Considering a Prius - Advise me!

[Steken]

Just joined this forum so I could find out info on the car!

What I am looking for is honest opinions on the car, not some "Oh the car is super" bull, but whether the car is good and if you think it is for me. Normally this might be a strange thing to ask, but I get the feeling this may well be quite different to other cars!!

At the moment, I drive a Lexus IS200. It is a fabulous car, but the new model means the car has changed. Although my company pay for the fuel, the fact that it has poor fuel economy has always been it's biggest let down. Other than that though, I have never had a single problem with it. Comfortable with good equipment and a firm controllable drive. On average I do about 15000 miles a year, mixture of all sort of roads really. I drive at 80-90mph on motorways and like to have a good stereo as in the Lexus.

So far I have read the brochure, visited the website and been to a dealers - they didn't have one on the forecourt but have had one delivered which will be put on display Tuesday. Of the pictures I've seen I fancy a T4/T5 with leather interior. Generally, the pictures I've seen look like a similar standard of interior and equipment to my Lexus - I can live without folding mirrors and heated seats (I think!!).

Why do I want one? Well I am due to change my car at work and I get infinite choice - paying the extra myself. I got the Lexus, because at the time they were rare and a cross between luxury and boy-racer! Three years on, with a two year-old son I now really need a hatchback. I have a professional job so I need a car that doesn't look like a "Sales-Rep". I trust Lexus/Toyota build quality and I guess the Prius is just a bit unusual - most people in the UK haven't even heard of it, and even less have seen one!

My main fears are - Will it be a slug in acceleration? If top speed is 90mph, how comfortable will it be at 90mph on a motorway run? ...and finally....Is this car just a novelty which will wear off after three months leaving me with a car I hate for a couple of years?

So before I, hopefully, test drive one this week - I would appreciate your opinions and advice.

Cheers
Steve

[hycamguy07]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Steken @ May 28 2006, 04:51 PM) [snapback]262112[/snapback]</div>

Just joined this forum so I could find out info on the car!

What I am looking for is honest opinions on the car, not some "Oh the car is super" bull, but whether the car is good and if you think it is for me. Normally this might be a strange thing to ask, but I get the feeling this may well be quite different to other cars!!

At the moment, I drive a Lexus IS200. It is a fabulous car, but the new model means the car has changed. Although my company pay for the fuel, the fact that it has poor fuel economy has always been it's biggest let down. Other than that though, I have never had a single problem with it. Comfortable with good equipment and a firm controllable drive. On average I do about 15000 miles a year, mixture of all sort of roads really. I drive at 80-90mph on motorways and like to have a good stereo as in the Lexus.

So far I have read the brochure, visited the website and been to a dealers - they didn't have one on the forecourt but have had one delivered which will be put on display Tuesday. Of the pictures I've seen I fancy a T4/T5 with leather interior. Generally, the pictures I've seen look like a similar standard of interior and equipment to my Lexus - I can live without folding mirrors and heated seats (I think!!).

Why do I want one? Well I am due to change my car at work and I get infinite choice - paying the extra myself. I got the Lexus, because at the time they were rare and a cross between luxury and boy-racer! Three years on, with a two year-old son I now really need a hatchback. I have a professional job so I need a car that doesn't look like a "Sales-Rep". I trust Lexus/Toyota build quality and I guess the Prius is just a bit unusual - most people in the UK haven't even heard of it, and even less have seen one!

My main fears are - Will it be a slug in acceleration? If top speed is 90mph, how comfortable will it be at 90mph on a motorway run? ...and finally....Is this car just a novelty which will wear off after three months leaving me with a car I hate for a couple of years?
So before I, hopefully, test drive one this week - I would appreciate your opinions and advice.

