Looking to buy - 08 Prius vs. 09 Jetta TDI

[reewrd]

Originally Posted by sdtundra

Seein as you are also in San Diego, keep in mind that diesel is already at $5 a gallon+ here

By the way, what dealer's waiting lists are you on for both cars?

i have a green pine mica arriving at toyota carlsbad next week

i have deposit on a salsa red tdi at herman cook that's supposed to be here end of august

[reewrd]

Originally Posted by patsparks

Neither car will ever pay for itself unless you are using them as taxis or courier vehicles however the Prius will cost less to run.

The prius has a 12 volt battery like any other car which will likely do 4 or 5 years before needing replacement, the high voltage traction battery isn't going to cause any trouble, there has been 1 battery failure and that was caused by running the car without fuel until the computer shut down, then restarting the system and driving about 10 miles on battery until it died. This isn't what the battery is designed to do and if you never try to drive the car without fuel then there is no reason the battery wont last 300,000 miles or more.

There is a surprising amount of space in a Prius, when you think about it, it is almost a wagon.

If you do most of your driving in urban areas the economy difference is significant. That is before taking into account that diesel is more costly per litre.

The Prius is automatic, I don't know if the Jetta is. The transmission in the Prius is very simple and has about 1/4 of the moving parts of a regular auto transmission. Less parts than a manual transmission actually. It is a CVT transmission meaning smooth, but because it is electric it has no belts, clutches or hydraulic control circuits.

The maintenance costs of a Jetta are much higher than a Prius. Being a petrol engine the Prius hasn't got high priced diesel filters. The fuel injectors in a Prius are just like any other petrol car, the injectors in a Jetta will, if one fails cost a bomb to replace. Even the oil filter in a diesel will cost more.

Prius has a 92% owner satisfaction rating, that is higher than any other car, how does the Jetta rate among current owners? This is important as it is a pretty good indicator of how happy you will be getting into your car each day.

Prius is a Toyota, do you really think Toyota would risk their reputation making a bad car? Check the reliability rating of other VW products, how good is the Beetle?

Prius has had fantastic resale value, some people selling their Prius have got more for it than they paid or near what they paid new, check the resale price for used Volkswagens against new prices.

Prius is quieter. These new diesels are very quiet, for diesels.
Prius is cleaner. Prius has the lowest emissions of any car for sale today and by a long margin.

Quite frankly I don't care what you end up buying, the Prius dealer wont care either, he will sell the car. But what ever you get I hope you enjoy it as much as I enjoy my Prius. By the way, I get 4.3L/100km (55mpg) across town and 5.2L/100km (45mpg) on the open road without trying too much.

being an old "gear head" - who also owned a vw gti back in the day - you make some compelling points, thank you

[reewrd]

Originally Posted by eurosteve

reewrd-

You quote 55 mpg on the highway for the TDI. That may indeed end up being true but what is your source for this number? EPA rating is much lower - is it 41?

I have 2 concerns about the TDI. One is that the possibly higher mpg in the TDI over the Prius is more than offset by the 25% higher cost of diesel. Where I live diesel is about $1 more per gallon - somewhere around $5.15. The second concern is legendary VW reliability, especially in comparison with Toyota. Seems these two represent both ends of the spectrum. Seems to me the Prius is a simpler, more reliable car. The TDI, especially since it is a brand new model with new technology (in the fuel emissions system), potentially could cost time and money in the shop.

found them on a website where someone had mentioned that VW had an independent company redo the governments estimated numbers which came out too low in VW's opinion. don't know if they are right or not, i am assuming the 38mpg city for the tdi that's all, but honestly after reading these posts, i don't think there's much to talk about. now i am leaning heavly toward the prius - thanks so much

[reewrd]

Originally Posted by Bill Merchant

Hi reewrd, welcome to PriusChat!
While a troll tried to hijack this thread, there's some meat to the arguments PatSparks makes. Get the Prius. With kids, it's good to know the Prius passenger compartment is wrapped in ultra-high strength steel and is a very safe car.

HA, too funny and thank you - them trolls are everywhere aren't they, it's too bad. Thanks for the info, appreciated.

