Check engine light - below 0°

[strongp]

It has been cold here. The low two nights ago was -22° F. When I got in the Prius it said it was 10° from being in the garage. The high was +2°F. When I got in to go home, it was running really rough. I stopped at a stoplight and shifted to neutral and the roughness disappeared although I could hear the engine still running.

I put it in drive and it was very rough again until I got above about 10 mph and it smoothed out. Then, accelerating, it got rough again. It seemed to smooth out as the engine warmed up but I was going faster which seemed to make it better anyway.

Last night was -10°F. I got in this morning, started the car and as I started to back out of the driveway, the red warning triangle and check engine light came on.

It is a three hour drive to the nearest dealer (Denver) and wonder how critical it is for me to have it checked. I have a meeting tomorrow night that is 90 miles away and am hesitant to drive that far as this is a new situation for me. I have a meeting in Denver in 2.5 weeks but don't know if it can wait that long.

Any help would be appreciated.

2006 Prius
8000 miles
last oil change at 4500 miles

[RBW111]

Damn, that IS cold!!!!! I would at least call the dealer and talk to their Prius tech before driving another inch.

[jjf]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Strong @ Jan 16 2007, 01:06 PM) [snapback]376375[/snapback]</div>

2006 Prius
8000 miles
last oil change at 4500 miles
[/b]

It may just be time for an oil change. I hear synthetic oil does better when starting in cold weather than regular oil.

[ScottY]

First of all, try not to put in gear N for that long. The HV battery will not be charged when it's in N gear.

Have you look into radiator block, and engine block heater? Those should help a lot in cold weather.

If you get the red triangle warning, try to see if the dealer will tow it in for you. You are still under warranty, and these cost should be covered.

Good luck!

[jayman]

Well, we got down to -34 F overnight, so I know what cold feels like. I have a condo with heated underground parking, so I don't have to worry about frozen parts or frozen me.

The few times I've been at a restaurant or mall 2-4 hours at temps of -30 F or colder, I've never had any startup issues. My first winter I used Mobil 1 0W-30, I'm now running Mobil 1 0W-20 as a "winter" oil.

Got to thinking about extreme cold and that motor. It has Variable Valve Timing. If the regular 5W-30 is thick enough, that would probably effect the VVT operation. I had my dealer no name bulk mystery 5W-30 tested and it was real crap.

Assuming full warranty in effect, make the dealer fix your car. Find out why it's running poorly in cold weather, what codes they get now that the Triangle Of Doom is on. As long as the Triangle Of Doom is on, do NOT drive the car at all.

True enough, with a Prius you may freeze your pointy bits off without a winter front covering the grille, but I've never heard of any unusual difficulties with starting/running in extreme cold temps. When you consider the 208 volt NiMH traction battery actually starts the motor, it should be one of the most reliable cold weather cars around.

BTW quite a few dead cars around this morning. I love how when a car quits, the person just abandons the thing in the middle of the road and walks away. I feel like setting it on fire to at least warn other drivers to go around it.

[jayman]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(JayGoldstein @ Jan 17 2007, 12:24 PM) [snapback]376812[/snapback]</div>

1) The defroster blower squeals for a few seconds when first turned on.[/b]

Almost every HVAC blower will do that. They use sleeve bushings and they howl when very cold.


<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(JayGoldstein @ Jan 17 2007, 12:24 PM) [snapback]376812[/snapback]</div>

2) I have the headlights on "Auto." When I reached my destination after a short drive, the headlights did not shut off. I had to manually turn the knob to "Off" and then back to "Auto". This happened a couple of times during the cold snap.[/b]

Never had that happen. Hope a relay isn't sticking.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(JayGoldstein @ Jan 17 2007, 12:24 PM) [snapback]376812[/snapback]</div>

3) The hood latch popped open when I hit a bump. After I closed it, the hood has stayed closed.[/b]

Also never had that happen, but I've heard of it happening in other cars. The extreme temp changes, metal expands and contracts, etc.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(JayGoldstein @ Jan 17 2007, 12:24 PM) [snapback]376812[/snapback]</div>

4) Until the engine is thoroughly warmed up, full-throttle acceleration can result in extreme surging. I encountered this twice: the first time I was going about 80 km/h, and the second time when I was going about 90 km/h.[/b]

Most cars don't like to reamed like that when cold. I was taught to gently accelerate with a cold motor, especially in temps of -30 C and colder.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(JayGoldstein @ Jan 17 2007, 12:24 PM) [snapback]376812[/snapback]</div>

This morning, it was a balmy -12C (10F) with wind chill of only -24C (-11F), and everything was back to normal.
[/b]

Even at those temps I'm happy to have heated parking!

