affordable 100 mpg carbon composite car (OT?)

[Wiyosaya]

July 17, 2008 Britain's Axon claims that its newly patented mass-production techniques will make carbon composite car frames and bodywork even cheaper than their metal counterparts - and only 40% as heavy. What a revolutionary technology this could be - the power to weight ratio of any vehicle on the planet could be dramatically increased for no extra cost! The company plans to release a highly affordable 500cc passenger car making at least 100mpg from a basic petrol engine in 2010, and Axon is confident its simple, lightweight solution to the fuel economy challenge will be highly competitive against the big competition in the Progressive Automotive X-Prize contest.

Full article.
Perhaps this is somewhat off topic since this is not a hybrid, but with the claimed MPG of this car, I figured I would post it anyway.

I would love to see this become reality. Maybe it will give the major auto makers the "kick" they need to make their vehicles with light-weight materials. I would love to see a Prius or other hybrid made this way.

Thanks to this site.

[Godiva]

All I could think of reading your post was....if a regular car could get 100 mpg.....what would a Prius get?

[PriuStorm]

I would buy that car before I'd buy an Aptera

[F8L]

This is based on the same concept that RMI's Fiberforge Inc. has been showcasing for a few years. It's obviously a great idea. Liek Amory Lovins say's "Triple the efficiency of the car" through the use of this new carbon composite technology and tooling process. So a hybrid or plug-in Hybrid with it's weight cut in half could easily get into the 200+mpg range even with current battery technology.

[effwitt]

I'm curious what would happen with an 8 MPH rear-end collision. How much of a carbon-fiber mess would be created? What would the repair costs be compared to a more conventional car of the same purchase price?

That said, it would be so cool to have a car made with a significant amount of carbon-fiber.

[Wiyosaya]

Originally Posted by effwitt

I'm curious what would happen with an 8 MPH rear-end collision. How much of a carbon-fiber mess would be created? What would the repair costs be compared to a more conventional car of the same purchase price?

That said, it would be so cool to have a car made with a significant amount of carbon-fiber.

The only scientific way to figure this out would be to crash test the vehicle.

However, with contemporary engineering software, it is possible to simulate what would happen and engineer the car to achieve minimal damage. Doing so, however, might push the cost of the vehicle way up because you might have to use more expensive materials to achieve this.

There are many types of carbon fiber out there, and if one uses sandwich principles, the property of the finished sandwich will depend on the properties of the core material and, much more so, the properties of the core facings - the facings are the actual carbon fiber.

Their goal in this car seems to be to keep it low cost. Stiff carbon fiber costs quite a bit more than not so stiff carbon fiber. Its my guess that since they are aiming for "affordable," they will be using not so stiff carbon fiber. In general, the stiffer the fiber, the stiffer the resulting composite, but there are trade offs as "stiffer" might mean more brittle.

After passing that bit of wind we will have to wait until it hits the market to see their test data.

[Rybold]

Virtually everything else in society has shifted from metal to plastic. Fifty years ago, everything was made of metal (and wood), but today, a LARGE percentage of items are now made of plastic. Carbon fiber may not be "plastic," but they are both organic materials (chemistry; carbon-based). I look at my father's old toys, radios, and car from the 1950s, and it's all made of metal. I look at what is available today and the same products are all made of plastic on the outside. Sit in the interior of a 1950s car and then sit in the interior of a new Toyota - it's all plastic! And that's not a bad thing. It's lightweight and costs less to transport around with you everywhere.

F8L, in light of your "200mpg" rough extrapolation ... I wonder if this means solar panels would be more viable. A solar panel is not going to power a car alone, but it's utility due to a lighter weight vehicle would improve.

[F8L]

Originally Posted by Rybold

F8L, in light of your "200mpg" rough extrapolation ... I wonder if this means solar panels would be more viable. A solar panel is not going to power a car alone, but it's utility due to a lighter weight vehicle would improve.

It should if one assumes that solar panels continue to become more efficient as well. The same applies for any energy source like CNG and hydrogen. With less mass to move one could go much futher on a "fill-up", handle better, and be faster/quicker. A lightweight vehicle also reduces the amount of damage done during a collision as well assuming the majority of drivers are using such light vehicles. Panels will be designed to deflect impact and/or to crumple zones much like they do with race cars. Repairs could be made less expensive due to the reduced amount of bodywork required when refitting composite panels, especially if they panels come pre-impregnated with color.

[JamesWyatt]

I saw a TV special a few months back and a composite car developer was featured. That stuff is as tough as hell. They took a big fender and beat it all to crap with a giant sledgehammer. Don't know how it would do in a real wreck, but it was impressive.

The problem is gas has to get very expensive before the increased cost of the materials would become commercially viable.

[effwitt]

It's great to see that carbon fiber can be made more durable. Earlier this year the Red Bull Formula 1 cars had a couple of minor "offs" hitting a few bumps on the grass and the cars literally broke into hundreds of pieces. A few years ago the FIA and Ferrari did some work using Kevlar with the carbon fiber to reduce the number of shards produced from even small accidents, but I don't recall anything coming from it. Granted, a Formula 1 car and a passenger car do have a few small differences with its design goals, but I was worried about the tendency of carbon fiber to shatter when hit.