Cheers
Steve
[/b]

First off you should be choosing the car for your own reasons..
*The USA models accelerate 0-60 in 9.5 to 10.0 seconds
*Top governed speed is 109 mph (at 85mph the car runs just fine )
*I would get the loaded model so it shows you are conserving gas but are not sacrificing luxury..(smug) <_<
*No one can say if your going to hate the car in three years but your self..
*Prius's have been selling strong since 02 here in the USA and even stronger after the changed the look from the Echo to the new body style, heck the dealers have waiting lists on these cars here..
*My 04' I purchased new and love it, I would only trade it in for another one or maybe a hybrid hilander.
But I will never own anyother vehicle make, Im sold on toyotas releibility & safety records I wouldnt mind owning a Loaded Toyota Crown (their luxury car model) but it would just sit on blocks in the garage ..

The Lexus Rh400 hybrid is a nice SUV if you can afford it

Good Luck!

[Steken]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(priusguy04 @ May 28 2006, 04:09 PM) [snapback]262119[/snapback]</div>

First off you should be choosing the car for your own reasons..
*The USA models accelerate 0-60 in 9.5 to 10.0 seconds
*Top governed speed is 109 mph (at 85mph the car runs just fine )
*I would get the loaded model so it shows you are conserving gas but are not sacrificing luxury..(smug) <_<
*No one can say if your going to hate the car in three years but your self..
*Prius's have been selling strong since 02 here in the USA and even stronger after the changed the look from the Echo to the new body style, heck the dealers have waiting lists on these cars here..
*My 04' I purchased new and love it, I would only trade it in for another one or maybe a hybrid hilander.
But I will never own anyother vehicle make, Im sold on toyotas releibility & safety records I wouldnt mind owning a Loaded Toyota Crown (their luxury car model) but it would just sit on blocks in the garage ..

The Lexus Rh400 hybrid is a nice SUV if you can afford it

Good Luck!
[/b]

Thanks for that! I know some of my comments may have sounded a bit odd, but I was just trying to give plenty of info!!

It sounds like there are many manufacturers of Hybrid cars in the US, but here in the UK there is only Lexus and Toyota - and they only have 3 models between them. They are Lexus RX400h and GS300h and of course the Prius. Maybe this might explain why I ask so many questions of a hybrid car - we just don't know how they compare to a 'normal' car over here!

On another aspect, the CVT drive is unheard of in a car over here. The only place I have heard of it being used is in motorcycles. So this car has a lot of unknowns for me.

On another note - Did you know that a Prius over here costs nearly double what it costs you, T5 is just over £20,000 with the leather to cost another £1,850! I'm sure you can do the conversion!

[Jeannie]

The best advice I've ever seen on this forum is to rent a Prius for a few days. Call around to some Toyota dealers and see if you can find one to rent. and take an 'extended test drive' over your typical driving routes to see if you would like it.

I didn't rent one - I didn't even realize that was an option at all - but I bought one after wrecking my old car about 6 weeks ago. For me, I find it very roomy and comfortable, and luxurious compared to my old car. But that's me, and I might as well be one of the glossy sales brochures in a dealership or the fancy 'flash' videos on Toyota sites on the Internet. I bought my Prius after test-driving a few other cars and less than 10 minutes test drive in a Prius - but only you can judge whether it's a good car for you.

Happy car shopping!

[daniel]

This is probably not the best place to get "totally unbiased" views. This is a Prius enthusiasts site, and just about everyone here thinks the Prius is the greatest thing since sliced bread. I personally think it's the coolest car in the universe. That said...

The "CVT" statement is misleading. What the Prius has is not a CVT. It actually has no transmission, and no clutch. The drive train is a power-split device (PSD) which allows the engine to spin over a wide range of RPMs for any given vehicle speed. But "CVT" gives an extremely misleading idea of how this happens.

The Prius will not be as comfortable as a Lexus. I like it, but my Prius cost 1/3 as much as my sister's Lexus, and for luxury the two cars are not comparable.

Many people have reported (including myself) that in a strong crosswind at freeway speeds, the Prius is skittish. In this respect, my old Civic was better.

