Consumer Reports October 2004: Full/Mild Hybrids

[JJay]

In the latest October 2004 Consumer Reports p.16 they show two basic hybrid designs:

Full Hybrid: Toyota Prius; Ford Escape Hybrid
Mild Hybrid: Chevy Silverado; GMC Sierra; Honda Accord, Civic, Insight

They say "With mild hybrids, a small electric motor supplements the gasoline engine when necessary, but it cannot power the vehicle by itself."

Interesting article. I didn't know that about the Honda Hybrids.

[KMO]

Except that of course in the Silverado the motor can't even supplement the gasoline engine.

[Varko]

At first I thought the Silverado motor was just for raising and lowering the power windows!


Then I got curious and went to the Chevy site to see what it was all about. The truck is a generator for four 120-volt AC outlets, which only work when it is parked. I guess that is for the tailgate parties where you need your refridgerator plugged in to keep your steaks and beer cold. :silly:


The hybrid technology adds nothing to the operation of the truck - Unless you are a late sleeper and need to plug in your coffee pot and toaster after you get to work!


Ok, I guess it could be useful if you were a contractor, but to call this a hybrid...please. :crazyeyes:

[hdrygas]

They need to go to three levels!!!! :guns: Full, Mild and Barely Hybrid. GM is riding a wave that will wipe them out. This is bad, This it very bad. GM has no hybrid technology but wasn’t to "ride the wave" They bet the farm on hydrogen and lost for now. Their "skate board if it ever makes it" is a great piece of engineering, once they work out the distance bugs, and the distribution system is developed. Let me add that we need a few green ways of generating Hydrogen before we go ahead with Hydrogen.

[Rickster]

Just to be clear...

GM's "light" hybrids use the electric motor for power steering, A/C, and other mechanical accessories as well as the electrical systems (and outlets). Since they can generate electricity through regenerative braking as well as from the gas engine, this does provide a tiny increase in mileage even though the motor can't help propel the vehicle.

Honda's hybrid system does allow for the electric motor to assist the gas engine in powering the wheels, but the gas engine has to be running to move the car. (Honda says their system is built for maximum adaptability: all they need is two inches of free space and they can attach it to any engine in any vehicle.)

Only Toyota's hybrid system (including the Classic Prius-derived system licensed for the Ford Escape) can drive without using the gas engine all the time.

[Frank Hudon]

include Citroen (sp) in Europe jumping on the auto stop/auto start system that GM uses, and it cost the same as the one without it. Read that they figure it will save 4-5%on the fleet average. Small car, crowded narrow streets, many stops in a short distance. They evaluated the full hybrid system and concluded that it was not cost effective.

[KMO]

Except that I don't think that Citroen are calling it anything more than a "stop/start" system.

The line has been blurred a bit, because some stop-start systems can manage a small amount of regenerative braking, thus improving efficiency slightly more than just the engine stop.

Now, regenerative braking is a key feature in real-life hybrids, just as it is in pure-electric cars, and it's a great idea to add it to pure-ICE cars, but having it doesn't make the car a hybrid any more than, say, just fitting a Prius-style electric A/C system would.

What we need is some snappy, easy-to-understand terminology to cover these systems so they don't feel they have to hijack the "hybrid" label to explain it.

I'd suggest just calling them "stop/start" systems, which appears to be what the UK motoring press is calling them. You could then split them into mild ones that just stop the engine, and strong ones which can perform regenerative braking.

[Frank Hudon]

that's exactly what they are calling it. stop/start, and as far as I'm concerened it's a good idea. In fact I'll bet that the N/A auto manufacturers are looking into it as we speak/type. What would, say 4.5% of the fuel used in N/A amount to, Millions of gallons per year if not billions.

[DaveinOlyWA]

so the escape is a true hybrid... i had not known that.. but i am wary of anything that american car companies do as they have a track record of doing what is right for their bottom line without any regard to our needs.

a telling line in a movie I saw, when a guy working for one of the auto makers; his job was to determine if the payout from lawsuits would exceed the cost of a recall for a vehicle safety defect.

if the cost was higher, then the recall happened. if it did not, then the company took their chances that some would not sue...

as bad as that sounds, i can easily believe that that is what they really do.

[kingofgix]

Let me add that we need a few green ways of generating Hydrogen before we go ahead with Hydrogen.

Just want to say ditto to that! The whole hydrogen economy is a boatload of %#@& until/unless there is a substantial capability to generate hydrogen from renewable energy sources. Bush's funding hydrogen projects is a scam to ensure our continued dependence on fossil fuels, because the only realistic way we ahve to generate hydrogen is to use fossil (or nuclear) fuel. Until we have substantial renewable capability, hydrogen is essentially useless as a fuel.