seeking insight on pre-2004 Prius vs. Honda Civic Hybrid

[veggiegreenguyNYNJ]

Hi all...

Well, it's happened; my '93 dodge spirit has passed away. This means that I need a replacement ASAP, and can't wait until my Prius dealer calls to tell me that my car has arrived. Also, certain things have happened to lessen my enthusiasm for a long-term loan of 18K, which is about what I'd have to finance, give or take depending on model of Prius.

SO... I've started looking at used vehicles, and I just don't know which is better, the pre-2004 Prius, or a Honda Civic Hybrid. Would anyone like to share some general recommendations/pointers on which car they'd prefer? -Thanks!

[Frank Hudon]

well the wife started with a 2k1 Prius and it was a good car, reliable and very economical. Drove it across western Canada and over mountain passes and never managed to get below about 47 miles to the Imperial gallon for as long as we owned the car. Along comes the 2k4 and she has to have one and trades in the 2k1, but the 2k4 has never gotten the mileage that the 2k1 did. Yes it has more bells and whistles and such but for all the extra power and flash 44 is about all it will do. At the time we traded in the Classic I wasn't all that intrested in getting rid of my Tundra so we let it go, then a bunch of things conspired and I decided that the Tundra had to go and got what was probably the last new 2k3 Prius in Canada. I have it now at about 54 Imperial miles to the gallon for the lifetime average. The Classic is a good capable car and I would whole hartedly recommend it to someone with the want for a Prius and the finances of a second hand car. Lots are coming off leases and can be had for a good discount. The first stop if you interested in an ex-lease is a dealer lease manager. Tell him your looking for a good low mileage Prius and see what he's got coming in or has on a back lot. Also the internet and more dealers in your state or within driving distance. As for the HCH I don't even know anyone with one to ask what the thing is like. All I know is it's not a full hybrid like the Prius.

[krooster1234]

Well the original prius wasn't a full hybrid either, but dang sounds like you're getting some pretty good mileage with that thing! Wish I could break 50MPG on my 2004 Hard enough to break 48 sometimes.....

My favorite site for car reviews is edmunds.com, consumer reports is good too but I think you need a subscription. Generally what I have heard is that there was nothing new technology-wise in the honda civic hybrid, over the prius, but it had less compromises in terms of size/space than the original prius (slightly more advanced design). Of course, the HCH doesn't stick out as a hybrid the way the prius does.

Hopefully some people with actual comparative experiences will elaborate, since all I know about the two cars is what I remember reading back in march/april 2003 when I was thinking that my next car would be one of the two.

[Frank Hudon]

what do you mean the origional Prius wasn't a full hybrid. It's exactly the same as the 2k4 when your talking hybrid Starts on electric and has 2 mg's and a Miller cycle ICE. Just like the 2k4. Not quit as powerful but the same basic technology.

[krooster1234]

what do you mean the origional Prius wasn't a full hybrid. It's exactly the same as the 2k4 when your talking hybrid Starts on electric and has 2 mg's and a Miller cycle ICE. Just like the 2k4. Not quit as powerful but the same basic technology.

Well my understanding, although I may be wrong, was that a "full hybrid" was defined as being able to run on only the gas engine, only the electric motor, or both if necessary. I think that in the original prius the gas engine only shuts off when the car is stopped.

But, maybe I am thinking "parallel hybrid" vs. "series hybrid", and "full hybrid" refers to something else. In terms of the difference between the HCH and the original Prius, I'm not an expert by any means.

Anyone who knows more care to comment?

[bruceha_2000]

The 2001-2003 Prius IS full hybrid, but has the engine compressor A/C so it won't shut down at stops like the '04+.

I rented both the 2003 HCH and Prius early summer 2003. I would say they are functionally equivilent, in the "get me from here to there" sense. Both are nice cars in their size range. Both fail my "folding rear seatback" requirement. A few thoughts.[list]

[DaveinOlyWA]

a full hybrid is a vehicle that can either run completely on electric power or can run completely on gas or both at the same time.

the Prius classic IS a true hybrid.

[veggiegreenguyNYNJ]

I rented both the 2003 HCH and Prius early summer 2003. I would say they are functionally equivilent, in the "get me from here to there" sense. Both are nice cars in their size range. Both fail my "folding rear seatback" requirement. A few thoughts...

Bruce,

Your direct comparison was very helpful... thanks a bunch!

So what I understand from all of these replies is that the two are fairly equivalent, except that the Prius–a true hybrid–is more environmentally sound (ie, less emissions). I might get hell for writing this, but regarding comments about the HCH looking the same as the standard civic... 1) that's kind of a "duh" statement, 2) not really important to me, and 3) the pre-2k4 Prius looks like a standard nondescript car as well, in my opinion. Getting the best car for the environment with my limited budget is my primary concern; therefore, I will explore the availability of used Prii. You've all been very helpful thus far... if anyone else has anything to contribute, I'd love to hear it!

[john1701a]

A weakness of Civic-Hybrid (CVT) is stop & slow traffic, like many people experience on their daily commute. MPG suffers under those conditions.

Auto-Stop will not re-engage unless speed reaches 10 MPH. (Classic & HSD Prius doesn't have a speed requirement for the engine to shut back off. In fact, the engine will usually remain off when you creep forward.)

Auto-Stop is limited when the temperature drops below 40 F degrees. (Classic Prius has a limit of 20 F degrees. HSD Prius has a limit of -15 F degrees.)

Auto-Stop halts the A/C blower. (Classic Prius keeps it running when on low, even with the engine off. HSD Prius has electric A/C, so the relevance is minimal.)

Assist relies primarily on regenerative-braking for electricity. That means once that is depleted, forced-charging is required, which causes a noticeable MPG hit. It also means assist availability becomes limited. (Classic & HSD Prius generates electricity 100 percent of the time the engine is providing thrust to the wheels, so the relevance is minimal.)

[veggiegreenguyNYNJ]

Thanks John! You're just strengthening my resolve... now I understand why there's an abundance of used and new HCHs out there, and significantly less Prii, even pre-2004 models. Most of my driving IS in stop-and-go traffic, so I definitely want the car that will be environmentally friendlier under those circumstances...