Gasoline Quality Requirements for Prius

[FIESTA]

We picked up our Prius yesterday - a nice birthday surprise for me.

During the delivery presentation the salesman mentioned that regular gasoline could be used but recommended we do not use Arco, Safeway, Costco or similar products because they contained contaminants that would shorten engine life.

Over 50 years of driving and owning cars I have always used the cheapest gas available consistent with octane requirements. During our working years we kept each of our cars about 10 years and then gave or sold them to family or friends. Although they were high mileage (120k - 150k) they were happy to get them because they knew we had looked after them. Of course we had our fair share of car repairs but never any that involved premature engine wear.

I have reviewed pages 318 and 319 of the User's Manual and am no wiser as to which brands of gas fall within and outside Toyota's recommendations. A search of the forums did not yield any relevant answers.

We all have opinions but does anyone have factual data that supports the salesman's contention or has anyone done the research to connect US brands with the Toyota recommendations?

[Frank Hudon]

Google Top Tier Gasoline and read or do a search here on PC and put Top Tier in the search box, about a year and a half ago there were pages of threads on it. I personally use Chevron but Esso (Imperial Oil) ((Exxon)) gas gives mileage as good as Chevron, it's just I've had a Chevron card since 1973 and it's close to home.

[moolman]

It's BS, the difference is minimal if that. That's why you used the cheapest gas and it doesn't harm the car. Gas companies do have their own detergents but all gasoline has detergents, Techron, ProPower it all does the same thing.

If anybody thinks that using Arco/Costco/Sam's Club gas hurts your car, show some proof. Don't you think there would be huge lawsuits and the competition would be all over it.

Arco gas is ProTech, just because it's cheaper don't bash it, it's their marketing policy that makes it cheaper.

Did you know that sometimes gas companies trade gasoline among themselves when they have a shortage? It's all the same that's why.

Alex

[jbarnhart]

What moolman says...

There are only a few refineries in any given place and you will find that all the gas companies buy from the local refiners and add their own "packages" of additives. Don't worry about Costco, et. al. gas. It's perfectly OK to run in your Prius.

I personally don't get gas at Costco because I'm not willing to wait in line just to save a few cents a gallon! But that's just me...

[SomervillePrius]

What other have said... it's ALL the same from the cheapest corner outlet to the flashiest station. The difference is only marketing hype... so support whomever you feel comfortable with... I like to support local mom and pop stores (as long as I can fill-up myself).

[jayman]

I would worry more about additives used in other countries. For example, thanks to Ethyl Corp pulling a NAFTA backhand, the metallic additive MMT is forced into Canadian gasoline.

MMT (Methylcyclopentadienyl Manganese Tricarbonyl) is a metallic additive used to boost octane rating and to help prevent intake valve recession in older vehicles designed to run on leaded (Tetraethyl Lead) gasoline.

My 2000 GMC Sierra owner manual, and my Prius owner manual, warns of using gasoline containing MMT. Apparently, the MMT will shorten the life of the O2 sensors and catalytic converters, and the emissions can be toxic.

There were some good documentaries on CBC about the dangers of MMT in gasoline, but Ethyl Corp was able to defeat all the health concerns by pulling a NAFTA legal challenge.

Ironically, although MMT is allowed by the EPA - in *much* lower treat levels than in Canada - states with California Emissions requirements can ban it. And the ACEA WWFC (World Wide Fuel Charter) also bans MMT in gasoline.

Legally, gasoline sold in the U.S. must meet certain minimum detergency and emissions requirements, blended further for local emissions and climatic conditions. I don't worry about stopping at cheaper stations in the U.S.

I would worry about getting fuel from a small station with infrequent use. More than likely, the fuel has been sitting there a long time, and could be contaminated or stale.

[SomervillePrius]

Originally posted by jayman@Feb 9 2006, 11:30 AM
I would worry about getting fuel from a small station with infrequent use. More than likely, the fuel has been sitting there a long time, and could be contaminated or stale.

[snapback]206307[/snapback]

In a country where even single people have the need to drive a light tractor (sorry I mean truck) very little gas sits a long time at the station... but, yeah... I hear you... If we all drove FE cars no larger then what we really need then it would become a problem

[jayman]

Originally posted by SomervillePrius@Feb 9 2006, 10:34 AM
In a country where even single people have the need to drive a light tractor (sorry I mean truck) very little gas sits a long time at the station... but, yeah... I hear you... If we all drove FE cars no larger then what we really need then it would become a problem

[snapback]206313[/snapback]

I brought it up as that issue happened to a co-worker of mine last winter here in Winnipeg. He bought a new 2004 VW Golf TDI, and there is a *very* small and kind of nasty service station less than half a block from the apartment he lives in.

He thought "fuel is fuel" and it was *very* convenient to pop in every 2 weeks or so and fill up his Golf. That's when the trouble started.

First, it became *very* hard to start at -40, even plugged in. Up to that point, it would usually instantly start. Then it started to hitch and buck in traffic, and would sometimes stall at lights. Finally, one morning at -40 it refused to start, so he urgently called me at my condo and asked for a ride. It was less than a 5 minute detour for me, so I agreed.

He had his Golf towed to the dealer he purchased it from, St. James VW/Audi. The car was ready to go in a couple of days: they had to change the filters, drain the tank, and refill with fresh diesel. Apparently, the filters were clogged with wax and dirt/water.

I have some experience with diesel equipment, so after I dropped him off at the dealer, he followed me out to a Petro Canada truck stop just east of the Floodway on the Trans Canada. About a 12 minute drive from his apartment. I told him to only buy diesel from large truck stops, where he could have a good chance of getting fresh fuel from a high volume station, where it would be properly blended for the climate.

True, last winter was a brutal one here in Winnipeg, with many -40 nights, but the poor quality fuel he used in his Golf almost ruined it. And according to other tenants in his apartment building, they have had issues with the gasoline from that service station too. My co-worker with that Golf has never had problems since.

That may be an extreme example, but it stands to reason that some smaller out-of-the-way service stations may have had the fuel sitting there a long time. A lot of those old underground tanks are in tough shape, at the very least there is water/dirt contamination.

[Frank Hudon]

Sept. 26 21686 792.6 36.7 4.63 $40.15 Delta +24

Oct.12 22227 540.3 32.94 6.09 $33.76 Burnaby +10 Lousy Shell gas

Nov.13 22789 562.5 27.81 5.2 $25.00 Burnaby +7

brand of gas doesn't make any mileage difference, if find that hard to believe. The first line is the 42'nd tank of gas in the car which was Cheveron brand 4.63 liter per hundred kilometres=50.8 mpg US
6.09=38.6
5.2=45.2
I've totally given up trying to get good mileage from Shell, Arco, Mohawk and most of the cheap stations. In the wifes car she used to use Mohawk and it was costing her about 2 miles to the gallon. Spend your money as you see fit but run a spread sheet so you can prove it to yourself.

[SomervillePrius]

I don't understand how you can compare FE this way! There is simply too many varients!

A car gets different FE tank to tank! Look at the data over at greenhybrid.com as a reference. Big factors are of course how many long/short trips you do but the temperature makes a big difference as well and the drop you are seeing could simply be the temperature getting colder (as your good tank was in september).

So no, I don't see how 3 "random" tanks of gas proves anything. If you used 1 gas station for several tanks and then (the next year) used another one for the same period then maybe you could tell if there was a difference