[reewrd]

Originally Posted by Bohous

I'm curious. I see you (OP) are in San Diego. I know MA is a CA Emissions state and you cannot buy a new diesel car here. Are you sure a new TDI is really even an option? I know when I was in the same situation I was told they could only be grandfathered in as pre-owned,. meaning a minimum of 7500k/mi I believe.

Other than that I can only echo what has been said above. VW reliability is questionable at best. Diesel fuel is about $5/gallon, they are noisy, smelly and the Prius actually has MORE passenger space. TDI has more cargo space but that added rear seat passenger space is significant if you have kids in carseats.



PRIUS
VW TDI

it is an option in August - the 09 vw tdi's are 50 state legal

[reewrd]

first, thank you to everyone - so many have replied.

the mpg around town is shocking, it's higher than i thought. when i plug those numbers into my calculations the tdi is toast.

at the end of the day there's really not much to think about i guess. i'd been leaning toward the prius, and after reading all the info and comparing it to my own research, its a slam dunk.

can't wait to get it, and thank you for helping me brainstorm my final decision.

[stefanmurphy]

I used to own a 03 Jetta TDI (manual) and currently own an 07 Prius. Both are great cars you'll be happy with either. Not your exact scenario and I realize the new TDI is a different car, but with that in mind...

Some unscientific impressions:
-TDI felt more solid had better handling, but off the line wasn't as peppy, but once it got moving wow. Better interior feel.
-Prius is quicker off the line, peppy at all times, a bit mushier handling. Feels more plasticy inside.

As for reliability of VW my mother in law still owns the car, no major problems or minor for that matter. But I have heard reliability can be spotty.

As for city mileage, based on my own experience the TDI is better. I'm currently getting 35 mpg in the Prius
on my five mile all city street commute. I think the problem is I often don't get over 35 mph. My last commute was averaging 46 mpg in the Prius
which was mostly highway & stop/go highway. Clearly I'm not getting the Prius to its "happy place".

I wouldn't worry too much about finding diesel, never found that to be an issue. Most places have it. You should consider that it is 25% more expensive than gas, but when I owned it the prices were much closer, so this may change.

You mentioned the wagon factor of the TDI, the Prius is very large on the inside. Cargo area while not a wagon is pretty good.

I like diesel for down the road biodiesel option.

I like the Prius as a high tech toy.

Guess I'm saying no strong feeling either way. :-) Good luck.

[DaveinOlyWA]

well, i only relate my experiences as have many here... city driving is a make or break for any car and yes, its very easy to get 35 mpg in the city... its the "3 T's" and how you manage them

traffic, terrain, technique.

you may fail... then again, tt others on this site. see what they do... if a large percentage here do fairly well, that probably means that the technique aint that tough (its not...i dont hypermile... too lazy, but dont have to easily get 50+mpg). sure, it will be a bit of a learning curve. i didnt start out getting 65 mpg on the streets... was more like 45 mpg... and people talk about break in periods and all that crap (yup crap...have pretty much figured it was better technique with practice that did it)

now, traffic and terrain is hard to deal with especially if its extreme...

with terrain, investigate other routes, see if its possible to avoid major terrain changes or at least try to structure your route so you are going downhill when car is warm... granted either you can or you cant... not a lot to say on that

with traffic, remember the biggest killer to mpg' Ss is stop and go. remember there is no advantage to getting to the stop light first. travel on roads that have at least two lanes. roll up to lights... coast if you need to. if people want to pile up behind you, let them and ignore them. with two lanes they can follow or go around.

[sdtundra]

What package are you getting?

[stefanmurphy]

Originally Posted by DaveinOlyWA

<snip lots of good stuff>

Hey thanks for the input. I think I just have a bad situation. I average about 5 stop signs/traffic lights per mile. So always stop and starting. Start my AM commute uphill for a mile. This route is to avoid the highway which would take exponentially longer with traffic here in Atlanta. Better for my sanity, worse for gas mileage, fair trade.

I have been lurking around reading about techniques since I got it last year. Not trying to be a hypermiler but do pay close attention to what I am doing and its affect on the car.

I did just install the Costal EV mod as I've read that it can help on short commutes. I'll play with that for a while, maybe if I can do the uphill on battery. :-)