Big 3 to deepen discounts

[Jack66]

Originally Posted by Jimmie84

So be it. But where do the sales go whenever a person buys a foreign manufactured vehicle? It goes right back to China, Japan, And ect... I should look to see what GM's sales are in Canada...
A lot of GM trucks and cars are built in the US. My truck was built in Louisiana. GM's powertrains are built in Flint MI.

Maybe, but where do the foreign-owned U.S. plants resource the jobs that you wanted the U.S. to keep? They employ Americans.

[cwerdna]

Originally Posted by Jimmie84

US manufacturers do make good quality vehicles.

Consumer Reports, JD Power's reliability ratings along w/first hand experience certainly don't indicate this is true.

Originally Posted by Jimmie84

My dad had a Cavalier with 200,000 miles on it and no problems. My truck has 350,000 on it and I've only had to do the typical maintence on it. My moms friend has a tahoe with 197,000 miles on it and he's only done a fuel pump.

You know why people have bad luck with vehicles? They never take care of them. They drive them and expect them to last forever. I was taking delivery of my truck today and happened to pass through the service counter. A lady was asking why she was having these problems with her Jeep Liberty and the service advisor said, "Well, Every fluid in your vehicle is low and you have not had an oil change in over 25,000 miles". Sounds like NEGLECT.

Either you're lying or you're very lucky or you're replacing parts that as part of "maintenance"/wear items which should really be counted as repairs.

Back in the Consumer Reports April 05 auto issue (p. 19), here was an interesting quote:
'We're also surprised at what some readers consider "reliable". Philip Saley of Del Mar, Calif., told us that his corvette was the most reliable car he'd owned in 40 years. Even so, he had replaced brake rotors, the muffler, and air-conditioner control, and a wheel bearing - all within the first 44,000 miles."

My former co-worker had need far more repairs (which had nothing to do w/maintenance) on his Chevy Envoy this is Honda Odyssey. The type of stuff we had problems w/on our 86 Olds Cutlass Ciera had nothing to do "taking care of it". We did regular maintenance yet we had things like:
- steering wheel developed cracks at the spokes
- glove compartment latch mechanism broke it would just flop open (had to tape it shut)
- radio/speaker went bad so left front speaker just put out static
- engine would knock on level ground even w/premium
- engine would make grinding/gurgling sounds on hard acceleration
- sun visors were crap and wouldn't stay up (same prob w/other GM cars we had)
- car would make a high pitched squealing sound when you turned slightly to the left
- transmission fluid ALWAYS leaked despite multiple attempts by the dealer to fix it under warranty (back then IIRC, the 3/36K powertrain warranty had a $100 deductive)
- something in the engine broke (I was pretty young back then) causing the oil to mix w/the coolant, car nearly overheated [my uncle has the exact same model year and engine and had the same problem months earlier]

All this happened well short of 70K miles before the car hit 10 years. Then my dad go into an accident w/ it. On the other hand, our 91 Toyota Camry V6 at 90K miles had nowhere near this # of problems. My mom's 96 Camry V6 w/69K miles which she was driving until last month had almost 0 issues.

[Jimmie84]

Your telling me that your complaining about cracks in the steering wheel or other small plastic parts breaking? Up here in the severe winters things like this break on any vehicle. It's a mechanical machine and eventually something is bound to break. GM's powertrain is VERY STRONG. Go take a good look under a prius with 50k miles and you probably will see some oil seepage coming out of the pan or valve cover gaskets. It's impossible to prevent stuff from leakning or breaking as age factor comes to play. My truck leaks oil all over the place. It's not because of GM's quality but just a pat of age. Almost 10 years old and 350,000 miles.

So, You want to talk about quality?
2007 Tundra seat belt failure - Tundra Solutions Forum

Bed rattle - Tundra Solutions Forum

My truck is 2 days old..help! VSC Off, 4LO blinking etc... - Tundra Solutions Forum

Corrosion problems - Tundra Solutions Forum

gas tank sending unit - Tundra Solutions Forum

Now, I'm not bashing Toyota but they have there own issues right now and recalls as well.

You make it sound like your car will never develop a problem in the future. Eventually it will and you can't prevent it. You can delay it by doing preventative maintenence.

[cwerdna]

Originally Posted by Jimmie84

Your telling me that your complaining about cracks in the steering wheel or other small plastic parts breaking? Up here in the severe winters things like this break on any vehicle. It's a mechanical machine and eventually something is bound to break. ...

GM's powertrain is VERY STRONG.
...
It's impossible to prevent stuff from leakning or breaking as age factor comes to play. My truck leaks oil all over the place. It's not because of GM's quality but just a pat of age. Almost 10 years old and 350,000 miles.
...
You can delay it by doing preventative maintenence.

I live in San Jose, CA and that's where the Olds always had been. It was also garaged most of its life. We don't have harsh winters here. We get down to maybe 28 degrees F at the lowest. Winters range from ~30 F to 70 F. Right now, per weather.com, it's 73 F right now and the forecast is for a low of 47 F.

The transmission fluids leaks from the very beginning have nothing to do w/"harsh winters" either. No Japanese vehicle we've had ever had cracks in the steering wheel, the glove box break nor leak transmission fluid. I listed a whole bunch of problems which have nothing to do w/plastic parts.

Aha! See, you've indicated problems w/your vehicle ("leaks oil all over the place") yet earlier you claimed "My truck has 350,000 on it and I've only had to do the typical maintence on it." How many other problems have you and the other folks had which you don't count as "problems"?

