So I figured out how to install my block heater

[Frank Hudon]

Originally posted by oly_57mpg@Dec 1 2005, 07:08 PM
OK!
The Wattmeter is connected.  It doesn't seem to matter what the engine temperature is... the EBH draws 408-412 Watts.

The ambient temperature was  0.6 C.  A DS2438 was used to capture the temperature.

Here's the Wattmeter that I used:
Smart-Watt
It was calibrated to the Radian Watt hour Standard -> %0.01 error.  The Smart-Watt is no more than 0.5% inaccurate.

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can you give us the watt hour useage for how long your timer runs. Say if your timer is set to run for 3 hours and the EBH is cycling, what is the watt hours of actual electricity consumed? thanks

[Mojo40]

Tripp or anybody

Have you run the numbers to see if the block heater is cost effective?

Since many of us Prius drivers accept a higher operating cost (i.e. self imposed tax to help the environment), another analysis might be CO2 effectiveness. In other words, will the amount of CO2 released generating the electricity to pre-heat the engine be more or less than the amount of CO2 released heating up the engine using gas?

[Frank Hudon]

Originally posted by Mojo40@Dec 1 2005, 09:18 PM
Tripp or anybody

Have you run the numbers to see if the block heater is cost effective? 

Since many of us Prius drivers accept a higher operating cost (i.e. self imposed tax to help the environment), another analysis might be CO2 effectiveness.  In other words, will the amount of CO2 released generating the electricity to pre-heat the engine be more or less than the amount of CO2 released heating up the engine using gas?

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your from Washington state and most of your electricity is generated by hydro electric generation so CO2 emissons are a non issue. If you can bump your mileage from the mid 30's to the mid 40's your reducing the emission load on the enviroment more than the elctricial generation as it runs 24/7 and they don't care. Do your part with your car. Con Ed will pollute all they want anyways. If all the block heaters in Prius cars in the us were plugging at one time the emission load would only equal on diesel electic locomotive going form the round house to the yard to hook to the line of cars. Never mind move them anywhere.

[oly_57mpg]

Originally posted by tripp+Dec 1 2005, 11:22 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(tripp @ Dec 1 2005, 11:22 PM)</div>

I attached AC power to the block heater and the Wattmeter around 16:45 PST (00:45 GMT). Here is a current reading from the Wattmeter (times are in GMT):
12/02/2005 04:14:11,411
12/02/2005 04:20:15,415
12/02/2005 04:26:19,412
12/02/2005 04:32:23,414
12/02/2005 04:38:29,416
12/02/2005 04:44:32,412
12/02/2005 04:50:41,413
12/02/2005 05:15:03,412
12/02/2005 05:21:08,405
12/02/2005 05:27:17,402
12/02/2005 05:33:20,405

It's also 0 C outside and snowing at the moment.

From the data that I have collected, it has never shut off. I don't think it will either.
I know that it has been discussed that the heater will shut off after a certain temp; but the block heater was connected the instant I arrived home and it has yet to shut off.
It's been said that it should take about 4 hours to bring the engine up to temp. However, it was drawing power even though the ICE was warm when I connected the block heater.

<!--QuoteBegin-tripp@Dec 1 2005, 11:27 PM
That smart watt device is cool. Checked out the web site. I didn't see any pricing there. What does one of those guys cost? So do you have a wireless hub or router in your garage?

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Yes, the Smart-Watt is really cool. It's cheap too! $150-200. Compare that to other Wattmeter's, like Powertek or Techtronics, that cost 50 times the amount of the Smart-watt.

I have a bit more than a hub in my garage; 7 foot 4 post rack, half full of hardware (servers, UPSs, Custom battery packs...) and the house is wired with 1 GB Ethernet and 1-wire (sensor network).

[oly_57mpg]

Originally posted by Frank Hudon@Dec 2 2005, 01:00 AM
can you give us the watt hour useage for how long your timer runs. Say if your timer is set to run for 3 hours and the EBH is cycling, what is the watt hours of actual electricity consumed? thanks

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The time between each sample is roughly 6 minutes. I do not have the block heater on a timer; it's plugged into the wattmeter and that to the wall.

Here is some current data to mull over...
Date Time (GMT), Watt hour reading, calculated watt
12/02/2005 05:15:03, 343266.5, 412
12/02/2005 05:21:08, 343307.6, 405
12/02/2005 05:27:17, 343348.8, 402
12/02/2005 05:33:20, 343389.6, 405
12/02/2005 05:39:26, 343430.5, 402
12/02/2005 05:45:29, 343471.3, 405
12/02/2005 05:51:33, 343512.0, 403
12/02/2005 05:57:44, 343553.3, 401
12/02/2005 06:03:51, 343594.8, 407

[tripp]

Originally posted by oly_57mpg@Dec 1 2005, 11:58 PM
I have a bit more than a hub in my garage; 7 foot 4 post rack, half full of hardware (servers, UPSs, Custom battery packs...) and the house is wired with 1 GB Ethernet and 1-wire (sensor network).

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Holy Sh*te, mate. I suppose you're more than just the causual user. I guess you don't have to worry about keeping all of that gear cool this time of year.

BTW, that's a great price. I don't think that I can justify it though. We typically use less then 400 kWh/month at our house so measuring the load has never been an issue. It would satisfy various curiosities about energy use however.

Frank et al., what's the the CO2 emissions for 1 kWh generated by a coal fired plant? I know that 1 gallon of gas creates 20 lbs of CO2 so I can figure out the emissions reductions. Yeah, I know that it's pretty trivial but I'm curious.

[Frank Hudon]

for what it's worth
http://www.sierraclub.org/cleanair/factsheets/power.asp

[tripp]

Originally posted by Frank Hudon@Dec 2 2005, 07:54 PM
for what it's worth
http://www.sierraclub.org/cleanair/factsheets/power.asp

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Crap!

Frank, sorry for being so lazy. If I'd gotten off my arse and just googled "CO2 Emissions per kWh Coal" I'd have answered my own question. However, there are probably other folks out there that are interested...

I dug the following up at:
http://www.eia.doe.gov/cneaf/electricity/p.../co2report.html

Note the text in bold.

Estimated emissions of CO2 produced by coal-fired generation of electricity were 1,788 million metric tons in 1999 (Table 1), 0.7 percent less than in 1998, while electricity generation from coal was 0.4 percent more than the previous year. The divergent direction of generation and emissions changes may reflect a combination of thermal efficiency improvements, changes in average fuel characteristics, and variances associated with both sampling and nonsampling errors. CO2 emissions from coal-fired electricity generation comprise nearly 80 percent of the total CO2 emissions produced by the generation of electricity in the United States, while the share of electricity generation from coal was 51.0 percent in 1999 (Table 3). Coal has the highest carbon intensity among fossil fuels, resulting in coal-fired plants having the highest output rate of CO2 per kilowatthour. The national average output rate for coal-fired electricity generation was 2.095 pounds CO2 per kilowatthour in 1999 (Table 4).

[Frank Hudon]

it's actually the mercury emissions that have got me worried.

[tripp]

Yep, those are never good. However, if the EBH is running in the early hours or the morning or at night it's probably just drawing on base load, which would be generated anyway right? So in that case there would actually be a reduction in emissions because of the gasoline savings? Am I full of it or is this correct?