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Strong @ Jan 17 2007, 02:17 PM) [snapback]376954[/snapback]</div>

When it happened I had turned off the car and started it again a few times to see if the warning lights would cycle off. At the end of the day yesterday, the triangle went off when started and last night the check engine light was off also.[/b]

So did you retrieve the diagnostic codes? Depending on the nature of the problem, after a few "normal" driving cycles, the diagnostic codes could be erased/overwritten and you'd lose this valuable insight into what happened to your Prius

If convenient, try to arrange for a Toyota dealer to check for and retrieve the codes. A basic OBD scanner probably will not work, you'll need the Toyota Diagnostic Tester with CANBus dongle.

[donee]

Hi Strong,

You might have water in the gas. Any little bit of water in the gas will freeze up an injector. Try refilling at a different gas station, and/or adding some "Heat" gas line dryer to the fuel. I had some rough running when I filled up at a poorly maintained Mobil station (only one with an available lane) back during our cold snap in early December. Refueling at a Shell resolved the issue. Although its 6 degrees here now, and I will see what happens this morning. First time its been below 10 since first week of December. Car ran fine at 15 F yesterday morning.

The car runs fine in neutral as there is no load, and a partially frozen injector orifice can supply enough gas. During accelleration there is greatest demand, and the frozen orifices cannot supply enough gas, and the car runs too lean. At cruise, the engine is warmer, and the ice melts on the injectors.

[eagle33199]

My two cents: Don't drive it another inch until the problem is resolved. While the best case scenario is good (it's really nothing, the warnings go away and you live happily ever after with the car at your side), the worst case is bad - you're 45 minutes out on your drive, in the middle of nowhere, and the car won't run. it's -30 degrees outside, and you don't know what to do. a few days later, a grieving parent, widow, or child gets on Prius chat and curses us and the Prius out.

Don't risk it. drive another car.

[JayGoldstein]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(jayman @ Jan 16 2007, 07:51 PM) [snapback]376579[/snapback]</div>

Well, we got down to -34 F overnight, so I know what cold feels like.
True enough, with a Prius you may freeze your pointy bits off without a winter front covering the grille, but I've never heard of any unusual difficulties with starting/running in extreme cold temps. [/b]

I've just been through the same cold spell Jayman mentioned. My Prius is parked outside, under a carport, and the MFD showed -29C (-20F) when I started the car a couple of days ago. With the combination of a block heater and the HV battery, the ICE started instantaneously. I did notice a few adverse effects of such extreme cold:

1) The defroster blower squeals for a few seconds when first turned on.
2) I have the headlights on "Auto." When I reached my destination after a short drive, the headlights did not shut off. I had to manually turn the knob to "Off" and then back to "Auto". This happened a couple of times during the cold snap.
3) The hood latch popped open when I hit a bump. After I closed it, the hood has stayed closed.
4) Until the engine is thoroughly warmed up, full-throttle acceleration can result in extreme surging. I encountered this twice: the first time I was going about 80 km/h, and the second time when I was going about 90 km/h. This not only is very disconcerting, but it could be a safety issue when when you are trying to merge with traffic or pass someone. I've mentioned the surging to my dealer, and they were going to see if Toyota Canada had gotten any other reports about it.

This morning, it was a balmy -12C (10F) with wind chill of only -24C (-11F), and everything was back to normal.

[donee]

Hi Strong,

Car started and ran just fine from 6 F at home to 10 F near Ohare Airport. So apparently it is probably not a "Prius" problem.