Converting my Alfa-

[mjms2b]

Ok so my other baby "Juliet" has been in storage now for about 3 years. I have plans to move her out of storage and finish the restore. I'm looking to start over and convert her to electric. Any ideas or suggestions on how to get started, things to consider (cost, etc) or recommendations?

[attachmentid=11918]

[miscrms]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(MJGreen @ Oct 9 2007, 11:51 PM) [snapback]523457[/snapback]</div>

Ok so my other baby "Juliet" has been in storage now for about 3 years. I have plans to move her out of storage and finish the restore. I'm looking to start over and convert her to electric. Any ideas or suggestions on how to get started, things to consider (cost, etc) or recommendations?

[attachmentid=11918]
[/b]

I was on the BEV conversion track before I ended up here with plans to do a PHEV conversion instead. My basic assessment was that if you want to go do it yourself BEV, you have to be willing to make a lot of compromises. You can make it fast, but it won't go far. You can make it go far, but it will be slow. If you want the best of both, you have to make it as small and light and low drag as you can. If you have deep pockets, you can pretty much buy your way out of the problem but that wasn't an option for me.

What killed it for me was that I just wasn't willing to put in the amount of time and money that was going to be required for what would end up being a pretty limited vehicle. At the time all I could afford was going to be a DC system with lead acid. I also was set on converting my '89 saab 900 turbo convertible, because I wanted my electric to be a car I wanted to drive. However, this is a heavy car thats not super aerodynamic (mostly due to being a convertible). I also wanted it to continue to be fun to drive. I needed to be able to commute at highway speeds, and I had some uncertainty about whether my commute was going to remain 15 miles RT, or extend to 30 miles RT.

In the end, I was looking at ~$2k for a Zilla 1k, ~$2k for a 9" motor, ~$3k for a Manzanita charger and regulators, and about $3.6k worth of Optima D34s that may need to be replaced every couple of years. Add in another $1k for contactors and wiring, and the project was quickly pushing ~$11.5k. With that I estimated a 6.9s 0-60 and a 30 mile 65mph flat range. Ultimately I was unwilling to compromise on requirements, and unwilling to put that much money into a fairly limited capability vehicle that would still be almost 20 years old and need lot of upkeep.

If you can go into the $20-$30k range and can get access to a modern light weight chasis, you could probably do a very nice conversion with an AC system and NimH or Li-ion batteries. This would give decent range, performance, and reliability. To get down into the $10k and lower range you are going to have to be willing to make a lot compromises and cut a lot of corners.

I would really love to have a BEV converted fun car, but it just wasn't feasible for me at this time. If money were no object, and I didn't need to carry carseats and have airbags, I would seriously be looking at an electroauto or metric mind AC conversion of a Porsche 914, or even better an early 911. With a bonnet full of A123 li-ion, that could be a very fun car.

Spend some time over on the evdl: http://www.evdl.org/
Check out your local chapter of the eaa: http://www.eaaev.org/
Worship at the alter of Otmar: http://www.cafeelectric.com/
Grovel at the feet of Husted: http://hitorqueelectric.com/
Proclaim your unworthiness to Rudman: http://www.manzanitamicro.com/
Get your socks knocked off at NEDRA: http://www.nedra.com/
Steal all the ideas you can from the album: http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/

Drool at:
http://www.electroauto.com/
http://www.metricmind.com/index1.htm
http://www.evparts.com/
http://ev-america.com/
http://www.go-ev.com/
http://www.ev-blue.com/
http://leftcoastelectric.com/
http://www.belktronix.com/
http://www.ampmobiles.com/
http://www.electricvehiclesusa.com/

Plot and Plan at:
http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaver...79/evcalc.html
http://www.evconvert.com/tools/evcalc/

Rob



Oh, and lastly, get ready to spend a whole lot of time studying batteries! I've been at it in my spare time for over a year

Rob

[patsparks]

another place to look http://www.austinev.org/
The first thing I think you need for an EV conversion is a light car with a high gross mass capacity. I think that's why Toyota used the RAV4.

