Zap Xebra

Tempus · 04-17-2007, 09:22 AM

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(darelldd @ Apr 17 2007, 02:26 AM) [snapback]424494[/snapback]</div>

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One of my odd little peeves (not directed at you, of course!).

We say that traditional cars are "gasoline powered." Yet bicycles are "human powered." If bikes are powered by humans, then cars are powered by engines, yes? Or if cars are powered by gasoline, then bicycles are powered by the food we eat.

This comes up in my little world because I use the phrase "solar powered" for my EVs. Many folks complain that I'm not telling the truth. My EV is "battery powered." So which did come first? The chicken or the chicken scratch?

[/b]

Clearly - The implication is that bicyclist are Cannibals!

daniel · 04-17-2007, 10:05 AM

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(tracysbeans @ Apr 16 2007, 11:24 PM) [snapback]424492[/snapback]</div>

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I was just joking!

[/b]

I know it!

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(darelldd @ Apr 16 2007, 11:26 PM) [snapback]424494[/snapback]</div>

Quote:

One of my odd little peeves (not directed at you, of course!).

We say that traditional cars are "gasoline powered." Yet bicycles are "human powered." If bikes are powered by humans, then cars are powered by engines, yes? Or if cars are powered by gasoline, then bicycles are powered by the food we eat.

This comes up in my little world because I use the phrase "solar powered" for my EVs. Many folks complain that I'm not telling the truth. My EV is "battery powered." So which did come first? The chicken or the chicken scratch?

[/b]

And I am joking when I say my Xebra will be water-powered. All our energy except nuclear comes from the sun, and nuclear comes from suns whose explosions created the heavier elements from which our solar system was formed.

Language is not logical. We pick the item we consider most significant. Petroleum ultimately derives it's energy from the sun. Is an EV powered by batteries? Or by the electric motor? Or by solar panels (in your case)? Or by the power plants that sell most of us our electrons? Is a bicycle powered by the human rider? Or by the food s/he eats? Or by the sun, whose energy was converted into carbohydrates by the plants?

In my opinion, it is perfectly acceptable to use the form that is most significant in the context of our lives as social and political animals. It is understood that "gas-powered" refers to the entire mechanism and process of converting gasoline to motive force; that human-powered refers to the entire process and biology of converting food to motive force; and that electric-powered refers to the process and machinery by which some arbitrary source of energy is converted to electric power, transfered to a vehicle, and converted to motive force.

And it is understood that "solar powered" means that the motive energy was obtained from the sun in a more direct way than the biological processes that produce food so you can ride your bike, or the combined biological and geological processes that produce fossil fuels. These are all linguistic conventions, and they are useful as long as people understand what they mean.

Anything else is semantic quibbling. Your bike is human-powered, and your EV is solar-powered. And our Priuses are gas powered, because these are the terms most important in our social relationships with these devices. My Xebra will not really be water-powered, but I indulge my whim for silly humor.

DaveinOlyWA · 04-17-2007, 10:59 AM

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(daniel @ Apr 17 2007, 07:05 AM) [snapback]424575[/snapback]</div>

Quote:

I know it!

In my opinion, it is perfectly acceptable to use the form that is most significant in the context of our lives as social and political animals.
[/b]

great answer

larkinmj · 04-17-2007, 11:58 AM

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(darelldd @ Apr 17 2007, 02:26 AM) [snapback]424494[/snapback]</div>

Quote:

This comes up in my little world because I use the phrase "solar powered" for my EVs. Many folks complain that I'm not telling the truth. My EV is "battery powered." So which did come first? The chicken or the chicken scratch?

[/b]

I checked out the Zapcars website, and they have one vehcile that is "solar powered" called the Xebra Xero. It has a photovoltaic panel on the roof, which I would guess is just supplemental to the main charger.

daniel · 04-17-2007, 03:15 PM

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(larkinmj @ Apr 17 2007, 08:58 AM) [snapback]424655[/snapback]</div>

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I checked out the Zapcars website, and they have one vehcile that is "solar powered" called the Xebra Xero. It has a photovoltaic panel on the roof, which I would guess is just supplemental to the main charger.
[/b]

Basically, it'll put a tiny trickle charge on to help keep the batteries warm. And you'd have to leave it parked in the sun all day to get any benefit out of it. Keep it in your garage and you've wasted some perfectly good solar cells.

