So I figured out how to install my block heater

[MNPrius]

Thanks Frank! Q: If your 15year old son calls you a nerd...are you also a geek?

Anyway - I'll have to get used to the car first before I think about tinkering with it...but the car is pretty "groovy" so far - already put 60 miles on it

[Frank Hudon]

Originally posted by MNPrius@Oct 20 2005, 08:02 PM
Thanks Frank!  Q: If your 15year old son calls you a nerd...are you also a geek?

Anyway - I'll have to get used to the car first before I think about tinkering with it...but the car is pretty "groovy" so far - already put 60 miles on it 

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Groovy.......... it's been years since I've heard that expression!

[jayman]

Originally posted by DanMan32@Oct 20 2005, 12:15 PM
Measuring a resistive heater when cold will always be less than when it's hot.  Measuring it when it's cold is unreliable. 

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Dan:

Technically correct, but in the real world we still measure cold.

I have a lot of industrial process control experience, and have had the misfortune to have to troubleshoot large 3-phase industrial electric resistance heaters. The application is a vaporizer to vaporize liquid CO2 for use in an industrial process.

The resistance heaters are plates that are sandwiched together. The failure of a plate can either cause the failure of an entire vaporizer - if series wired - or poor process performance.

To measure actual operating current and voltage, I let the MCC (Motor Control Center) worry about that. My job is way easier since most of my clients switched to the Rockwell/Allen-Bradley IntelliCenter MCC.

The IntelliCenter MCC uses DeviceNet to network all the 3-phase starters and overload relays, so no more individual wire runs from the control room to the MCC. The E3 solid state relay reports on: overload, underload, stall, jam, motor thermister output, phase angles, per-phase current RMS, voltage per-phase, etc.

Most of the larger +60 KW vaporizers are sequenced with 2-4 stages of heating. That prevents tripping overload relays in startup and also prolongs the life of the vaporizer elements.

It would be very dangerous to take the protective covers off a 3-phase industrial vaporizer during operation. The surface of the heating plates can become very hot, there is a chance for accidently touching a live wire spade, a safety valve could jam and expose you to a blowout, etc.

Actually it's strict company policy to NOT work on those units "live." I have to make sure the technicians know that too, wait until the thing is cold and power is locked out before checking the heater plates. A quick and simple resistance check is used for good/bad.

I have to drive out to the hobby farm this weekend, so what I can do is measure the heater resistance at the plug as soon as I pull the car into the garage. I think I can "borrow" the AEMC Power Quality Analyzer from work to be assured of accurate resistance values.

jay

[efusco]

HOLY CRAP!!! What a PITA that was!

I had all these big plans of doing a nice write up on the procedure to install the block heater complete with photos and short cuts. Forget it.

First of all, getting the car jacked up, of all things, ended up being an obstacle. I hadn't had to jack up the front end before so I double checked the handy/dandy owners manual for the proper jack point. It shows right b/w the front wheels in the center. My hydrolic floor jack would hardly even reach there due to clearance, and even when I did get it there there was no clearance to pump it up. On to "Plan B"--get the Prius Jack--what a piece of crap that is. I challenge you to jack your car up with that little thing in the front center position with that tiny "handle" they give you for that process. On to "Plan C"--got my hydrolic jack again and jacked up using the frame just behind the passenger side front wheel...was sure to put blocks on the back tire.

Ok, got my parts, climbed under the car thinking about whether I'd still be able to breath with my chest compressed all but 4.5 inches if/when the car falls off the jack....back to business at hand...
Start looking. Ok, I see the ICE, I see what must be on of the MGs. I see about a 3" hole to reach through to reach the back driver side of the engine block and start feeling around....nothing feels like what I expected for a long time...I thought the part would insert from the rear toward the front of the car. Nope, it goes in from the driver's side of the block and pushes toward the passenger side of the block. Found the hole!

Ok, so I'm smarter than these other guys who whined about how hard it was to get the cord plugged into the core after inserting the core...I'll just plug it in before inserting so I can smuggly show them just how easy this really is....

Nope, there's about 4mm too little clearance to do it that way...you just can't line the core up enough to get it to slide in (Damn Toyota engineers!). Smug attitude out the door. Ok unplug, insert core.....argh!!! forgot the lube.

Crawl back out, get lube, lube up, insert gizzy. Now try to plug in the cord...now what was the orientation again?? Is that long prong at the point of the triangle.... can't remember, can't tell by feel and the angle is screwy anyway.

Pulled the core, checked the orientation, decided it might be easier to drop the cord down from above for later purposes and to put the plug in the proper orientation.

Climb out, drop cord, crawl back under, too far down, crawl out, pull cord back, crawl back under, reinsert core, try to plug, no luck, WTF!!!! Crawl out, check instructions...hmmm, that clip was supposed to click and catch...don't remember a click and catch, and that'll change the orientation.

