvious that the doctrine of Islam represents a near-perfect barrier to honest inquiry? Yes, these things are obvious. Understand that the way you view Islam is precisely the way devout Muslims view Hristianity. And it is the way I view all religions."

interesting stuff.

huskers · 03-14-2007, 06:11 PM

Rational thinking !!!

km5er · 03-14-2007, 07:36 PM

Actually, all religion is a scam. How many folks have died because of conflicts of faith? No ..you are wrong...I do belive in god. I do not belive in religion. Religion is just mans way to explain god. If you are jewish, belive in budda, islam, baptist..or whatever both you and I believe in the same god. The difference is that I do not need a man made "religion" to feel secure in my belief.

Someday.....perhaps we are going to advance to the point that one man is not going to kill or hate another man because of religion.

F8L · 03-14-2007, 07:57 PM

The God Delusion is another example of rational thinking.

KD6HDX · 03-14-2007, 08:35 PM

My neighbor just suggested that I check out a new book by Victor J. Stenger. The title is, "GOD: the failed hypothesis - How science shows that God does not exist."

Not sure if I will buy it or not. but lately I can say I have questioned my faith. This may be a sign of depression, or just some rational thought patterns emerging. After all, there has been a lot of killing in the name of God lately. Who could ever be sure if thats what he wishes, or that he is a he and not just light? Or that She is a gay whale and is pissed at the japanese for eating everything that swims. I don't get it. Where do we find the answers to lifes most puzzling questions. Christian by baptism and by faith in Christ, I have to say that religion and politics are, and always will be, a very lethal mix. On the one hand, I don't see why so many non believers get upset if believers choose to believe in something larger than themselves. It should hurt no one if we just believe and not adopt zealotry to convert those around us. As for the agnostic crowd, I also understand that there is no way to know definitively whether God exists or does not exist. For me, faith answers that question. As for the science in our world. I say this, who am I to disregard the scientific findings of Gods most intelligent creatures?

KD6HDX
$3.01 a gallon today for regualr unleaded here in So Cal....currently driving about 3,000 miles a month to and from work. We sure are glad we have a prius. Still going strong after 50 thousand miles...whoo hooo!!!

desynch · 03-14-2007, 08:40 PM

Other than Mohammed being a rapist, pedophile, murderer, and his whole advocating violence thing... sure.. nothing is wrong with Muslims........... pfft

http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/

Muslims are the reason we are @ war right now. Like it or not.. but it started thousands of years ago w/ Ghengis Kahn.. Tons of history regarding the atrocities Muslims have committed, and are STILL committing in our world today. The Christians had their Crusades.. due to Muslim oppression. They killed a lot of people in the name of Christ, but that was a LONG TIME AGO. Muslims have been doing the works of that evil Mohammad bastard for thousands of years.

Of course, some liberal will say "but .. but bbb bu bbut the crusades! Christians are bad too!" ..

To them, I say, pickup a history book.

Alric · 03-14-2007, 09:01 PM

I would also like to recommend "Misquoting Jesus" by Bart B. Ehrman. Its a popular book about how the bible is a human construct that has changed through the ages.

For example the following passages of the bible are in NONE of the earliest copies or fragments we have of the bible.

The doctrine of the trinity

The "cast the first stone" story

The entire resurrection story!!

And others. I simply can not see how belief in the inerrancy of the bible can be sustained.

Cheers!

airportkid · 03-14-2007, 09:03 PM

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(desynch @ Mar 14 2007, 06:40 PM) [snapback]405767[/snapback]</div>

Quote:

Muslims have been doing the works of that evil Mohammad bastard for thousands of years[/b]

Perhaps so, but that ain't the question. If Allah is the one true "god", and mayhem against unbelievers is what Allah wants, who are you, or anyone else, to argue? Just because any of us personally finds Allah's enthusiasm for destruction distasteful does not in the slightest disprove "his" existence.

And it sure as hell doesn't "prove" the so called "christian" "god" (who ain't no cuddly ball of love either) exists.

Answer the question. If you can't, neither you nor Muslims believe the way you do for any rational reason, and neither of you can furnish a molecule of objective evidence to believe one way or the other.

Mark Baird
Alameda CA

desynch · 03-14-2007, 09:16 PM

Most theistic religions claim that their God is the one true God, or in some cases, multiple Gods.

There is no way to prove or disprove.

The Ancient Greeks that Zeus was the man.. The Chrisitians, they think Yahweh is the master of the Universe.. and the perverse Muslims think Mohammad, the cave dwelling rapist, is the one and only.

F8L · 03-14-2007, 09:20 PM

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(desynch @ Mar 14 2007, 07:16 PM) [snapback]405788[/snapback]</div>

Quote:

Most theistic religions claim that their God is the one true God, or in some cases, multiple Gods.

There is no way to prove or disprove.

The Ancient Greeks that Zeus was the man.. The Chrisitians, they think Yahweh is the master of the Universe.. and the perverse Muslims think Mohammad, the cave dwelling rapist, is the one and only.
[/b]

Great post!

