Consumeraffairs.com again

Tempus · 01-29-2007, 12:17 PM

http://www.consumeraffairs.com/news04/2007..._snowbound.html

Prius Shuts Down in the Snow, Reader Complains

Toyota Calls Automatic Power Reduction a Safety Feature

The Toyota Prius is known to occasionally shut down its hybrid engine system for no apparent reason, wear tires quickly and unevenly, even drain a battery dry when parked for an extended period.

But here's one of the oddest Prius stories on file at ConsumerAffairs.Com:

"When my car is on any kind of slick surface that causes one of the front wheels to slip, ALL power to the drive system is stopped," wrote Christopher of Reston, Virginia.

Christopher said he first experienced the problem with his Prius "on a sloped gravel driveway in July but discounted it as a temporary thing."

Then the snow fell....

---

I love they way they start every Prius article with a laundry list of their past 'findings'.

hill · 01-29-2007, 12:40 PM

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Tempus @ Jan 29 2007, 01:17 PM) [snapback]382315[/snapback]</div>

Quote:

http://www.consumeraffairs.com/news04/2007..._snowbound.html

Prius Shuts Down in the Snow, Reader Complains
. . . . . . . .
I love they way they start every Prius article with a laundry list of their past 'findings'.
. . . . . . .
[/b]

After Consumer Affairs botched their 'findings' that the Prius IS more economical than a full blow ICE of similar size (never mind the Baby seat debacle) . . . one would think they'd do their research a little better (did I just sound like the Geico cave man ?

I think I just lost my apetite)

Don-RI · 01-29-2007, 12:46 PM

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(hill @ Jan 29 2007, 12:40 PM) [snapback]382324[/snapback]</div>

Quote:

After Consumer Affairs botched their 'findings' that the Prius IS more economical than a full blow ICE of similar size (never mind the Baby seat debacle) . . . one would think they'd do their research a little better (did I just sound like the Geico cave man ?

I think I just lost my apetite) [/b]

Sigh. Reading such a news story with their "findings," while knowing what the real deal is as a Prius owner, never ceases to dismay me into thinking that if most "news reporting" is of this same caliber, then most news reporting is nothing better than a game of "telephone" gone bad.

galaxee · 01-29-2007, 12:52 PM

oh no, my tires won't spin!

Beryl Octet · 01-29-2007, 01:16 PM

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(hill @ Jan 29 2007, 12:40 PM) [snapback]382324[/snapback]</div>

Quote:

After Consumer Affairs botched their 'findings' that the Prius IS more economical than a full blow ICE of similar size (never mind the Baby seat debacle) . . . one would think they'd do their research a little better (did I just sound like the Geico cave man ?

I think I just lost my apetite)
[/b]

The baby seat thing was Consumer Reports. I think Consumer Affairs is a different bunch of folks. Consumer Reports used to be somewhat useful and informative.

unruhly · 01-29-2007, 01:19 PM

OK, I'm gonna be the one to bite.
I got my Prius last year at the end of our snow season (Feb 06). Since then, I've been keenly aware of the posts on the "problem" discussed in the article and have been fearful of being stranded on my way home from work. My commute to/from work has a couple of places, such as traversing the river canyon for instance, that far exceed the grades mentioned in that article. Fortunately, there's been no snow to speak of yet, but I know it's coming sooner or later.
When the snow/ice do get bad, there are usually a handfull of rear wheel drive vehicles stranded on the hills, but I can't recall ever seeing a front-wheel car getting stuck.
Anyway, a lot of finesse is required to ascend the hills and a lot of wheel spin is a big part of it. When I had a 4 wheel drive, it too would experience some side slipping. An experienced driver turns the wheel to meet it and keeps on going. No biggy.
Is Toyota saying that I shouldn't be driving a car at all in those conditions 'cause it's too dangerous?
COME ON TOYOTA, this is the real world! We have to live our lives without you having to do ALL the thinking for us!
Why isn't there a way to safely disable the Traction Control to allow you to at least get your car out of the patch of ice and be on our way?

nerfer · 01-29-2007, 02:16 PM

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(hill @ Jan 29 2007, 11:40 AM) [snapback]382324[/snapback]</div>

Quote:

After Consumer Affairs botched their 'findings' that the Prius IS more economical than a full blow ICE of similar size (never mind the Baby seat debacle) . . . one would think they'd do their research a little better (did I just sound like the Geico cave man ?