Crawl under, figure out how the core REALLY goes in, get the click! Whew. Still gotta get the wire plugged. Check for long prong, know where that goes on plug, try to plug...maybe a partial catch...falls off....errrrrr.

Try again, decent catch, but it's still not flush. PUSH (now positive the car will crash down on me), nothing. PUSH...nada. Change hands....knock the plug out...#$^*@$#^&^. Back to right hand, OK catch but still not flush...PUSH, PUSH, PUSH....wait, I didn't feel anything move, but it feels flush, I think it really is flush. No idea how, didn't do anything different, didn't feel it move, but to heck with it, it feels right and I'm moving on.

I pulled that black plastic cover off the front area over the radiator and grill. I strapped the cord for the heater to a couple of convenient pipes and ran the wire across the front of the ICE along the top of the radiator, dropped it down and used a coat hanger to snag it through the bottom grill (where the fog lamps are) and pulled it through. I zip tied it with just a couple inches sticking out then pushed the plug b/w a couple of the grill 'fins' so it doesn't flop around when not in use but is still accessible without opening the hood.

While I had the hood up I cut up an old silver/foam windshield shade and slid a piece of that over the radiator. There's a bar right in front of the radiator in the center that has just enough of a gap that the single piece slid right in there close to the radiator and held it quite nicely. That took a few attempts, but it looks like it should work well.

I took some more of that same windshield thingy and cut it to the shape of the hood (leaving a few inches from each edge) and stapled it to the insulator that was already on there. I'm not convinced that little thing is going to do much, but you never know and it does cover a little more space than what the car came with.

Winterization complete, just hope I don't overheat anything with some of the warmer days yet remaining before cold weather really hits.

[skruse]

Thank you for the heads up on Toyota Depot and block heaters - $57.80

http://www.toyotadepot.com/product_info.ph...products_id/144

I had a block heater on my 4Runner. The block heater made a significant difference in ambient air temperatures down to -50°C.

I now live in a more moderate climate and would like to retain the good fuel economy I'm earning. I seem to recall a post that showed photographs of block heater Prius installation. Are the photographs still accessible?

[tomdeimos]

Evan,

Great to hear you got it in without getting your arm stuck in the hole! I guess Toyota goofed on a lot of things for cold climate use. The directions make it look so simple on the Matrix.

And How did you tell it was flush? I just pushed with the one finger that could reach till it wouldn't move and it felt sturdy, but I have no idea if it is really on good enough! I'll find out when it falls off I guess.

I lucked out a bit by figuring the plug on first as the directions said to do wouldn't work, so I checked the orientation ahead. So I am very glad to hear it really doesn't fit that way! I wasn't sure, and if it worked it would have eliminated the flush issue..

I used my ramps, which were fine for getting under the car and safer than a jack, but too low to fit under on my creeper so that was a pain getting under.

I have seen "low clearance" garage jacks on the web that look like they might work for the jack point, but my old one doesn't and I have not invested in one of those low ones yet.

My radiator top cover I'm just leaving off for the winter this year, I put it on and off last year to make adjustments in the blockage!

I guess this is why the dealers here don't stock block heaters for us and we have to get them from Canada! And the directions look so simple, I didn't notice they weren'f for a Prius the first time I read them.

[efusco]

I determined it was flush by feel. I could tell there was a gap b/w the rubber plug and the base of the core, and then there wasn't so I knew it was as far as it would go.

Prob. not a bad idea leaving that plastic cover off...If I have to adjust anything I'll just leave it off. I don' t think my air block will move much though since it's pretty much pinned b/w the radiator and that support bar.

As I got jabbering on I meant to make the point to any casual observers out there that I do NOT consider this an easy do-it-yourself mod. It would be much easier up on a lift, with a second pair of hands above and to grab stuff. You can expect to get dirty, get scrapes, and get frustrated trying to get stuff connected. To me, getting that dang plug on was sorta like installing my XM radio by just reaching behind the head-unit to plug in by feel....but with a 3000lb car looming over you as you lay on a dirty garage floor on your back with your fingers covered in that slippery lubricant!

I think people used to working with engines will be fine with this...those with manicured nails beware!

[efusco]

WOW, that little bugger really works!

I plugged it in about 2 hours ago I guess, more or less just to see if it actually works after all the effort to get it installed.

Just went out to see if I could detect any change in the temperture of the ICE (it was cold/unused for at least 5 hours when I installed the block heater). I could feel the engine warmth the second I opened the hood!! Touching the engine block it felt like the ICE had been run in the past hour. Impressive indeed.

I think it will be interesting to see what my mpg does this winter. I now have 2 prior winters to compare to (they were both pretty mild winters, but I did much better my second winter since I had learned better how to drive the car by then as it was pretty new during the first winter). I think the real impact will show on the short (10 minute) trips I have to take my kids to school and run to the store and such. Probably not as big of an impact on my usual commute. I bet the first 5 minute bars look more like summer than winter. I don't know that the average mpg on longer commutes will be much affected.

