Electric Cars Nearly Ready, but Batteries Are Less So

[jkash]

Electric Cars Nearly Ready, but Batteries Are Less So

The Volt is not the only car waiting for lithium-ion batteries to be roadworthy. Reports last month in Nikkan Kogyo Shimbun, a Japanese business newspaper, said that the next generation of the Toyota Prius would be delayed by six months because the carmaker had decided that lithium-ion batteries were not quite ready.

Officially, the car was not postponed because Toyota had never announced an introduction date, but such a decision would have major implications: reverting to nickel-metal hydride batteries in today’s Prius means finding room for a larger and heavier power pack. A Toyota spokesman, John Hanson, said that while the company saw “huge potential” in lithium-ion batteries, it wanted to assure future Prius buyers the same levels of affordability and reliability they experience in today’s models.

Read more.

[Blegate]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(jkash @ Jul 14 2007, 08:17 AM) [snapback]478593[/snapback]</div>

Electric Cars Nearly Ready, but Batteries Are Less So

The Volt is not the only car waiting for lithium-ion batteries to be roadworthy. Reports last month in Nikkan Kogyo Shimbun, a Japanese business newspaper, said that the next generation of the Toyota Prius would be delayed by six months because the carmaker had decided that lithium-ion batteries were not quite ready.

Officially, the car was not postponed because Toyota had never announced an introduction date, but such a decision would have major implications: reverting to nickel-metal hydride batteries in today’s Prius means finding room for a larger and heavier power pack. A Toyota spokesman, John Hanson, said that while the company saw “huge potential” in lithium-ion batteries, it wanted to assure future Prius buyers the same levels of affordability and reliability they experience in today’s models.

Read more.
[/b]

So Toyota in reading this because of the Lion battery development issues Toyota is looking to increase the size of the Nihm pack in 2008/2009+ models? Did I get that right? If so then swapping out the current Nihm pack with the new should be feasible and probably wouldn't result in also having to swap out the electronics that charges the pack. First I've heard of them increasing the size of the Nihm pack.
b

[NoMoShocks]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(jkash @ Jul 14 2007, 06:17 AM) [snapback]478593[/snapback]</div>

Electric Cars Nearly Ready, but Batteries Are Less So

The Volt is not the only car waiting for lithium-ion batteries to be roadworthy. Reports last month in Nikkan Kogyo Shimbun, a Japanese business newspaper, said that the next generation of the Toyota Prius would be delayed by six months because the carmaker had decided that lithium-ion batteries were not quite ready.

Officially, the car was not postponed because Toyota had never announced an introduction date, but such a decision would have major implications: reverting to nickel-metal hydride batteries in today’s Prius means finding room for a larger and heavier power pack. A Toyota spokesman, John Hanson, said that while the company saw “huge potential” in lithium-ion batteries, it wanted to assure future Prius buyers the same levels of affordability and reliability they experience in today’s models.

Read more.
[/b]

I wonder what kind of SPIN the reporter added in to this interview? And then it was paraprhased and SPUN again from Nikkan Kogy Shimbum.

What I am getting at is " the next generation of the Toyota Prius would be delayed by six months because the carmaker had decided that lithium-ion batteries were not quite ready." could mean that they were reverting to nickel-metal hydride batteries, or it could mean they are giving lithium-ion batteries another six months to mature.

The other paraphrased quotes may be taken out of contect.

Here is a little game of Jepardy to illustrate my point i.e. what interviewer's question might produce the Answer given?

Answer: everting to nickel-metal hydride batteries in today’s Prius means finding room for a larger and heavier power pack.

Question: Instead of delaying the introduction, why doesn't Toyota just fall back on the nickel-metal hydride batteries?
Answer: while the company saw “huge potential” in lithium-ion batteries, it wanted to assure future Prius buyers the same levels of affordability and reliability they experience in today’s models.

Question: Lithium-ion batteries have come down to a price only ##% higher than nickel-metal hydride technology and a lifespan of 3 years. Can't Toyota accept this additional cost and added maintenance requirement?

[Kablooie]

Boy, powerful batteries and solar power are the two things everyone seems to want and need but they never quite get to the market.

I've been hearing about great new cheap efficient solar energy panels and fantastic new battery technologies for years now but I haven't heard a single one announced as a real product. Everything in the energy field seems to be vaporware.

[JoeMagnusson]

Japanese business newspaper, said that the next generation of the Toyota Prius would be delayed by six months because the carmaker had decided that lithium-ion batteries were not quite ready.


Sounds to me like Toyota has designed the electronics for Lithium-ion batteries and are waiting for more inprovements in batteries.

[tripp]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(JoeMagnusson @ Jul 16 2007, 08:50 AM) [snapback]479577[/snapback]</div>

Japanese business newspaper, said that the next generation of the Toyota Prius would be delayed by six months because the carmaker had decided that lithium-ion batteries were not quite ready.
Sounds to me like Toyota has designed the electronics for Lithium-ion batteries and are waiting for more inprovements in batteries.
[/b]

They have to. They can't use a bigger NiMH battery because of Cobasys' patent restrictions. The Prius uses the biggest battery allowed by the patent. The patent runs out in either 2009 or 2015. I've read both years but I don't know which is correct. I hope it's 2009, but fear it's 2015.

[dipper]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(tripp @ Jul 16 2007, 01:53 PM) [snapback]479807[/snapback]</div>

They have to. They can't use a bigger NiMH battery because of Cobasys' patent restrictions. The Prius uses the biggest battery allowed by the patent. The patent runs out in either 2009 or 2015. I've read both years but I don't know which is correct. I hope it's 2009, but fear it's 2015.
[/b]

Maybe 2015? Notice the Honda FCX is using Li-Ion for 2009.

[prberg]

Question for tripp...

Didn't the classis prius use a bigger Nimh battery pack than the current model? Was that pack (classic model) the biggest allowed before infringing on the Cobrasys (I thought it was Chevron) patent? Or could it have been bigger? Could they be thinking of going back to that larger pack and thinking that would be enough power until they have their plug-in model ready down the road (hopefully not too far down the road)?

Funny side comment.. I was just at an auto museum that had an old electric car (small 2 seater) that could go 40 miles on a charge. Sure the newer cars are bigger (but also made of lighter materials) but I still don't get how the manufactures say they can't make a plug in that will go 40 or 50 miles when they had one 50 years ago.

-Peter B