2008 Honda Civic Hybrid vs. 2008 Toyota Prius (#5)

[Spectra]

All the more reason to keep speed down & derive full MPG value out of the Prius

[miscrms]

Originally Posted by skguh

Well, again, due diligence must mean something different than I'm accustomed to--and I'm all for 'frilly,' but when 'frilly' becomes the difference, then it would follow that everything else is a wash--which it isn't. If you're happy with your decision, good for you. It's my opinion that the two vehicles are vastly different.

Don't get me wrong, I think the Prius is definitely the superior choice on many levels. However, it is interesting that the GreenHybrid numbers for the HCH and Prius are 46.1 and 47.5mpg respectively. Not as big a difference as you might expect given Honda's much weaker hybrid system. I think Toyota's synergy drive is certainly superior to IMA, but you have to give Honda some props for overall design efficiency. The Insight was a shining example of this, and it seems they carried a lot of that over into the Civic. Not so much on the Accord unfortunately.

Rob

[Mr.Vanvandenburg]

I fit an object 8.5 ft long into my Prius and there was some inches left over with hatch closed. It was a complete exhaust assembly for another car which I ordered, not realizing how long it was. In a quandry as to how to transport it, I tried the Prius and it fit. The front seat, without headrest, folds nearly flat to the folded rear seat giving a huge space. I am pretty sure two persons could make a bed in the Prius.

[uvm1969]

I am 6'3" and my son is the same size. He had two college buddies visit over the holidays, and the three of them sat comfortably in the back on my Prius on a trip. You could not put large people like that in a Civic Hybrid.

[JRMurray]

I really don't see what the problem with looking out the back is. The Prius has fine visibility, better than our Accord, and definitely better than a standard SUV.

I agree. The rear view out the window of the Prius is far better than that of my previous car, a Mercedes-Benz C230. IMO, the rearview camera is very useful to fine-tune one's position in the last stages of backing up--for instance, to gauge how close one is getting to things like garage walls, the car behind, etc.

[borschelrh]

Interesting. I have both cars as well. I have a 2003 Civic hybrid with 98,000 miles and a new 2008 Prius with 350 miles. I get better mileage (so far) in the Civic and I drive it like a mad man in the DC metro traffic. I never get less than 42 mpg despite max effort of the engine etc. If I tone it down and drive gently I usually exceed 50 mpg in the civic. I haven't gotten better than 36 mpg in my new Prius and am driving it very gently.

My civic which I drive to and from work 30 miles each way daily is really just a plain old crappy civic with a hybrid afterthought engine. The rear seats don't fold down which is a real pain if you need to carry anything. The batteries are the rear seat back so it can get warm in the back seat.

I added an after market sunroof, and good stero system as well as an XM radio, and a cheap Magellan GPS. It is an ugly mess on the dash but it gives me the same functionality as the Prius. I got the full tax credit in 2003 and have beat this car to death and it still is running fine. I also had a major rear end collision but it didn't damage the batteries or anythiong else. I replaced the crappy soft tires and got a better ride and the same mileage. The dealer was always screwing around with the software for the engine controls so I ended up having my local gas station re-install the 2003 program, and my mileage returened to 50 mpg plus. It had dropped to 42 mpg afetr the "upgrade".

The Prius is arguably a much nicer car but was also $8,000 more than my civic. I am not seeing good mileage at all and am trying to maximize mileage while still driving fairly normally. I get better mileage in the civic driving very hard so there is definately an advantage for the civic. Maybe it is a problem with the programming? I also have a manual transmission on my civic which let's me choose the best power/torque for the situation. The Prius certainly has a much nicer ride but is fairly gutless compared to the civic. The seats suck terribly, are not adjustable, and have no lumbar adjustment. Neither does the Civic but it doesn't pretend to be a nice car. This is inexcusable at this price range for the Prius and don't give me crap about the extra hybrid costs. These have dropped significantly. I am very glad I am only 5 foot 10 inches because anyone taller would be banging their head on the ceiling.

The hybrid battery in the Civic lasts about 10 minutes with hard driving (such as a long uphill) then you are back to only using the gas engine and it drives like a 1964 VW beetle (gutless as hell having only 72 hp). It then takes about 10 minutes to recharge. If you are driving in the WV hills you will hate the Civic hybrid.

So, it seems to me that the comfort and technology advantages go to the Prius. I am also supposing that in a Prius that operates normally (assuming mine doesn't) that you have to really pay attention to the gauges to get even reasonable mileage. You don't have to do that in the Civic (at least as long as the battery lasts).

So I would buy a used Civic as a beater commuter car and have the Prius for my long trip car. My wife doesn't drive much and we use "her" Prius pretty much only for longer trips and going to the grocery (plus she won't ride in my Civic unless she absolutely has to - Yeah it looks like it has seen 98,000 miles). Oh, I haven't had the Civic serviced for about 30,000 miles (since the warranty ended) and it still runs fine! I can't go without my car for the day required to get it serviced and I can't take my wife's car to work as I still don't have plates on it and can't get it onto my work site without permanent plates. It took 3 months longer than predicted to get our Prius and we had already sole her 06 Acura TL so were down to 1 car for 3 months. One nice thing about Hondas is that they are hard to kill.