I think I just lost my apetite)
[/b]

You're thinking of Consumer Reports, which is generally reputable. Consumer Affairs is a group trolling for people with complaints and ready to sue. If you visit their website their only feedback option is to complain about a product. (TonyPSchaefer and I used this feature last month to complain about their disreputable articles, I never got a call from their lawyer asking who to sue, I doubt Tony did either).

naterprius · 01-29-2007, 04:22 PM

My buddy's 4wd suburban got stuck on a similarly steep driveway a few weeks ago. One of the wheels in the back and one in the front would spin, and the truck started to slide downhill. We ended up walking to the house (1/4 mile) and the next day he got out his tractor with tire chains to pull it up the hill. The next day after that the ice melted.

Wanting tires to spin is kind of a strange desire. It really only helps under certain conditions, most of which are rare.

Better tires might be in order (for the Prius and the Suburban).

Nate

Porridge · 01-29-2007, 04:35 PM

Sorry to say anything negative about the Prius in this forum, but I agree with the complaint. My new car has a differential slip where it progressively reduces the power to the wheels - not shut it off abruptly as in the case of my former Prius. (I check back here once in a while to see if people are now reporting the problems I experienced that caused me to sell the car).

It's the same problem when applying the brakes. If the wheel loses traction, the regenerative drive disengages and the real brake is engaged. The time it takes to do this is too long and causes the car to lurch forward. Anyone driving in downtown Seattle hitting a man hole cover in the wet will know this.

I know you love your Priuses - but as with ALL cars, they're not perfect. Dismissing such issues is not going to help in applying pressure to Toyota to improve their product. If I recall, members of this forum dismissed the car stalling issue saying owners probably ran out of gas. But then the truth came out, it was an issue with the car.

And I really do not care much for people who dismiss this as a user issue. It's a car for heaven sake. You put your foot on the accelarator and the car should move forward - not stop abruptly. You put your foot on the brake, it should slow the car down - not make it lurch forward.

Never mind - summer is on the way and all the rattles in the car should reduce in volume :P

richard schumacher · 01-29-2007, 04:46 PM

It's a fair complaint. It should be possible to make the traction control system limited slip, something which protects the drive system yet still allows the wheels to turn when commanded. Even so I would expect that some people who think of spinning drive wheels as a replacement for a snow shovel, snow tires, a light foot on the gas (*), or common sense and caution in treacherous situations would still be disappointed.

(*) It is not possible to stall the Prius engine, which means that going up a slippery surface even at 1 MPH is feasible; I do this on my driveway as needed. Of course this does not allow a Prius to dig itself out of snow or mud or escape oncoming traffic on gravel with jet propulsion.

01-29-2007, 01:19 PM	#6
unruhly Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 205 My Car: Package: Nominated 0 Times in 0 Posts TOTM Awards: 0 Friends: 0	OK, I'm gonna be the one to bite. I got my Prius last year at the end of our snow season (Feb 06). Since then, I've been keenly aware of the posts on the "problem" discussed in the article and have been fearful of being stranded on my way home from work. My commute to/from work has a couple of places, such as traversing the river canyon for instance, that far exceed the grades mentioned in that article. Fortunately, there's been no snow to speak of yet, but I know it's coming sooner or later. When the snow/ice do get bad, there are usually a handfull of rear wheel drive vehicles stranded on the hills, but I can't recall ever seeing a front-wheel car getting stuck. Anyway, a lot of finesse is required to ascend the hills and a lot of wheel spin is a big part of it. When I had a 4 wheel drive, it too would experience some side slipping. An experienced driver turns the wheel to meet it and keeps on going. No biggy. Is Toyota saying that I shouldn't be driving a car at all in those conditions 'cause it's too dangerous? COME ON TOYOTA, this is the real world! We have to live our lives without you having to do ALL the thinking for us! Why isn't there a way to safely disable the Traction Control to allow you to at least get your car out of the patch of ice and be on our way? __________________ 06 Black Pkg-7, Dk Grey Interior. Took delivery 02/02/06. To date: 54.1 MPG avg. Best trip: 350 Miles R/T at 61 MPG.

