Proud of my Prius Snow Performance

[victor]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(allenlux\";p=\"60074)</div>

Winter tyres are used by a high proportion of drivers around here. My understanding is that they are optimised for low temperatures, snow is a secondary issue. The rubber formulation used in winter tyres is designed to give better grip at temperatures below around 4 degC, the level at which normal tyres start to harden and lose grip.

I used to be very sceptical about all this, but the more I read about it the more sense it makes. Snow tends to be a transient thing, but low temperatures persist for months on end.

[/b]

Yes Winter tyre are a must here too. Have an accident in winter on summer tyres and you will be in deep poo poo!

I have just called my dealer as I need to get mine ordered and fitted, (they were not available last time I asked, and I was away for 3 weeks), as we had 4 inches or so of snow last night. I was quoted EURO 750 for tyres, rims and fitting. Storage of the summer tyres will be about EURO 25.

[Sufferin' Prius Envy]

Yes Winter tyre are a must here too. Have an accident in winter on summer tyres and you will be in deep poo poo!

I so like many of the German driving laws - like no passing on the right . . . but, are you saying winter tires are requried by law?

[bruceha_2000]

Note that the OEMs seem fine on the flat in snow and crud and once moving weren't a problem. It is the starts from a dead or near stop on a slope that did me in.

[KCPrius]

Here in Kansas City, we just had 12 hours of rain with the tempsat or below 32, followed by 12 hours of sleet with the temps in the mid 20's. The Prius did just as good at getting around as the biggest SUV. In fact, it gave me enough information to get me a bit scared. As I said, getting moving was not a problem. Quite easy in fact. I was going down a hill at about 28 mph and decided to test the braking...put them on and the little light that says "I know you want to stop, and I'm trying my damndest to get you stopped, but you're on ice pal" came on. The car slowed down slowly, but it was slowing down, and it tracked arrow straight. My concern was that if the light at the bottom of the hill was red, and the Hummers and Expeditions were lulled into a "the roads are fine" mentality, I would have had one of them in my back seat.

But the more I drove, the more amazing it was. Turning onto a main street, going thru some slush/ice from the snow plows, I heard a "doorbell" like sound and notice that the VSC kicked in. Got home just fine as well. The more I drive this car the more impressed I am with it.

[bruceha_2000]

I slowly slid about 50' right past my driveway Sunday night on the ice. I figured I was starting to slow with the brakes at about the right point for the conditions, but I didn't slow much. No other cars on the road so I just did some slow brake and release and let physics do the rest. Even on ice there is some friction and it wasn't thick so there were probably patches of asphalt or dirt or whatever to grab on. :-) Backed up just fine into the driveway.

Of course the driveway was a sheet of ice too so I used up the rest of my ice melter and headed to the store for more. Passed the salt truck on my way out of the neighborhood. No problem stopping at the driveway the next time! Spread the stuff on the driveway, it was 39F the next morning, so I guess it was a waste (this time).

[prius04]

My Prius surely saved me 2 to 4 grand this morning.

It was snowing heavily and up to about 5 inches with the roads erratically plowed because it's still snowing. I'm on a suburban urban street and I look ahead and about 100 yards is a car clearly with the brakes locked and the front wheels aimed away from me, but it's coming right at me. I'm doing 35 because I've felt nary a slip in this snow on my 40 minute drive to work.

I slam on my brakes and all the alarms go off for VSC and the ABS. But still we'll be hitting at about 25 MPH for each vehicle at head on unless I do something. So I aim for the 15 inches or so of snow put there by the plow on my right -- but I can't go too far without going into a ditch. The Prius moves perfectly without a hint of slippage.

I'm over as far as I can and I'm almost positive I'm going to be swiped anyway by that other car. Well at least it's a lot better than head on. But they miss me by entirely. No thud at all.

Now a new problem. I'm still doing about 20-25 MPH and if I stay in this snow bank I'll be hitting a telephone pole at maybe 10MPH. I doubt I have the traction to do it, but I swing back into my lane of traffic.

I move back into my original lane perfectly. Neither car gets hit at all. There was no one behind me, and the car behind the other driver never lost control. The car that almost hit me barely kissed the snow bank on my side of the road. He or she could easily just get back into traffic.

Wow, was I impressed. There is no doubt in my mind that any other car I've ever owned would NOT have survived that maneuver --with absolutely no slippage -- like the Prius did.