[F8L]

Originally Posted by borschelrh

Interesting. I have both cars as well. I have a 2003 Civic hybrid with 98,000 miles and a new 2008 Prius with 350 miles. I get better mileage (so far) in the Civic and I drive it like a mad man in the DC metro traffic. I never get less than 42 mpg despite max effort of the engine etc. If I tone it down and drive gently I usually exceed 50 mpg in the civic. I haven't gotten better than 36 mpg in my new Prius and am driving it very gently.

That is probably your problem right there. Bad driving techniques.

The Prius certainly has a much nicer ride but is fairly gutless compared to the civic. The seats suck terribly, are not adjustable, and have no lumbar adjustment. Neither does the Civic but it doesn't pretend to be a nice car. This is inexcusable at this price range for the Prius and don't give me crap about the extra hybrid costs. These have dropped significantly. I am very glad I am only 5 foot 10 inches because anyone taller would be banging their head on the ceiling.

The Prius is quicker than your older Civic. The Civic may feel faster because of the manual tranny but it is not faster. I'm 6'3" and have zero headroom issues with the Prius. In fact I can wear a Resistol "cowboy" hat and still have some headroom left so your opinion on headroom is incorrect unless you have a VERY large forehead. lol

2003 Civic Hybrid:

0-60 (SEC): 11.3
1/4 miles (SEC @ MPH): 18.0 @ 75.4

2005 Prius:

0 - 60 (sec): 10.4
1/4 Mile (sec @ mph): 17.5 @ 78.7 (this is similar to the ET/MPG I got when racing my 2005 Prius)

So, it seems to me that the comfort and technology advantages go to the Prius. I am also supposing that in a Prius that operates normally (assuming mine doesn't) that you have to really pay attention to the gauges to get even reasonable mileage. You don't have to do that in the Civic (at least as long as the battery lasts).

Not really. I can drive like a normal person obeying the speed limits and never once glance at the guages and still pull off a high 40mpg tank. If I try hard then I can pull off a 58-62mpg tank. If you can't pull off a 45mpg tank in your Prius then you have something wrong whether is be a terrible commute, broken car, or terrible driving. I would try to figure out what it is so you can correct it and start enjoying the car more.

[borschelrh]

I appreciate your comments. Don't get me wrong. I think the Prius a better choice than the Civic at the same price point. If the Civic were $19K then there wouldn't be any thinking about it at all. Yes, I think there is something very wrong with my Prius and will see on the second tank of gas. If the low mileage continues I will head back to the dealer. I will also check the oil level and tire pressures but assume the dealer dd that right. I am exactly at 375 miles on my first tank which is nearly empty. I know how to squeezemaximum mileage out of a hybrid and have gotten 52 mpg on a 1,300 mile trip in my Civic. I am driving the Prius to get maximum mileage, so it is the car or really bad gas. I once got a low 32 mpg in my Civic buying poor gas from a local Sunoco station. I always get 5 mpg lower when I buy gas from them (it is across the street so convenient but I avoid them if at all possible). So, I know gas can also cause this. Perhaps the dealer (who I really disliked immensely: Darcars, Silver Spring, MD) used cheap gas which wouldn't surprise me. These guys were as flaky as I have ever experienced. It was the worst purchasing experience I ever had and I would suggest avoiding them like the plague. I deeply regret purchasing my car there and am dreading trying to get service.

I am suprised a 6'3" guy has room. I measured the space above my head and it is only 3 inches. I am 5'10". But, I have a long torso and relatively short legs. I do wish the seqat had a height adjustment. I drive with the seat fully upright, you probably recline it some. I have a lot of back trouble and these seats are the first thing I am going to replace. But, I will wait until I get to Europe and get the European seats put in which are fully adjustable. Beats me why they didn't include them here. I think the accelaration is pretty much the same depending on how you drive. I have a lot of torque on the high end of the Civic so can "push" it's performance. It has amazingly fast acceleration at low speeds. At high speeds the Civic drives like a 1964 VW beetle and you need to plan things out well ahead of time.

[rogerDB]

borschelrh: You can get the car serviced at any Toyota delear, if there is another one you prefer. My 2008 has been averaging in the mid 40's to low 50's since I bought it. I have a 14 mile commute. If I include freeway I get 49, if I use side streets I get 51. Either way I have a mile long very steep hill. When my wife drives, with no careful driving techniques, she still gets mid 40's. 2 trips to Seattle over the Cascade mountain range have yeilded 46mpg. In Seattle you can't really use any conservative techniques..you just go with the traffic flow!

[borschelrh]

Thanks. I have had trouble with other makes getting service at a dealership I din't purchase the car from. I checked my oil and tires and they are okay so it must be something else. Tomorrow I will start my second tank and we will see how it goes with this one.