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01-29-2007, 12:17 PM	#1
Tempus Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Washington DC Posts: 1,693 My Car: 2004 Prius Package: #9 Nominated 0 Times in 0 Posts TOTM Awards: 0 Friends: 0	http://www.consumeraffairs.com/news04/2007..._snowbound.html Prius Shuts Down in the Snow, Reader Complains Toyota Calls Automatic Power Reduction a Safety Feature The Toyota Prius is known to occasionally shut down its hybrid engine system for no apparent reason, wear tires quickly and unevenly, even drain a battery dry when parked for an extended period. But here's one of the oddest Prius stories on file at ConsumerAffairs.Com: "When my car is on any kind of slick surface that causes one of the front wheels to slip, ALL power to the drive system is stopped," wrote Christopher of Reston, Virginia. Christopher said he first experienced the problem with his Prius "on a sloped gravel driveway in July but discounted it as a temporary thing." Then the snow fell.... --- I love they way they start every Prius article with a laundry list of their past 'findings'.

01-29-2007, 12:52 PM	#4
galaxee running WOT until out of fuel Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: central NC/ western WI Posts: 9,030 My Car: 2005 Prius Package: #5 Nominated 5 Times in 3 Posts TOTM Awards: 0 Friends: 20	oh no, my tires won't spin!

01-29-2007, 04:22 PM	#8
naterprius Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: USA Posts: 1,830 My Car: Other Non-Hybrid Package: N/A Nominated 0 Times in 0 Posts TOTM Awards: 0 Friends: 0	My buddy's 4wd suburban got stuck on a similarly steep driveway a few weeks ago. One of the wheels in the back and one in the front would spin, and the truck started to slide downhill. We ended up walking to the house (1/4 mile) and the next day he got out his tractor with tire chains to pull it up the hill. The next day after that the ice melted. Wanting tires to spin is kind of a strange desire. It really only helps under certain conditions, most of which are rare. Better tires might be in order (for the Prius and the Suburban). Nate

01-29-2007, 04:35 PM	#9
Porridge Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 92 My Car: Package: Nominated 0 Times in 0 Posts TOTM Awards: 0 Friends: 0	Sorry to say anything negative about the Prius in this forum, but I agree with the complaint. My new car has a differential slip where it progressively reduces the power to the wheels - not shut it off abruptly as in the case of my former Prius. (I check back here once in a while to see if people are now reporting the problems I experienced that caused me to sell the car). It's the same problem when applying the brakes. If the wheel loses traction, the regenerative drive disengages and the real brake is engaged. The time it takes to do this is too long and causes the car to lurch forward. Anyone driving in downtown Seattle hitting a man hole cover in the wet will know this. I know you love your Priuses - but as with ALL cars, they're not perfect. Dismissing such issues is not going to help in applying pressure to Toyota to improve their product. If I recall, members of this forum dismissed the car stalling issue saying owners probably ran out of gas. But then the truth came out, it was an issue with the car. And I really do not care much for people who dismiss this as a user issue. It's a car for heaven sake. You put your foot on the accelarator and the car should move forward - not stop abruptly. You put your foot on the brake, it should slow the car down - not make it lurch forward. Never mind - summer is on the way and all the rattles in the car should reduce in volume :P

01-29-2007, 04:46 PM	#10
richard schumacher nacreous lacquer Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: United States Posts: 4,099 My Car: 2004 Prius Package: #6 Nominated 0 Times in 0 Posts TOTM Awards: 0 Friends: 0	It's a fair complaint. It should be possible to make the traction control system limited slip, something which protects the drive system yet still allows the wheels to turn when commanded. Even so I would expect that some people who think of spinning drive wheels as a replacement for a snow shovel, snow tires, a light foot on the gas (), or common sense and caution in treacherous situations would still be disappointed. () It is not possible to stall the Prius engine, which means that going up a slippery surface even at 1 MPH is feasible; I do this on my driveway as needed. Of course this does not allow a Prius to dig itself out of snow or mud or escape oncoming traffic on gravel with jet propulsion.