Shell V-Power and BP Ultimate

[molgrips]

Does anyone have any reasonable body of Prius experience as to wether or not these brands of petrol make any difference to MPG?

BP's claim is that Ultimate does, but Shell seem only to care about performance.

I know higher octane doesn't make any difference to the Prius, but these are supposedly full of advanced additives which clean your engine and/or improve combustion. It's the improving combustion thing I am interested in, since I am a tree-hugger not a penny pincher. I'd gladly pay extra for reduced emissions.

BP claim that Ultimate burns more cleanly... I may get 1 or 2 extra mpg with it but I can't really tell as there aren't any BP stations near me. There's a Shell, but their previous offering (Optimax) was only higher octane and didn't include fancy additives, so it didn't really help. Now they've got V-Power which apparently does contain fancy additives... On my first tank I'm getting 59 with a longer trip, usually I get 57 or so, but it's only been 200 miles so can't really draw any conclusions yet.

Thoughts on fancy additives please?

[brandon]

Actually, the Prius was designed to run on Octane Rating 87 (See page 318 of your owner's manual for details). Generally speaking, higher-octane fuel will contain less energy than lower-octane fuel.

From the manual:

Toyota recommends the use of gasoline
that contains detergent additives to
avoid build- up of engine deposits.
However, all gasoline sold in the U.S.
contains detergent additives to keep clean
and/or clean intake systems.[/b]

Toyota says the common additives like 15% MTBE or 10% ethanol work fine in a Prius, but don't use leaded fuel (obviously), don't use anything with an octane lower than 87, and don't use methanol additives.

Some gasoline contain an octane enhancing
additive called MMT (Methylcyclopentadienyl
Manganese Tricarbonyl).

Toyota does not recommend the use of
gasoline that contains MMT. If fuel containing
MMT is used, your emission control
system may be adversely affected.[/b]

[mikepaul]

What's the incentive to enhance only the premium fuel? Vehicles requiring premium need the extra help?

At least Chevron/Texaco puts Techron into all their fuels now...

[molgrips]

brandon - I know that the higher octane rating doesn't make any difference to the prius. Also that petrol in general contains tons of additives anyway. My point was that the mentioned products supposedly contain even better additives. I want to know if anyone's experienced better MPG with these products... I seem to be, but only a little.

[brandon]

Well, could you describe these "fancy additives?" Do any of them contain methanol or other things the Toyota engineers frown upon? That was the purpose of the post; it wasn't intended to tell you what you already know, because that wouldn't be very productive, now would it?

My inclination is that additives, used in conventional street vehicles, do very little to measurably improve fuel efficiency. Just because it may burn cleaner doesn't necessarily mean it is more efficient.

[Tempus]

This is the reason for the Top Tier Gasoline program.

For years gasoline companies have been selling premium gas as 'better' for your engine because of additive packages.

With tighter tolerances on modern engines and emissions systems, detergents are indeed an important part of gasoline these days.

The Auto Manufacturers know this, and they also know that their engines and emissions components degrade if the fuel doesn't have good detergent properties.

They tried to get the EPA or DOT to mandate minimum fuel additive packages for all grades, but got no response, so they started their own program.

To be in the Top Tier program, the gasoline vendor must certify that every grade of gasoline they sell has Auto Manufacturer approved additive packages with minimums for detergency and other specs.

TOP TIER Detergent Gasoline is a recently established new standard for gasoline performance. Four of the world's top automakers, BMW, General Motors, Honda, and Toyota recognize that the current EPA minimum detergent requirements do not go far enough to ensure optimal engine performance.

Since the minimum additive performance standards were first established by EPA in 1995, most gasoline marketers have actually reduced the concentration level of detergent additive in their gasoline by up to 50%. As a result, the ability of a vehicle to maintain stringent Tier 2 emission standards have been hampered, leading to engine deposits which can have a big impact on in-use emissions and driver satisfaction.

These automakers have raised the bar. TOP TIER Detergent Gasoline help drivers avoid lower quality gasoline which can leave deposits on critical engine parts, which reduces engine performance. That’s something both drivers and automakers want to avoid.

The gasoline companies who have certified their fuels (every grade in every station) are:

QuikTrip
Chevron
Conoco
Phillips
76
Shell
Entec Stations
MFA Oil Company
Kwik Trip/Kwik Star
The Somerset Refinery, Inc.
Chevron-Canada
Aloha Petroleum
Tri-Par Oil Company
Shell-Canada

Shell is a member, so you can be sure any grade you buy there is good.

Chevron is also, but note that they haven't gotten all the Texaco stations set up yet, so Texaco is not certified. They have announced that they are going to be soon.

BP apparently hasn't decided yet.

There was another thread on here about buying the most expensive gas you can find.

I think everyone would be better served if instead, people used the power of the purse to support gasoline that is the appropriate grade for the vehicle, but still keeps your emissions down.

[GreenSpeed]

Wow i didn't know that, thought it was some marketing strategy to make you put up with the more expensive gas prices. Chevron's my fav.. and Shell

[Tideland Prius]

Looks like I gotta switch to Chevron and see how my tank does lol. I'm using Esso (Exxon-Mobil??). I know Chevron was top-tier but the thing is that they don't have any electronic pass which means I'll have to carry cash to the station to refuel rather than use the pass which is always hooked to my wallet's keyring.

molgrips, have you watched Fifth Gear recently? Jon Bentley did a test using BP Ultimate, Shell Optimax and some supermarket grade.

[molgrips]

molgrips, have you watched Fifth Gear recently? Jon Bentley did a test using BP Ultimate, Shell Optimax and some supermarket grade.[/b]

No.. Damn, I missed that! Will look for evidence online, cheers

[molgrips]

http://fifthgear.five.tv/jsp/5gmain.jsp?ln...=143&pageid=272

Interesting. Doesn't mention FE though, but wouldn't an increase in HP directly correspond to an increase in FE if driven at the same kind of speeds? Maybe...