Headlight problem

[jfojoe]

Well I got my $100 OEM bulb from UPS today but the thought of this bulb/computer mismatch indicated in the Bulletin caused me to think twice before installing it. I recalled my dealer who went onto his "TIS" system and did not find the service bulletin referenced earlier in this thread. So with his blessing I called Toyota and opened a case. We'll see what happens. At the end, I "need" to know that the "2006 Prius" OEM headlight bulb is the right one for my 2006 Prius before I spend the $100 (fix myself) or $500 (dealer fixes). I just can't get myself into a "multiple fixes" situation. Too much $$....jfo

[Steve G]

well I talked to Toyota and the headlight computers definitely do exist

good news is they're paying for them!

I still get stuck for the labor but I really can't complain too bad

-s

[windstrings]

I still need someone to explain that one to me...... unless they are talking about the "ballast" which all HID bulbs have, whether in a car or a handheld spotlight etc?

At any rate... as long as you are putting the same "type" bulb in, it should have no complications with the "ballast"....... on the Toyota Prius 06, it uses the D4R type....

Here is a little light reading about it.

D4R 35W 6000K HID replacement xenon bulb (made in Korea), is used in vehicles equipped with the reflector type housing. ONLY for vehicles equiped with D4R OEM (factory) HID bulbs. Our factory direct replacement D4R is a newer generation bulb, it is environment friendly and mercury free. Toyota started to equip the Pruis with D4R in 2006. They are not interchangeable with the D2R eventhough they use the same P32d base, D4R bulbs use lower voltage than D2R, you need a D4 specification ballast to use the D4R bulbs. Our D4R comes with a 6 months warranty. Shipping cost $5.75 per set, $1.85 for each extra set ( For U.S and Puerto Rico only).

Note, they say thier bulbs are "newer generation" than the OEM D4R bulbs.... if this is true, this may be the clue to the problem... those D4R bulbs we have were first generation and had internal imperfections that are not openly discussed so as to prevent a wholesale recall.

Note also, they speak about the ballast... call it computer if you wish, but all it does is provide the adequate high voltage upon initial fire-up and then lower it back down for stable running long term until you kill the light.

Knowledge is power, and it seems the more "power" the dealers and shops can keep out of the hands of the lay person, the more money they can make.

[jfojoe]

Now that site you linked is great. They're selling the OEM for around $88 each and there is pictures so I can see the diff between the D2R and D4R. Maybe today Toyota will phone me back to tell me what's up on the claim I opened yesterday...thanks for the site, learned bunch more...jfo

[windstrings]

Your welcome!...... I'm sure some wonder why I sound bitter against some of the vendors out there..... just look at the profit margin and highway robbery by comparing this site's OEM prices with phillips etc.

Phillips is either making a "killing" as they talk it about it over dinner with Exxon, or they are so pitiful at making bulbs it cost them tons more to make the same product?..... maybe they are on the same train with GM?

Sorry for getting politics involved, but it all makes sense in the master scheme as we try to figure out why we are even having problems in the first place, second.... why there is such a vast array of price differences with different vendors for the same product, thirdly... why the OEM is revered as better when its the product we are all having problems with in the first place!, and fourth.... why there is so much confusion as to whats really going on as some dealers want to sell you a new farm to fix the tractor while others simply say its a cheap 35.00 product "ebay bulb" that seems to fix the whole issue?

The darker the cloud over this issue, the more confusion and fear they can generate to gender more dependence upon their product........ why does it always come down to money that hides the truth?

Thank goodness for forums, or we would "really" be in trouble!

[bruceha_2000]

Happened again last night (HIDs on the 2004 - no extended warranty). Passenger side light went out 4 times in 13 minutes. I went to 'running lights' 3 times and full off and on once. People must have thought I was warning them about hidden state troopers or something (maybe they did speed limit for awhile ).

Went 30 more minutes without incident, then it happened twice more in 5 minutes. Fine for the final 30 minutes home. I had been driving with the lights on about 30 minutes before the first 'issue'. WTF??

[windstrings]

It seems like most of my problems were soon after I turned on my lights.... it almost acted as if the material inside could not maintain its plasma state without a little help... so after fizzling out and getting hit again with another high energy blast from the ballast, since it was already warmed up well at that point, the two combined seemed to keep it on.......
but, then like you say... there were other times when they did well until I had them on for a while... almost like they overheated or something......

I'm not sure of all the dynamics of what goes on inside one of those bulbs and I am not an expert on HID bulbs.... but many of the guys on the candlepower HID forums are.... unfortunately, they don't bounce over here too much.
But the voltage jumps to several thousand for a few seconds when the ballast first fires up, then drops to somewhere around 70 or so volts to run the light from then on.... I suspect that, its is not quite enough to keep those 1st generation bulbs kicking without an added boost along the way.....
on the other hand, I suppose its possible that prolonged heat inside the bulb could raise a resistance point enough to drop the voltage hitting the bulb.... maybe once the bulb fades out, the added boost allows it to run at the lower voltage "caused by the resistance point" for a longer while.
If the resistance point theory is right, it would be in the bulb rather than the ballast, since replacing the bulb seems to fix the issue.

I'm obviously guessing and speculating.... but its just based on my conjecture and experience... I had "two" cars acting up.. and new bulbs fixed them both and they aren't even OEM bulbs I used to replace the old ones with.

[galaxee]

if you need the tsb, download it here.
TSB-0030-08 Rev1 HID Headlight System - Diagnostic Tips

[bruceha_2000]

Originally Posted by galaxee

if you need the tsb, download it here.
TSB-0030-08 Rev1 HID Headlight System - Diagnostic Tips

Thanks for the link Galaxee.

The Intro on the TSB says troubleshooting "Low Beam Does Not Turn On (One Side)". It is specific to HIDs but is it the same problem as "Works fine for a long time, shuts off and relights when the headlight switch is turned off then immediately back on"?.

Obviously steps 2 and 3 of the 'repair' can be done for any generic 'headlight is not working properly' problem so I guess I'll have to find time this weekend to try them. Sure glad PCers have posted that you don't need to remove the bumper to get the bulbs out!!

[windstrings]

Originally Posted by bruceha_2000

The Intro on the TSB says troubleshooting "Low Beam Does Not Turn On (One Side)". It is specific to HIDs

this is whats confusing..... HID's don't have separate bulbs for low and high beams... at least they don't for the prius???

Its merely a moving part that deflects the light and chops it off the top "in low beam mode" and lets the whole beam show "for high beam".... so not sure what they mean "low beam does not turn on".... this TSB sounds like its for halogen bulbs with two filaments?.....

Anyway, its clear they are not taking any responsibility for the problem in the TSB as they say its "not applicable to warranty".

So whats the point of the TSB?.... merely to say there is a service problem and we need to fix it?

I thought service bullitins were to notify the customer of a problem thats different than the expected norm and may be dangerous or otherwise go unnoticed dealing with defects and workmanship bugs?