Prius is not a green car

[micheal]

It is indeed pretty saddening that people still believe these old, tired arguments that have been long refuted (as evidenced both by the editorial and the comments from the MotorTrend forum comments).

Originally Posted by TonyPSchaefer

You think that's bad?
The letter was picked up by MotorTrend. You should read the comments over there praising this gentleman's clear thinking and insight: The Not-Quite-Green Toyota Prius - Motor Trend The General Forum Forum

No kidding. When reading the MT comments, even when someone posted the Pacific Institute rebuttal to CNW, one person still wanted more information to be convinced that CNW was junk. Another person then starts spouting off about having to replace the batteries every 100K miles.

Either way, the best thing to do is refute misinformation when we can, but not to let it ruin our day. If people really wanted to get accurate information about the Prius, it is certainly easily available. So if some refuse to pull their head out, it has no bearing on how much we enjoy our vehicles and they are a step in the right direction.

[patsparks]

The Prius is responsible for tremendous harm to the environment around Sudbury, it has almost single handedly wiped out almost all vegitation around Sudbury. Of course this all happened before the Prius was concieved and since before the conception of the Prius there were measures put in place to curb the harm the production of nickel for the Prius battery had already caused.

While the Superstack lowered the ground-level pollution in the city, it also dispersed the gases over a much larger area. This led to a slow rise in acidity of lakes in the area, to the point where by the late 1980s up to 7,000 lakes were severely damaged due to acid rain. Starting in the early 1990s, a major construction effort started to dramatically clean the waste gases before pumping them up the Superstack, removing around 90% of the sulphur dioxide. The upgrades were completed in 1994, and emissions from then on are much reduced [1]. Further reductions in emissions are planned.

Inco Superstack - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Inco_Superstack

[chogan2]

My suggested comment, if faced with the CNW study, is this:

CNW says the typical "energy cost per mile" for the US fleet is around $2.23. (That is the median of all models listed).
http://www.cnwmr.com/nss-folder/auto...0to%20High.xls

The US fleet drives about 3 trillion vehicle miles per year.
BTS | Table 1-32: U.S. Vehicle-Miles

Doing the arithmetic, that means the "energy cost" of the US vehicle fleet is $6.7 trillion per year. Based on the CNW number.

But actual total spending for energy, of all types, for all uses, in the US, is about $1.2 trillion per year.

http://www.eia.doe.gov/emeu/aer/pdf/pages/sec1_13.pdf

So, CNW says the annual "energy cost" of US driving is about 5.6x the actual total energy cost of all energy used for all purposes in the US.

And, hey, come to think of it, the US uses one-quarter of the world's energy:

World energy resources and consumption - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

World_energy_resources_and_consumption

So that means that total worldwide annual energy spending for all types of energy is about $4.8 trillion, give or take.

Which means, bottom line, the CNW study says that the "energy cost" of US driving is more than the cost of all the energy used for all purposes everywhere in the world.

In commonsense terms, it costs you $25K to buy a Prius and about $8,000 to fill the tank for 150,000 miles (@46 mpg, $2.50/gallon).

So the cost of buying and fueling a Prius is about $33,000.

CNW "energy cost per mile" for the Prius is listed (source cited above) at $2.19. Over 150,000 miles, that works out to $329,000.

So, that's $33,000 to buy and and fuel it. The additional $296,000 in "energy cost" is for what, exactly? Remember, in the long run, the cost of the car has to cover the market cost of the energy used to make it (plus all the other costs).

The CNW numbers are laughably, obviously bullshit. Independent of the particular findings with respect to the Prius versus the Hummer. It is a commentary on the ignorance of reporters that they will just parrot the "findings" of that report without taking a minute to do even a simple check to see whether the CNW numbers could possibly make any sense.

[Chuck.]

There is a YouTube somewhere choreographing Sudbury and how Prius parts hop from continent to continent...and the only product this is done for is hybrids?

An obvious blind eye is given to most of the products we use in a world of globalization....the food we eat travels on average 1500 miles.

[Fibb222]

I can believe these lies keep making the rounds. Happens all the time with global warming too. Status quo seeking scoundrels lie! That's what they do!

We have to do our best to stay vigilant and make sure not to give these idiots a free pass.

[cwerdna]

Originally Posted by Delta Flyer

There is a YouTube somewhere choreographing Sudbury and how Prius parts hop from continent to continent...and the only product this is done for is hybrids?

An obvious blind eye is given to most of the products we use in a world of globalization....the food we eat travels on average 1500 miles.

I haven't seen the video, but perhaps it was a clip from Top Gear aka the car show that has little to no factual information.

For those who quote that cite that crap, they ought to look at National Geographic Channel - Human Footprint - Our Driving Imprint and

YouTube - Car Footprint

YouTube - Car Footprint

that focused on the Ford Crown Vic.

[nthach]

If these guys think that the Prius is responsible for the Sudbury conspiracy, they should also place blame on Apple, Nokia, Motorola, Black & Decker, Sony, and countless other electronics companies that use NiMHs as a power source. It's another Detroit-made smoke and mirrors story. I'd bet the iPod inflicted more damage there.

Shoot, I think the Honda Civic Hybrid is the worst hybrid on the road in terms of being "green". The drivetrain is made in Japan. The rest of the car, however is shipped from Ohio and Canada via container ship as a glider and re-assembled in Japan and gets shipped back here again.

[DaveinOlyWA]

this thread is not even worth commenting on...only shows that the writer is able to do searches on the internet AND that he does not have the ability to

1) check the dates since this story is several years old
2) check his common sense since the entire basis of the article is ludicrous to begin with
3) realize that he is obviously doing a job that he is not qualified or suited mentally to perform