[jayman]

Originally posted by DanMan32@Oct 20 2005, 12:15 PM
Measuring a resistive heater when cold will always be less than when it's hot.  Measuring it when it's cold is unreliable. 

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Dan:

I went out to the hobby farm this weekend to change the oil and check up on the place. After the 2.5 hour drive, I parked in the detached garage, where the inside temp was around +20C. I left the car for 10 minutes to "hot soak" while I went into the house to turn the water on, change clothes, etc.

I couldn't "borrow" the new AEMC three phase power quality analyzer we recently got at work, it's already at a jobsite. It provides very accurate resistance readings. I did get a chance to "borrow" a new factory-calibrated Fluke 189 DMM.

After I went back to my detached garage, I carefully cleaned off the block heater plug with a Dremel, then hooked up the 189. It clamed 34.6 ohms. I then did my oil sample with the Caterpillar Oil Sample Pump, and changed the oil to Mobil 1 0W-20 for winter.

Next morning, I checked the block heater resistance again: 35.9 ohms. For the purpose of calculating block heater power and current draw, the difference in readings is insignificant. I'm fairly confident in the values, as we only get Calibrated field instruments, and any instrument 12 months or older is sent off for recalibration.

Note: The block heater resistence values are academic. They include the block heater cord, which could vary widely in resistance as it ages in the hot engine compartment. The NEMA 15 moulded plug can also have different values once the blades are exposed to salted roads and corrode.

Let's not forget the extension cord you use to plug the car in with. I make my own extension cords out of 14 ga or 12 ga industrial cord, with Leviton or Hubbell industrial NEMA 15 plugs. The moulded stuff you get at a hareware store is crap, the resistance is really high.

jay

[jayman]

Doc Evan:

Originally posted by efusco+Oct 24 2005, 12:58 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(efusco @ Oct 24 2005, 12:58 PM)</div>

Sure am glad mine was delivered that way. You are either a patient man or must love punishing yourself.

I actually see a lot of owners confusing the oil pan for the cradle brace and crushing their oil pan, don't you?

I have a commercial low-profile trolley jack that works well, but that's because it has a long body. With the head properly positioned under that cradle, at least 4 inches of trolley jack sticks out from under the front bumper. Easy to jack up in 6-8 pumps.

<!--QuoteBegin-efusco@Oct 24 2005, 12:58 PM
  On to "Plan B"--get the Prius Jack--what a piece of crap that is.  I challenge you to jack your car up with that little thing in the front center position with that tiny "handle" they give you for that process. 

Oh yeah baby, I tried that factory "jack" as soon as I bought my Prius. You'd be SOL if you ever needed it at oh-dark thirty on a country road. For that matter, you'd be SOL if you needed it to change a flat in your own garage.

Canadian Tire had a sale last fall on a Michelin-branded 1.5 ton hydraulic trolley jack that has a nifty hard plastic carry case. I got it at the same time I bought the 700 amp booster box, also on sale.

It easily fits in the well with the temporary spare. It would never fit under the front of the car to jack up the cradle, but it works fine for jacking from the side to change a single tire.

Note: I also have a piece of 1/2 inch plate steel cut in a 10x10 inch square. Have you ever tried to jack up a car on a gravel shoulder or God Help You in mud? The 10x10 chunk of steel is just big enough to support the jack so it won't sink.

Note#2: If you live in a cold climate like I do, drain the fluid that comes with the jack and put in semi-synthetic or synthetic hydraulic fluid. Most of that jack fluid is rated 68 viscosity, so at 0 F or colder it won't even pump. That happened to me once on a lonely back road after a flat, at -30. Use an N22 or thinner fluid, for as often as you have to use the jack you won't hurt it.

Originally posted by efusco+Oct 24 2005, 12:58 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(efusco @ Oct 24 2005, 12:58 PM)</div>

Your life insurance is fully paid up, right? Just had to ask. You got a wimman and munchkins.

That would make it too darn easy.

Don't forget to thoroughly wash your hands with a good cleaner. Not sure about the Toyota stuff, but most of the industrial thermal transfer grease I've used is plastered with the good 'ole Skull and Crossbones, many warnings about carcinogenic this and birth defects that and kidney damage blah blah brain tumor etc etc impotence yadda yadda yadda ...

That reminds me, I finally made a bug/rock guard out of cheap plastic Gutter Guard from Home Depot. I've attached a picture to show a close-up of the gutter guard and where I keep my heater plug.

<!--QuoteBegin-efusco@Oct 24 2005, 12:58 PM
Winterization complete, just hope I don't overheat anything with some of the warmer days yet remaining before cold weather really hits.

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I've got a few pieces of "mill felt" at my hobby farm that I intend to fasten in FRONT of the grille where I attached my rock/bug guard. I got ziptie with anchor brackets to make this easier.

Once again, good job but if my block heater ever quits, I'll happily pay Toyota to replace it. Or just set the Prius on fire and buy a new one.

jay

jay