Those are the two items that, based on your original post, I think might be of concern to you.

On the other hand, you will have the EV button standard (we don't get it here in America, unless we install it ourselves as an unauthorized after-market mod) and that is super-cool. Since you'll be getting the fully-loaded model, you'll have air bags all the way around and VSC (two important safety features -- and VSC is normally available only in much more expensive cars) and SKS, which is also cool. You'll have an excellent, roomy car, and if you are as fascinated as most of us on PriusChat are by gagetry, you will have great fun just knowing how unconventional the workings under the hood are.

For me, the Prius has a lot of acceleration (due to the high torque characteristic of electric motors). It's not a muscle car, but it's fast off the line, and still has plenty of oomph for passing a semi going 75 mph. My old Civic took a long time to get from 75 to 85 for passing. The Prius does it easily and quickly.

I cannot predict whether you will still love the car in two years. But I bought mine in January, 2004, and I still think it's the coolest car in the universe. (... Well, maybe except for the tzero, which costs US$200,000 and there's only 4 of them.)

[Godiva]

No, it's not a slug at acceleration. Top speed is, I believe, 110 mph.

That said, I don't think you want to drive that fast with a two year old in the car.

And.....you may find you change your driving style to up your fuel economy as the car has great feedback in that regard.

BTW if you ever drive in to London, you don't have to pay that fee other cars do. I believe the Prius is exempt. Don't know what other perks you might have.

And the hatchback is great. The floor of the cargo area is flush with the back bumper so when you open the hatch you don't have to lift up and over to get things in the back. There is also a smaller storage compartment below the floor of the cargo area. It holds a surprising amount of stuff.

I hope you can eventually test drive one. I think you'll like it. Maybe you can find a local owner willing to take you for a spin.

[donee]

Hi Steken,

The CVT is not like anything else on the road, mechanical CVT or other. Its like an electrical Torque Converter in its function. Torque from the engine is split into the wheel gear train and off into a generator. The overspeed of the engine ends up in the generator. The generator converts the overspeed torque into electricity for the main drive motor. This is kinda what an automatic transmission torque converter does, only instead of using oil as the fluid, its using electrons. Extra electricty not needed by the drive motor goes into the battery and can be called on later. The system is robust, and with a slight downhill slope during summer weather one can cruise up to 41 mph on pure electric drive for about 2 miles before the engine must come back on. I regularily take advantage of this on feeder roads around here. Check out this link for some good information: http://www.ecrostech.com/prius/original/PriusFrames.htm .

The synergy part of this thing (its called the Hybrid Synergy Drive or HSD) is that in doing the transmission this way, the generator does quadruple duty. Its the engine starter, car alternator, and series hybrid generator, besides providing the function of the extra gears in a transmission. The transmission only has the power splitting device which is similar to planetary gear set used in a standard automatic transmission, a chain drive and a gear set to reach down to the axle. In comparison an automatic transmission has 4 to 6 of these planetary gear sets and the clutches to switch them on/off shaft.

So far this system has shown excellent reliability - better than a standard car. Taxi Cab fleets in Washington D.C., Vancouver and Tokyo have had good life out of the vehicles. The generator is so robust in comparson to the starter and alternator in a standard car, it does not need repair for the life of the vehicle. Which is very unlike the service lifes of starters and alternators on standard cars. One Taxi Driver in Vancouver has gone through two Prii already in excess of 150 K miles. This kind of service usually requires a standard automatic transmission rebuild during the life the car.