03-14-2007, 05:53 PM	#1
burritos Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: California Posts: 3,908 My Car: 2006 Prius Model: Package: #1 Thanks: 1 Thanked 49 Times in 37 Posts Friends: 14	excerpted from Sam Harris's, Letter to a Christian Nation, "Why don't you lose any sleep over whether to convert to Islam? Can you prove that Allah is not the one, true God? Can you prove that the archangel Gabriel did not visit Muhammad in his cave? Of course not. But you need not prove any of these things to reject the beliefs of Muslims as absurd. The burden is upon them to prove that their beliefs about God and Muhammad are valid. They have not done this. THey cannot do this. Muslums are simply not making claims about reality that can be corroborated. This is perfectly apparent to anyone who has not anesthetised himself with the dogma of Islam. The truth is, you know exactly what it is like to be an atheist with respect to the beliefs of Muslims. Isn't it obvious that Muslims are folling themselves? Isn't it obvious that anyone who thinks that the Koran is the perfect word of the creator of the univers has not read the book critically? Isn't it obvious that the doctrine of Islam represents a near-perfect barrier to honest inquiry? Yes, these things are obvious. Understand that the way you view Islam is precisely the way devout Muslims view Hristianity. And it is the way I view all religions." interesting stuff. __________________ “Men will never be free until the last king is strangled with the entrails of the last priest” Denis Diderot

03-14-2007, 08:35 PM	#5
KD6HDX Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Chino Hills,CA Posts: 229 My Car: 2005 Prius Model: Package: #6 Thanks: 0 Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts Friends: 0	My neighbor just suggested that I check out a new book by Victor J. Stenger. The title is, "GOD: the failed hypothesis - How science shows that God does not exist." Not sure if I will buy it or not. but lately I can say I have questioned my faith. This may be a sign of depression, or just some rational thought patterns emerging. After all, there has been a lot of killing in the name of God lately. Who could ever be sure if thats what he wishes, or that he is a he and not just light? Or that She is a gay whale and is pissed at the japanese for eating everything that swims. I don't get it. Where do we find the answers to lifes most puzzling questions. Christian by baptism and by faith in Christ, I have to say that religion and politics are, and always will be, a very lethal mix. On the one hand, I don't see why so many non believers get upset if believers choose to believe in something larger than themselves. It should hurt no one if we just believe and not adopt zealotry to convert those around us. As for the agnostic crowd, I also understand that there is no way to know definitively whether God exists or does not exist. For me, faith answers that question. As for the science in our world. I say this, who am I to disregard the scientific findings of Gods most intelligent creatures? KD6HDX $3.01 a gallon today for regualr unleaded here in So Cal....currently driving about 3,000 miles a month to and from work. We sure are glad we have a prius. Still going strong after 50 thousand miles...whoo hooo!!! __________________ 130,000 miles and still running strong..carpool stickers since august 2005...whoo-hoo

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03-14-2007, 06:11 PM	#2
huskers Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Missouri Posts: 611 My Car: 2005 Prius Model: Package: #3 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts Friends: 0	Rational thinking !!!

03-14-2007, 07:36 PM	#3
km5er Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Charlotte, NC Posts: 50 My Car: Model: Package: Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts Friends: 0	Actually, all religion is a scam. How many folks have died because of conflicts of faith? No ..you are wrong...I do belive in god. I do not belive in religion. Religion is just mans way to explain god. If you are jewish, belive in budda, islam, baptist..or whatever both you and I believe in the same god. The difference is that I do not need a man made "religion" to feel secure in my belief. Someday.....perhaps we are going to advance to the point that one man is not going to kill or hate another man because of religion.

03-14-2007, 07:57 PM	#4
F8L Collecting Data on Nature Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Sacramento, CA. Posts: 6,380 My Car: 2005 Prius Model: Package: #4 Thanks: 84 Thanked 395 Times in 259 Posts Friends: 36	The God Delusion is another example of rational thinking.

03-14-2007, 08:40 PM	#6
desynch Die-Hard Conservative Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Lakehouse Posts: 607 My Car: 2007 Prius Model: Package: #3 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts Friends: 0	Other than Mohammed being a rapist, pedophile, murderer, and his whole advocating violence thing... sure.. nothing is wrong with Muslims........... pfft http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/ Muslims are the reason we are @ war right now. Like it or not.. but it started thousands of years ago w/ Ghengis Kahn.. Tons of history regarding the atrocities Muslims have committed, and are STILL committing in our world today. The Christians had their Crusades.. due to Muslim oppression. They killed a lot of people in the name of Christ, but that was a LONG TIME AGO. Muslims have been doing the works of that evil Mohammad bastard for thousands of years. Of course, some liberal will say "but .. but bbb bu bbut the crusades! Christians are bad too!" .. To them, I say, pickup a history book.

03-14-2007, 09:01 PM	#7
Alric Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 1,526 My Car: 2007 Prius Model: Package: #8 Thanks: 7 Thanked 86 Times in 55 Posts Friends: 0	I would also like to recommend "Misquoting Jesus" by Bart B. Ehrman. Its a popular book about how the bible is a human construct that has changed through the ages. For example the following passages of the bible are in NONE of the earliest copies or fragments we have of the bible. The doctrine of the trinity The "cast the first stone" story The entire resurrection story!! And others. I simply can not see how belief in the inerrancy of the bible can be sustained. Cheers!

03-14-2007, 09:16 PM	#9
desynch Die-Hard Conservative Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Lakehouse Posts: 607 My Car: 2007 Prius Model: Package: #3 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts Friends: 0	Most theistic religions claim that their God is the one true God, or in some cases, multiple Gods. There is no way to prove or disprove. The Ancient Greeks that Zeus was the man.. The Chrisitians, they think Yahweh is the master of the Universe.. and the perverse Muslims think Mohammad, the cave dwelling rapist, is the one and only.