Please sign this petition

[Dubsky]

Please sign up to this - I think it's important.

http://petitions.pm.gov.uk/electrictax/#detail

[efusco]

Well, we can certainly post this, but it needs to either be in the environmental forum or the international forum. I'm going to put it in the international in hopes of saving you a little pain as this is/would be torn to shreds in the environmental..... Good luck with the wind mill tilting!

[Dubsky]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(efusco @ Apr 18 2007, 09:28 AM) [snapback]425281[/snapback]</div>

Well, we can certainly post this, but it needs to either be in the environmental forum or the international forum. I'm going to put it in the international in hopes of saving you a little pain as this is/would be torn to shreds in the environmental..... Good luck with the wind mill tilting!
[/b]

It should go in the environmental section - only UK residents can add their names to the petition.

[MegansPrius]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Dubsky @ Apr 18 2007, 09:41 AM) [snapback]425292[/snapback]</div>

It should go in the environmental section - only UK residents can add their names to the petition.
[/b]

Yeah, good luck getting people here to sign a petition described as:

Electric/hybrid cars are not as friendly to the environment as some politicians/green activists would like us to believe and should be taxed at higher rate than diesel cars.

Maybe you should include a link to the CNW study as well.

[Jon the Chief]

If you explain Why, I might sign!

Jon the Chief

[Hobbs]

Originally Posted by Jon the Chief

If you explain Why, I might sign!

Jon the Chief

Even if he did, I wouldn't. The goverment taxes fuel by about 80%, about £32 (64$) per tank. If I thought the differential is unfair then I would sign a petion abolishing car tax!

[MegansPrius]

duplicate post

[MegansPrius]

Originally Posted by Scarface

The Toyota Prius has become the flagship car for those in our society so environmentally conscious that they are willing to spend a premium to show the world how much they care. Unfortunately for them, their ultimate ‘green car’ is the source of some of the worst pollution in North America; it takes more combined energy per Prius to produce than a Hummer. Before we delve into the seedy underworld of hybrids, you must first understand how a hybrid works. For this, we will use the most popular hybrid on the market, the Toyota Prius.
The Prius is powered by not one, but two engines: a standard 76 horsepower, 1.5-liter gas engine found in most cars today and a battery- powered engine that deals out 67 horsepower and a whooping 295ft/lbs of torque, below 2000 revolutions per minute. Essentially, the Toyota Synergy Drive system, as it is so called, propels the car from a dead stop to up to 30mph. This is where the largest percent of gas is consumed. As any physics major can tell you, it takes more energy to get an object moving than to keep it moving. The battery is recharged through the braking system, as well as when the gasoline engine takes over anywhere north of 30mph. It seems like a great energy efficient and environmentally sound car, right?
You would be right if you went by the old government EPA estimates, which netted the Prius an incredible 60 miles per gallon in the city and 51 miles per gallon on the highway. Unfortunately for Toyota, the government realized how unrealistic their EPA tests were, which consisted of highway speeds limited to 55mph and acceleration of only 3.3 mph per second. The new tests which affect all 2008 models give a much more realistic rating with highway speeds of 80mph and acceleration of 8mph per second. This has dropped the Prius’s EPA down by 25 percent to an average of 45mpg. This now puts the Toyota within spitting distance of cars like the Chevy Aveo, which costs less then half what the Prius costs.
However, if that was the only issue with the Prius, I wouldn’t be writing this article. It gets much worse.
Building a Toyota Prius causes more environmental damage than a Hummer that is on the road for three times longer than a Prius. As already noted, the Prius is partly driven by a battery which contains nickel. The nickel is mined and smelted at a plant in Sudbury, Ontario. This plant has caused so much environmental damage to the surrounding environment that NASA has used the ‘dead zone’ around the plant to test moon rovers. The area around the plant is devoid of any life for miles.
The plant is the source of all the nickel found in a Prius’ battery and Toyota purchases 1,000 tons annually. Dubbed the Superstack, the plague-factory has spread sulfur dioxide across northern Ontario, becoming every environmentalist’s nightmare.
“The acid rain around Sudbury was so bad it destroyed all the plants and the soil slid down off the hillside,” said Canadian Greenpeace energy-coordinator David Martin during an interview with Mail, a British-based newspaper.
All of this would be bad enough in and of itself; however, the journey to make a hybrid doesn’t end there. The nickel produced by this disastrous plant is shipped via massive container ship to the largest nickel refinery in Europe. From there, the nickel hops over to China to produce ‘nickel foam.’ From there, it goes to Japan. Finally, the completed batteries are shipped to the United States, finalizing the around-the-world trip required to produce a single Prius battery. Are these not sounding less and less like environmentally sound cars and more like a farce?
Wait, I haven’t even got to the best part yet.
When you pool together all the combined energy it takes to drive and build a Toyota Prius, the flagship car of energy fanatics, it takes almost 50 percent more energy than a Hummer - the Prius’s arch nemesis.
Through a study by CNW Marketing called “Dust to Dust,” the total combined energy is taken from all the electrical, fuel, transportation, materials (metal, plastic, etc) and hundreds of other factors over the expected lifetime of a vehicle. The Prius costs an average of $3.25 per mile driven over a lifetime of 100,000 miles - the expected lifespan of the Hybrid.
The Hummer, on the other hand, costs a more fiscal $1.95 per mile to put on the road over an expected lifetime of 300,000 miles. That means the Hummer will last three times longer than a Prius and use less combined energy doing it.
So, if you are really an environmentalist - ditch the Prius. Instead, buy one of the most economical cars available - a Toyota Scion xB. The Scion only costs a paltry $0.48 per mile to put on the road. If you are still obsessed over gas mileage - buy a Chevy Aveo and fix that lead foot.
One last fun fact for you: it takes five years to offset the premium price of a Prius. Meaning, you have to wait 60 months to save any money over a non-hybrid car because of lower gas expenses.



http://clubs.ccsu.edu/Recorder/edito...asp?NewsID=188
http://www.google.com/search?q=prius...ient=firefox-a

See http://wallofcheese.blogspot.com/

[Danny Hamilton]

Originally Posted by Scarface

The Toyota Prius has become the flagship car for . . . . blah, blah, blah. . . . (a bunch of ancient debunked B.S.). . . .blah, blah blah. . . .

LOL!

[MegansPrius]

Originally Posted by Scarface

I'm just bringing the information directly to the thread.
That and the google links will show that it's not something from one whiny SUV driver.

EDIT :
Don't bring up the plant's history. This is about now, not about 100 years worth of history and damage.
Compare how much work is involved in making the two vehicles. Think about the average longevity. Do the math and the Prius does several times more environmental damage.

dude,

Follow the link. The info you posted from Chris Demorro has been debunked so many times on this board it's painful. I mean Demorro can't even get the list price of a car right.