Yes, we have other Hybrids here in the USA. But the Prius accounts for half the hybrid car sales here, by itself. Toyota has launched the Camry hybrid recently. I saw one at my local dealer when I was there to pick up oil drain sealing washers yesterday. We also have a small Ford SUV hybrid called the Escape which uses a system very similar to the HSD. Ford decided to pay patent royalties to Toyota as the system was so close. There are also the Honda Hybrids - A hybrid version of the Civic and a small (even smaller than the original Mini!) two seater called the Insight. The Insight is a series Hybrid (versus the parallel series capabilities of the Prius) system - the engine only runs a generator and all motive power is from an electric motor. It gets similar mileage to the Prius. The Civic Hybrid in its second generation gets a little less mileage than a Prius. The Civic hybrid system uses a motor/generator inbetween the engine and transmission. Its called a IMA, or integrated motor assist. Otherwise, the Honda Civic Hybrid is very similar to a non-hybrid car, and thus similarily reliable.

Hope this helps fill you in.

I was exposed to the Hybrid concept in college many years ago and have been watching things develop. Really thought GM was going to pull the trigger when I heard that the replacement for the Saturn SL2 was called the ION, but NOoooo! I plunged in and bought a Prius earlier this year. I am very happy with the Prius. I visit the gas station half as often, but do spend a little more than with my previous 1.9 liter DOHC small car. So fuel consumption is just over 1/2 of the privious car.

Here are some of the differences between the Prius and a standard car. The Prius is not a quick starter off-the line. It starts out from a stop in electric drive then the engine comes on. Which is really good for stop and go traffice (engine wont come on at all). But for a quick start it takes about a second for the engine to deliver torque from being turned on, after about a second before the Prius will decide to turn on the engine. Even though the horsepower is somewhat lower, when starting an acceleration with the engine on , the Prius above 30 mph is quicker than my previous car (1.9 liter DOHC aluminum block 125 hp small car). I attribute this to the CVT and electric motor advantages. Another thing about the car is that in really cold weather start-up, the battery has very little power, and functions mostly as a big capacitor for the CVT. The capacitor having allot of mass takes a long time to warm up in these cold conditions. The difference between -15 C operation and 30 C operation is dramatic. My experience is from about 42 mpg to 58 mpg on my daily commute. And say from 20 second 0-60 mph to 11 second (remember 1 to 2 of those seconds is just getting the engine on).

[JackDodge]

Only you can decide whether a Prius is right for you or not. If all that you have to choose from is a Lexus or a Prius, though, you certainly have the best options. Only the Prius and the Honda Civic hybrids are going to give you the best mileage possible but the Prius is the sharpest of the two. The Lexus hybrids are more performance enhancements to gas-only twins. Perhaps the best way to look at a Prius is its set of good points: It shuts off the gas engine when you're stuck in traffic so it's a great car to have if you get in traffic jams or snarls a lot. It's a quiet, pleasant ride that is well designed and very classy for its price range. It gets even better mileage than a compact or subcompact car (we look at a Pruis on this forum as a midsize sedan) but it rides like a Camry. It's not what I'd consider an expensive car (12 to 15 thousand pounds) but it has several features that you'd usually find in a, well, Lexus. It's a fine addition to Toyota's stable of reliable cars. It's cheap to drive because of its mileage, it's better for the environment because it uses less gasoline than most vehicles on the road and pollutes less because of that. You've got hundreds of Prius owners who can give you tips and help when you need it and we can make you laugh while getting informed. You can't get a better deal than that. Well, and, the Cool Chicks in Black Prii Club members are easy on the eye.

[hdrygas]

The CVT in the above post is not rally a CVT as it has been used in the past. It is a plenary gear set. Different. Torque at the low end from the MG2 (motor generator 2 is very good) 0-10 is OK and most of that is the MG2. The Ice is a Atkins cycle engine and provides power in its optimal range, supplemented by MG2 as necessary. You really need to drive one. The total lack of shifting is noticeable. Take care with the breaking as it is different than conventional hydraulic brakes. They have a bit of delay. Brake by wire and regenerative breaking is a bit different. Feel it out to begin with. You will not see the hesitation of hydraulic breaking. You can just drive this car, but the car will teach you how to drive it. It very much tries to act like a conventional car but it is not.

[Jack Straw]

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