Worried about Hybrid Battery Environmental Impact

[SureValla]

I saw these anti prius comments recently and did not know how to respond

Can anyone tell me if these claims are accurate?


1. A normal car, after disposed, could be recycled. A Hybrid could be recycled too, but the battery has to be specially recycled and sent to a special Hybrid recycling facility. This seriously damages the environment

2. On top of the actual fuel consumption and CO2 emissions, the Pruis relative to a normal car is probably at least 50% more damaging to the environment in the first few years of use when manufacturing and recycling damage is included.

3. On top of the actual fuel consumption and CO2 emissions, the Pruis relative to a normal car is probably at least 50% more damaging to the environment in the first few years of use when manufacturing and recycling damage is included.
(Gordon Murray, EVO Magazine)

4. No one looks at thee facts about the environmental-nasty batteries.

example:

Sudbury Ontario

[ken1784]

Here's the 2004 Toyota Prius Green Report (life cycle assessment):
http://www.toyota.co.jp/en/k_forum/tenji/pdf/pgr_e.pdf
(you'll need to download the Japanese fonts for your PDF reader in order to read it, but the entire document is written in English.)

Ken@Japan

[hill]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(SureValla @ Jul 29 2007, 01:12 AM) [snapback]486959[/snapback]</div>

I saw these anti prius comments recently and did not know how to respond

Can anyone tell me if these claims are accurate?
1. A normal car, after disposed, could be recycled. A Hybrid could be recycled too, but the battery has to be specially recycled and sent to a special Hybrid recycling facility. This seriously damages the environment

2. On top of the actual fuel consumption and CO2 emissions, the Pruis relative to a normal car is probably at least 50% more damaging to the environment in the first few years of use when manufacturing and recycling damage is included.

3. On top of the actual fuel consumption and CO2 emissions, the Pruis relative to a normal car is probably at least 50% more damaging to the environment in the first few years of use when manufacturing and recycling damage is included.
(Gordon Murray, EVO Magazine)

4. No one looks at thee facts about the environmental-nasty batteries.

example:

Sudbury Ontario

[/b]

My God, Man, you haven't found the search tool? You ought to know a good "big oil spin" when you hear one. Moreover, the rebuttal stickey was right above your question! :P
ok, being a fellow P.C.'er ... I'll hold yoiur hand, just this once:

http://priuschat.com/Prius-Myths-and-their...als-t26909.html

enjoy, and remember, the search tool is a wonderful thing

[SureValla]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(hill @ Jul 29 2007, 01:22 AM) [snapback]486962[/snapback]</div>

My God, Man, you haven't found the search tool? You ought to know a good "big oil spin" when youi hear one. Moreover, the rebuttal stickey was right above your question! :P
ok, being a fellow P.C.'er ... I'll hold yoiur hand, just this once:

http://priuschat.com/Prius-Myths-and-their...als-t26909.html

enjoy, and remember, the search tool is a wonderful thing
[/b]

that never addresses the battery disposal...

[cwerdna]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(SureValla @ Jul 28 2007, 10:12 PM) [snapback]486959[/snapback]</div>

4. No one looks at thee facts about the environmental-nasty batteries.

example:

Sudbury Ontario
[/b]

http://www.mailonsunday.co.uk/pages/live/a...in_page_id=1770

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(SureValla @ Jul 28 2007, 10:26 PM) [snapback]486963[/snapback]</div>

that never addresses the battery disposal...
[/b]

http://www.toyota.co.jp/en/environment/rec...stem/index.html
http://www.toyota.com/about/environment/te...004/hybrid.html

See bottom of http://www.toyota.com/about/environment/te...004/hybrid.html.

[SureValla]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(cwerdna @ Jul 29 2007, 01:33 AM) [snapback]486965[/snapback]</div>

http://www.mailonsunday.co.uk/pages/live/a...in_page_id=1770
http://www.toyota.co.jp/en/environment/rec...stem/index.html
http://www.toyota.com/about/environment/te...004/hybrid.html

See bottom of http://www.toyota.com/about/environment/te...004/hybrid.html.
[/b]

amazing thanks you guys are the best

[donee]

Hi SureValla,

This is a quite old and totally debunked topic. We will probably be hearing about it for some time.

So here are the salient points one more time:

Sudburry Nickel Mine is more than 100 years old. It has been refining sulfurous nickel ore all that time.

For those un-aware of history, man landed on the moon in 1969. The moon buggy training occured previous or shortly thereafter. The Prius Design Project started in 1992. There is no way the Prius was even around when the ecological destruction was already done while the Moon Buggies were scooting around the damaged Sudbury landscape.

The source of the picture used in the article was found by PC'ers. It is available for purchase from a picture supply company, and is dated well before 1992.

INCO (the company that owns the mine) has done much since the 1970's to recover the damaged areas. In fact they have won awards for their efforts in recent decades, and actually have gotten trees to grow again in some of the areas.

Nickel is an industrial metal used in a myriad of everyday items. Stainless Steel is the main use. Next time you pick up your eating utensils, "The Mail on Sunday" would like you to think about Sudbury too. The next time you take a trip by turbine powered aircraft, think about Sudbury - turbine blade alloys are mostly nickel. The next time you do not need to replace the exhaust system in a car in 2 years - Sudbury. The list goes on and on (metal platings, cutlery, connectors, magnetic shielding...). This is probably why "The Mail on Sunday" retracted the article. Toyota's nickel purchase is less than 1 % of yearly production at Sudbury.

Unfortunately, every lazy politico wanna-be (like Rush Limbauh, George Will and college student muscle car enthusiasts - Chris Demoro) out there keeps regurgitating the faulty information from the misleading The Mail on Sunday article. Rather than fully researching the topic.


Toyota has a recycling plant for the batteries, and a $200 bounty for the scrap batteries. Does your local Household Goods store have such a program for the stainless steel eating utensils, cutlery and oven grates they sell? Does "This Old House" list a place to send those Stainless Steel kitchens they are fond of installing after they are used up?

[donee]

Hi SureValla,

The energy usage and lifetime analysis stuff comes from a marketing company - CNW Research. In recent months, the report has showed the Prius getting better and better. Allot of their assumptions are quite faulty, and if taken seriously in the 1950's, the present FWD configuration of many cars would have never been developed. As the Prius becomes more successful, the investment in developement per car gets less and less.

There are even more things wrong with the report. The link below gives a good detail of the faulty nature of report:

http://www.pacinst.org/topics/integrity_of...rsus_prius.html

[SureValla]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(donee @ Jul 29 2007, 09:37 AM) [snapback]487041[/snapback]</div>

Hi SureValla,

The energy usage and lifetime analysis stuff comes from a marketing company - CNW Research. In recent months, the report has showed the Prius getting better and better. Allot of their assumptions are quite faulty, and if taken seriously in the 1950's, the present FWD configuration of many cars would have never been developed. As the Prius becomes more successful, the investment in developement per car gets less and less.

There are even more things wrong with the report. The link below gives a good detail of the faulty nature of report:

http://www.pacinst.org/topics/integrity_of...rsus_prius.html
[/b]

all great information thanks so much for the excellent responses