I continued on to work but then felt I should have stopped to tell that other driver to go get ABS and VSC, and if they can't do that, then LEARN TO PUMP YOUR BRAKES, which that driver clearly did not do.

And if you don't know how to pump your brakes in a skid, THEN GO HOME UNTIL APRIL!!!!



What a car!!!! This was my second impressive episode with the Prius in the snow in the last 2 weeks.

[bruceha_2000]

If you are on the brakes, even ABS, and still sliding out of control, sometimes the answer is to get OFF the brakes. They are trying to keep the tires from turning much and they don't grab the snow. Assuming it isn't glare ice, letting the tires turn will get some traction and control. I actually did this going into my driveway a few weeks ago. Sliding straight for the fence post. Way too slow for VSC to care. Foot off the brake and viola, left turn.

I'm sure that is how my neighbor ended up with a new car a couple of years ago. She said she hit the guard rail of the 1 lane bridge near our house. Brakes on, couldn't stop in time, slid right into it.

[randalla]

I've had my Dunlop Graspic DS-2 studless winter tires for about a month now. I traded the Goodyear Integrity tires with less than 2,000km on them, and had Michelin Harmony all season tires put on.

Here are my honest comments, comparing the Michelin Harmony to the Graspic's, starting with the positives:

Positives: much improved grip on ice, especially colder than -30 C, almost as good as studded tires. Better traction on hardpack snow. Much better traction in deep snow, especially over ice. Much better in deep slush. Softer riding (I'd call that a plus, maybe you wouldn't, it's subjective).

Negatives: Steering response can be numb and delayed, especially in temps over +5 C (Never dangerous though). A bit noisier than the Harmonies at highway speed, especially over 110 km/h. Somewhat lower highway fuel economy (5.3 litres per 100km vs 5.1 / 100km under the same speed and conditions).

Although I still believe that good studded winter tires have better glare ice traction, I'll be the first to admit the Graspic delivers about 2/3 of that ice traction. They are a LOT easier to live with than studded tires.

The Graspic's have a very soft and squishy tread pattern, which as mentioned is optimized for cold temp performance on ice and snow. They obviously don't make sense in a moderate climate with only the occasional snow: carry chains for those conditions.

Here, winter seems to last forever. When it dips to -30 C and stays that way for a month or two, whatever ice is at the intersection will stay there, as the salt doesn't work at that temp. So you need a tire that works at that temp.

I have mine on steel rims. True, it can be a PITA to swap tires twice a year, but it's also a PITA to rotate tires too. Since each tire set is only getting half the use, they should last twice as long.

I would like to see Tire Rack do a retest of popular all-season tires and winter tires on their skating rink. I'd even happily lend my Prius for the test, just to see what the difference is under carefully controlled conditions, not subjective posterior feel.

Jayman, I too just bought Dunlop Graspics along with steel wheels and had them installed this past Monday. So far this winter, (knock on wood) we haven't had any ice or snow in the Washington, DC area but knowing that this area doesn't handle that type of weather with much aplomb I went ahead and ordered the tires from Tire Rack.

I agree for the most part so far I've been able to tell after a week with your observations of the tires. My question has to do with tire inflation. I have been running with 40psi front and 38 rear in the Integritys so I had Goodyear (where the tires and wheels were delivered for installation) put the same amounts into the Graspics. Are other folks out there inflating their ice/snow tires similarly or are you using a different approach and if so based on what reasons?
Thanks! Randy

[jayman]

Hi Randy:

I've noticed the biggest traction gain on glare ice and in deep snow - especially deep snow OVER glare ice. Unlike all-season tires, the traction doesn't appear to become worse at frigid temps of -30 C or colder.

I was told by my Toyota dealer to follow the door jamb inflation, to keep more of the tread in contact with the road. I did try inflating them to 44F 41R (Max cold is 44psi on the Dunlop Graspic DS-2) and noticed the glare ice performance suffers. I guess Dunlop must have sent that information to dealers that install Graspic winter tires.

Still way better than all-season, but there is a difference on glare ice if you keep them at 44F 41R versus 33 F 30 R. I figure at city speeds of 60 km/h and slower, it won't hurt anything running them at factory specs.

Do you also find the steering response a bit numb? It's easy enough to get used to.

[Rick Grahn]

Gave the VSC system a real test the last two days in Chicago area...lost of snow. I am VERY impressed with the handling of the car. I tested it out on empty roads/parking lots first and then felt confident to drive in the traffic.

I normally drive 30K miles per year and this is the best handling car I've had (others were Ford Tauruses).

I am impressed.