I think the Zap Zero is more of a "statement" than anything else.

larkinmj · 04-17-2007, 03:36 PM

I have a 7.5 mile commute each day, and I might consider getting one of these. The 40 mph limit wouldn't be too much of a constraint. Most of my commute is on roads that have a limit of 35mph or less. However, I have to go over a large suspension bridge. The posted limit is 40mph, but everyone is going at least 50 or 60. I could get by staying in the right lane and going 40, but from your description it sounds like that might not even be doable. Going up a bridge, do you think I'd be able to do 40mph?

daniel · 04-17-2007, 05:58 PM

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(larkinmj @ Apr 17 2007, 12:36 PM) [snapback]424810[/snapback]</div>

Quote:

I have a 7.5 mile commute each day, and I might consider getting one of these. The 40 mph limit wouldn't be too much of a constraint. Most of my commute is on roads that have a limit of 35mph or less. However, I have to go over a large suspension bridge. The posted limit is 40mph, but everyone is going at least 50 or 60. I could get by staying in the right lane and going 40, but from your description it sounds like that might not even be doable. Going up a bridge, do you think I'd be able to do 40mph?
[/b]

The speedometer on the Xebra is notoriously inaccurate, and I do not know if Sean had made corrections in the ones I drove. However, the only time I got one up to 40 was downhill. We went up a pretty steep hill, and I think it slowed to 22 mph or so. In my opinion, 35 mph is more realistic, on flat ground. I do not know if the speedo is high or low. These numbers are just what the speedo said.

The more-powerful controller that I am getting has more acceleration, and more power to maintain speed uphill, but I'd still not expect to do better than 25 or 30 on a moderate hill.

This is a nice little car if you want to kick the gas habit, and your short commute is an excellent candidate for it. But it does not go fast on the uphills. If you do not mind slowing down on the uphill, and then speeding up again when you get to level ground, it could work for you.

Or you could wait for the Tesla and take that bridge at 130 mph, and zero to sixty in four seconds.

larkinmj · 04-17-2007, 06:36 PM

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(daniel @ Apr 17 2007, 05:58 PM) [snapback]424922[/snapback]</div>

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Or you could wait for the Tesla and take that bridge at 130 mph, and zero to sixty in four seconds.

[/b]

Doing renovations on "this old house"; the Tesla may have to wait awhile.

darelldd · 04-17-2007, 10:55 PM

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(daniel @ Apr 17 2007, 06:05 AM) [snapback]424575[/snapback]</div>

Quote:

In my opinion, it is perfectly acceptable to use the form that is most significant in the context of our lives as social and political animals. [/b]

This has to rank up there with one of the best answers to one of my questions... ever! I do agree with your comments, though I'm sure I could not have articulated it so well! You are RIGHT on the money. It does all make sense when you put it that way!

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(larkinmj @ Apr 17 2007, 11:36 AM) [snapback]424810[/snapback]</div>

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Going up a bridge, do you think I'd be able to do 40mph?
[/b]

Yeah... as Daniel said - No way. They can't really quite make 40 on the flat, much less up hill. And that is with a full charge on fresh batteries.

daniel · 05-02-2007, 06:20 PM

I just got the word that my Xebra is at the upholsterers. This could be the last step of the modifications that Sean is making for me. It means there is some hope I could get it this Sunday or Monday.

And then I can be as smug as Darell!

His RAV4EV is powered by sunlight. My Xebra will be powered by water, since our grid power in WA comes from hydroelectric.

04-17-2007, 03:36 PM	#16
larkinmj Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 1,996 My Car: Model: Package: Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts Friends: 6	I have a 7.5 mile commute each day, and I might consider getting one of these. The 40 mph limit wouldn't be too much of a constraint. Most of my commute is on roads that have a limit of 35mph or less. However, I have to go over a large suspension bridge. The posted limit is 40mph, but everyone is going at least 50 or 60. I could get by staying in the right lane and going 40, but from your description it sounds like that might not even be doable. Going up a bridge, do you think I'd be able to do 40mph? __________________ Mike Larkin http://www.myspace.com/deadbluessociety

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05-02-2007, 06:20 PM	#20
daniel Cat Lovers Against the Bomb Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Spokane, WA Posts: 11,278 My Car: 2004 Prius Model: Package: #6 Thanks: 59 Thanked 201 Times in 127 Posts Friends: 0	I just got the word that my Xebra is at the upholsterers. This could be the last step of the modifications that Sean is making for me. It means there is some hope I could get it this Sunday or Monday. And then I can be as smug as Darell! His RAV4EV is powered by sunlight. My Xebra will be powered by water, since our grid power in WA comes from hydroelectric.