Prius A123 Battery Fire Report

[hill]

Originally Posted by efusco

Wow, impressive write up and fire.
The thoughts of a DIY PHEV conversion have just taken a few steps backward for me...one loose connection can cause a catastrophic failure like that...yikes. And a DIY project would have none of the above mentioned protections such as temp sensors and all.

I hope the new Hymotion conversion has taken this situation into account in the new design.

Conversion vs OEM really isn't the main deal. Lest we forget, this happens to the most technical groups as it does to shade tree mechanics/electricians. NASA's 'Challenger' Shuttle blew up because a known O ring problem finally failed under the very conditions they knew it would failed. They failed to re-design. They failed to order new parts. They robbed used parts from Peter to pay Paul. They ignored engineers when they waved red flags about the known issues. Lack of integrity ... arrogance ... sloppy ... lazy work ethics. So legislators will have to make laws to prevent it. Sadly, most laws are written in the blood of others.

[Godiva]

Well, I hope Hymotion is looking at this carefully and doing any redesign indicated.

I saw two Hymotion A123s installed on two fleet cars for SDGE. Hymotion requires that one of their trained installers do it. These guys were flown down from San Francisco to do it.

[Danny]

This is news... moving it to the News forum.

I extracted a picture from the report and the summary and included it in the original post. Thanks for posting this, cstaszak!

[Stefx]

I wonder if the insurance refused to compensate the owner of the car?

[dmckinstry]

Originally Posted by efusco

Wow, impressive write up and fire.
The thoughts of a DIY PHEV conversion have just taken a few steps backward for me...one loose connection can cause a catastrophic failure like that...yikes. And a DIY project would have none of the above mentioned protections such as temp sensors and all.

I hope the new Hymotion conversion has taken this situation into account in the new design.

Actually, there's no reason you couldn't put in temperature sensors.

What disturbs me is that Hymotion is supposed to have authorized installers.

I would think they'd be taking more care in being sure all connections are tight and locked. And I'm confused. Were the washers/spacers actually placed under the bolt head, rather than under the nut?


Dave M.

[miscrms]

Originally Posted by dmckinstry

Actually, there's no reason you couldn't put in temperature sensors.

What disturbs me is that Hymotion is supposed to have authorized installers.

I would think they'd be taking more care in being sure all connections are tight and locked. And I'm confused. Were the washers/spacers actually placed under the bolt head, rather than under the nut?


Dave M.

This is not a Hymotion conversion.

Rob

[burritos]

Any chance the owner would dare try to have the toyota warranty enforced?

[Godiva]

Originally Posted by burritos

Any chance the owner would dare try to have the toyota warranty enforced?

I expect it will be a finger-pointing blame game between Hybrids Plus and the installer with the poor Prius owner caught in the middle.

Whether insurance company will pay anything will depend on the exact policy the owner has.

I expect with the information available in this post, the owner will be looking to sue both installer and Hybrids Plus. I hope there's no fine print in anything he signed absolving them of anything that happens no matter what.

[efusco]

Originally Posted by hill

Conversion vs OEM really isn't the main deal. Lest we forget, this happens to the most technical groups as it does to shade tree mechanics/electricians. NASA's 'Challenger' Shuttle blew up because a known O ring problem finally failed under the very conditions they knew it would failed. They failed to re-design. They failed to order new parts. They robbed used parts from Peter to pay Paul. They ignored engineers when they waved red flags about the known issues. Lack of integrity ... arrogance ... sloppy ... lazy work ethics. So legislators will have to make laws to prevent it. Sadly, most laws are written in the blood of others.

Unquestionably true...but I have to tell you that this shade-tree modder is MUCH more likely to make a critical mistake out of ignorance and lack of formal training that it is likely that a systematic tested and checked OEM install or even a well researched and professionally installed after-market product. I don't expect the world to be perfect...but I'm aware that my deficiencies in a matter like this are much greater than a large company with trained professionals.

Also, a DIY job is much more likely to fail...i know of at least 3 people who've had battery failures/melt-downs on their DIY PHEV conversions on the Prius...and many of them were much better equipt than I to do the job. I simply couldn't be sure to have enough temp sensors, or confidence that I was using the right bus bars...maybe I'd forget a washer and the tight nut would vibrate loose, maybe I don't really know how to test and balance my batteries properly...more importantly, there are potential errors I could make that I'm not even aware of making them all the more likely.

The bottom line for me is that the expected benefit of a DIY job is far far less than the potential for costly mistakes on my part b/c of my ignorance and lack of training and it just makes more sense to respect my own deficiencies and the deficiencies inherent in a DIY project than to just do it for fun.

[PriusSport]

A123 is a company owned by an MIT professor, which has invented a new Li ion cell based on lithium iron phosphate. I don't think GM owns them. Their batteries are being used by a lot of companies, including Black & Decker. Toyota is looking at them for the next generation Prius.

The fire here appears to be unrelated to the battery technology--due rather to faulty assembly.