From the reading I have done, if you want to convert to save money in the long run you wont. If you want to save the planet, maybe, if you want to learn from it you will. Batteries are still expensive and heavy.

If you choose to go the EV path good luck and I wish you every success. I wish I had the guts and the money to do it to. Unfortunately my daily commute is a bit too far for a home built EV. If I could get hold of a RAV4 EV, I'd love it and it would do nicely I believe. I need a range of about 100km in traffic for an EV to work for me.

[mjms2b]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(patsparks @ Oct 10 2007, 02:05 AM) [snapback]523507[/snapback]</div>

another place to look http://www.austinev.org/
The first thing I think you need for an EV conversion is a light car with a high gross mass capacity. I think that's why Toyota used the RAV4.

From the reading I have done, if you want to convert to save money in the long run you wont. If you want to save the planet, maybe, if you want to learn from it you will. Batteries are still expensive and heavy.

If you choose to go the EV path good luck and I wish you every success. I wish I had the guts and the money to do it to. Unfortunately my daily commute is a bit too far for a home built EV. If I could get hold of a RAV4 EV, I'd love it and it would do nicely I believe. I need a range of about 100km in traffic for an EV to work for me.
[/b]

Well Juliet used to be my daily driver, but now she is my project car. used to have a '77 vette as a project car but times have changed and so have I, I plan on keeping my prius of course so the obstacle is only money and time. thanks for the input that's a lot of info to digest. I will look more into it. I had planned on about $15K for the project, but weight may be an issue, the car with tranie and motor is 2,400 lbs, I guess I'll have to work the numbers on that to see if it is viable.

ps: here's a pic
[attachmentid=11953]

[patsparks]

I wonder where you can find the weight of the ICE and it's attendant systems?
Again good luck with the project.

[miscrms]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(MJGreen @ Oct 11 2007, 11:40 PM) [snapback]524425[/snapback]</div>

Well Juliet used to be my daily driver, but now she is my project car. used to have a '77 vette as a project car but times have changed and so have I, I plan on keeping my prius of course so the obstacle is only money and time. thanks for the input that's a lot of info to digest. I will look more into it. I had planned on about $15K for the project, but weight may be an issue, the car with tranie and motor is 2,400 lbs, I guess I'll have to work the numbers on that to see if it is viable.

[/b]

Your budget sounds reasonable. I was really trying to get in under $7k. That combined with heavy non-aero vehicle was a deal breaker. I was going to have to do a lot of development work to trim costs, and just don't have the time.

I started with Bob Brant's book "Build Your Own Electric Vehicle"
http://www.amazon.com/Build-Your-Own-Elect...e/dp/0830642315

Its a little dated, but provides a very good overview of the calculations required. Once you have a handle on those, you can adapt them to the newer motors and controllers. Good thing is most of the calcs are for the vehicle itself, and that doesn't really change. Both the web calculators above are basically based on this book from what I understand.

The big thing is to decide what your priorities are in terms of max speed, acceleration, and range. The you can use these calcs to get an idea where you lie in that space and trade off batteries, controllers, and motors.

Talk to everyone you can! There are a lot of folks out there who have tried a lot of things, and you can learn a lot from their mistakes and avoid having to repeat them! EVDL is a great place for this, even though the volume of traffic is somewhat overwhelming.

Rob

[mjms2b]

Rob, thanks for the advice, it's nice to know help is out there for these type things, now I just have to find the time to absorb all the info. thanks again.

[Godiva]

Little Red.

It might be worth contacting Abran now and seeing if he's offering a class Summer of 2008. You might even offer your car as the project car. San Miguel isn't that far south a drive from where you are. He's very open to answering questions about conversions and has info on his site.

[Godiva]

double post.

[miscrms]

BTW,

The folks from http://www.electroauto.com/

are holding a week long class in WA in Nov!

http://www.electroauto.com/workshopC5-SEI.shtml#SEI

I was planning to attend before I shifted plans from BEV to PHEV.

rob