My Prius needs a battery, Toyota denies warranty due to EV button

naterprius

donee, I happened to be driving by the dealer when the engine quit. I didn't let it get down very low. Hard to say, I think maybe my battery was bad from the beginning.

Going down to one bar and having the fan run happens whenever the battery is hot or you are climbing a mountain. Having it happen all the time is a problem.

Trading the EV button for a battery was a small price to pay at a personal level, but a huge price to pay in the grand scheme of things.

Nate

Cheap!

This is all so very silly. Yes the button is not in the U.S. cars and we all know why. It has everything to do with emissions and nothing to do with the battery. If you think for a moment that Toyota would have a leg to stand on if they denied a battery warranty claim based an installed EV button, then you are fooling yourself.

I can see it now, a Toyota official is on the stand under oath.

“Sir, let me ask you, is the Prius battery different in any way from the European, Canadian, or Asian market Prius that your company sells?”

“No.”

“Could you repeat that for me louder so that everyone in the courtroom can hear?”

“I said, NO!”

“Now it is my understanding that you keep all the programming in the car the allows this function to exist in the U.S. Prius however without the button to activate it, and that no other changes have been make to the system that Toyota has designed and assembled. Is this true?”

“Yes.”

“If fact you mean to tell me that in all of the millions of Prius you have produced throughout the world that everyone with the EV button is not different in design or electronically then the U.S. Prius except for a little button the only puts a small voltage to ground.”

“Yes.”

“Then I just have one more question for you Sir. How In fact did my client who used a button designed and sold by Toyota in other countries, installed properly per Toyota’s specifications, in a car that is electronically identical, that uses an identical battery, knowing that thousands of Americans have done this same install and have run there cars for years with no problems, HOW SIR, IS THIS ONE FAULTY BATERY OUT OF THOUSAND OF OTHER CARS WITH THE SAME BUTTON DAMAGED BY YOUR BUTTON?”

“I take the 5th.”

“And, I rest my case.”

The whole point here is that we are not out to get Toyota. We love the car and we know they could not put the button in because of our crazy laws. I along will many others will keep putting in the EV button and Toyota knows it. Now if someone installs it wrong I would not expect Toyota to cover that, but come on how stupid do you have to be. It is just one wire to ground that costs less then a dollar to do. If you want to get fancy you can buy the real button like me. You are crazy if you think for one moment you would have to be rich to take this to court because any trial layer would jump at the chance to take this case and they would know they would win it. It would be a feather in their cap to have a win against a big global corporation.

Now all things being equal you can’t have Toyota say yeah go ahead and do it, or they would face repercussions from our government that you can bet our domestic automakers would press to be enforced. Long story short is that Toyota made a great car that works and keeps on working. They can’t control the fact that one battery out of what was it, 40,000 went bad, and at the same time they can’t back the EV button. I think there corporate office was brilliant. They honored the warranty that kept them out of a court case they could not win, and at the same time by requiring the removal of the EV button honored the crazy U.S. laws. Everybody’s happy and they saved face.

You don’t really think that they did not know you would put the button back ten minuets after you got the car back, did you?

Toyota you’ve got one great car here and I love it. Yes if I do something crazy with my car and I damage the battery I know I will have to pay for it. At the same time we all know you can’t force the battery below its standard specification using the EV button because if the State of Charge is too low you will get the “Can not enter EV mode now” sign.

The button is there because it works and does not damage the battery. The programming won’t let it.

__________________
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naterprius

Cheap, the button went to Hybrids Plus in Boulder, a PHEV conversion company.

I'll get my fill of EVing soon. :-)

Nate

usbseawolf2000

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(naterprius @ Jul 20 2007, 11:22 AM) [snapback]482216[/snapback]</div>Yea, it really is. 2008 Highlander hybrid now comes with an EV button duh!

KTPhil

I agree that Toyota did what was in Toyota's interest:
1) Take care of the customer to avoid a PR problem
2) Avoid precedent that might invite more claims
3) Avoid upsetting the Feds about tampering with the smog-approved system

Everyone is happy now. I don't view this as some milestone event, it's just aq process that Toyota had to go through (first a "no", then a "yes but just this once") to accomplish all three objectives.

aaf709

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Rxmxsh @ Jul 20 2007, 12:18 AM) [snapback]482103[/snapback]</div>I figure it would be possible to have a procedure set up for the mechanic for whenever you bring the Prius in for whatever reason (even oil change).

1. Look for button marked "EV"
2. With screen on anything but Energy, power up and pull CC for over 2 seconds. Does screen go to Energy?
3. Repeat step 2 by pulling on "Flash to Pass" on headlight stalk. Does screen go to Energy?
4. If "Yes" to any, check "EV" box on sheet.

Then that VIN would be put into an EV databank. You have a problem with the battery and they bring up the VIN, presto, it says you have an EV mod.

__________________
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viking31

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Sarge @ Jul 20 2007, 11:53 AM) [snapback]482236[/snapback]</div>I wouldn't be too quick to jump to that conclusion. The use of the EV condition may indeed cause some extra stress on the battery (although that seems very doubtful in Nate's case). But just because Toyota provides an EV button does not in and of itself "prove" the EV mod does no harm whatsoever to the HV battery.

Nearly every part on an automobile is built to last within a determined statistical value in order to keep the auto manufacturers costs competitive. Toyota through its marketing department may have determined the EV button was more valuable to buyers in certain countries than others and therefore would be willing to shoulder (via warranty claims or negative customer reactions) a slightly higher probability of premature failure or shortened life of the HV battery as a result of including the EV switch.

As a side note for you Nate, it seems your dealer was clueless regarding the Prius. Perhaps DH can chime in but I would assume if a customer complains about poor fuel mileage and specifically complains that they suspect the HV battery is defective, the dealer should have on hand equipment to automatically do a thorough cycle and capacity test on the Prius HV battery. Your dealer apparently did not.

Rick
#4 2006

Cheap!

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(aaf709 @ Jul 20 2007, 12:50 PM) [snapback]482323[/snapback]</div>Why not just also include all the vins from Canada and South America too that are here in the U.S. They already have the EV button? Oh that’s right; because the programming for the EV button prevents the EV button from harming the battery in the first place.

In order for the EV button to damage the OEM battery, Toyota's programming would have to be faulty in all the Prius world wide and who's fault would that be?


<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(viking31 @ Jul 20 2007, 01:03 PM) [snapback]482331[/snapback]</div>This is not the case. The only reason the EV button is not in the U.S. Prius is because of our Environmental Standards. It has now barring on whether or not the added use of the battery would cause it to fall below specification set by Toyota.

Frank Hudon

I agree with Cheap's comment on the use of the EV button, if the car won't agree to it you don't get to use it.

Allannde

I also agree wth Cheap's thinking, BUT Nate has many more resources than I do to face off with Toyota Corporate and we all saw what he did. It looks like we would do very well to take his advice.

It is not a question of who is right. It is a question of who wins when push comes to shove.