GM's powertrains are so strong that our Olds developed the problems I mentioned, huh?

All cars require proper maintenance. The problems we've had w/American vehicles (mainly GM) have had nothing to do w/maintenance. Go look at the April auto issue of Consumer Reports and compare reliability across all GM products vs. say Toyota and Honda. You'll see exactly what I'm talking about. GM has a few reliable models, but the rest are very hit or miss.

Both power window motors and regulators failed on my Nissan 350Z and were replaced under factory warranty. Was it due to lack of maintenance? No. There's NOTHING to maintain here and it's well known and widespread problem on the 03 and 04 models.

Take a look at Consumer Reports 2007 Annual Car Reliability Survey highlights: Consumer Reports Cars Blog and the data I posted at http://priuschat.com/forums/prius-hy...tml#post568050. Notice how many American vehicles are in the least reliable column and how few are in the most reliable?

[Jimmie84]

Do you seriously think I'm gonna read some BS posted on Consumer Reports website? They are the most biased vehicle reviewer ever!

Guess where the components were made for that 350z especially your window regulators? Japan perhaps?

Yes, My truck does leak oil. I think I loose about a quart bewteen oil change intervals. But, It's 10 years old and 350,000 miles it's going to happen! But you know what? I bought a new 08 Silverado yesterday and I plan to keep both trucks. I will be pulling my oil pan off this week on the S-10 and replacing the gasket. Heck, Im gonna even replace the clutch and oil cooler lines. Quality is what has gotten my truck to this mile marker. But, It's gonna be retired to an off road truck in a year. I plan to lift it and modify it a bit for competition.

Every few cars might develop early problems and thats just the luck of the draw. Each vehicle is different and a machine might not properly tighten a bolt or miss something in the assembly line.

We have a few guys out at post that have Duramax Diesel Silverado's with 600,000 miles on them. Most diesels will see 1 million miles before needing a engine overhaul. Of course, It's different for cars powered with diesels as they typical only get 300,000 miles or so before a rebuild.

It's like I said before, All vehicles will develop issues as they get older but it seems you don't want to accept it.

Prius Issues-
Prius Problems Traced to Software Glitch

Consumer complaints about Toyota Prius

The Toyota Prius 'Recall' - Popular Mechanics

2005 Toyota Prius STEERING:ELECTRIC POWER ASSIST SYSTEM Recall at Automotive.com

2005 Toyota Prius AIR BAGS Recall at Automotive.com

[Jack66]

Jimmie, did you read the definition of Troll I posted for you earlier?

[cwerdna]

Originally Posted by Jimmie84

Do you seriously think I'm gonna read some BS posted on Consumer Reports website? They are the most biased vehicle reviewer ever!

Guess where the components were made for that 350z especially your window regulators? Japan perhaps?

...
It's like I said before, All vehicles will develop issues as they get older but it seems you don't want to accept it.

Prius Issues-...

So you're just going to stick your head in the sand, believe what you want to believe and look at data from statistically insufficient samples sizes? You might not think their reviews are worth anything but I at least trust them to report the statistics as reported to them by readers.

Yes, most likely they came from Japan. But I was illustrating that your claim about maintenance and repairs is bogus in many cases. All cars REQUIRE proper maintenance. Failures can happen regardless of whether this is done and some of these systems have no maintenance that can be performed.

Absolutely all vehicles will develop more issues as they get older. I never disputed that and Consumer Reports reliability ratings bear this out. You keep claiming I'm denying that.

As for the Prius issues you cite, mine is unaffected by all of them. All car makers have recalls, Toyota included. FWIW, the Prius currently has the HIGHEST reliability rating of ALL family cars in CR. I'm 100% confident that if you took reliability info for 100 Prius owners vs. 100 Chevy Impala V8 owners (has the 2nd lowest reliability rating for family cars) that you'd find that sum of Prius repairs would be a lot smaller than the sum of Impala repairs.

Jack66 is right, you are a troll.

[patsparks]

Originally Posted by Jimmie84

Now, I went vehicle shopping this morning but with no intentions of Buying from Toyota I wanted to se what discounts I would get offered. I got NOTHING.

I walked into a Chevrolet dealer said here is my Military ID and I'm in the US Army ( As I did at Toyota). I got the outmost respect and great treatment from the dealership. I was even Thanked for serving my country. Now as far as Toyota I was treated like shit after I showed them my ID.

I now have a 2008 Chevy Silverado 1500 sitting in my garage.

Maybe we should ban trading all together and say see yah foreign automakers.

Settle for shit because the salesman is a suck and you think we Toyota owners are stupid? Toyota don't need to offer discounts, their prices are realistic on the sticker not inflated to allow discounts.
Funniest post I have read this week. Do you think they treat you special because you were in the armed forces? If you had shown your cat owners club members card and asked for a discount you would likely have faired as well.

Is Jimmie84 really Malorn?

[micheal]

Originally Posted by patsparks

Is Jimmie84 really Malorn?

I am certainly beginning to think so, as his points have gradually shown to be the same as malorn's. And his debate style is the same, cherry pick information, ignore questions when convenient and misconstrue what others are saying.

Even if he isn't, I am firmly convinced he is a troll and not worth the effort.

[Jimmie84]

Originally Posted by cwerdna

Jack66 is right, you are a troll.

He never called me a Troll. Iasked in my thread of introduction what a Troll was and he responded. I'm pretty sure he was just wondering if I saw his response.