Recharging from the Grid

[Dave in KC]

Why do hybrid manufacturers proudly declare that their cars "don't need to be plugged in?" Most of my driving is 35 mph or less. I'd love to run all electric when I can and recharge in my garage overnight. I'm sure this would reduce my fuel costs and no doubt contribute less to greenhouse emissions. Save the gas engine for highway driving.

Has Toyota or anyone addressed this? What is their position or rationale?

Dave in KC

[jayman]

Well, we saw what GM did to electric cars ...

[prius mdt]

First - while I agree with your logic on short trips, MOST people do not. AND...most people aren't ready for a "plug in car". People want what they already know - remember, change is bad. People want to put gas in the tank and go. Not worry about "I have to get home to recharge". Car manufacturers to what they do because: 1. people want it. 2. the government says you gotta do it. 3. it makes sense or saves $$ on the assembly line. In this case, 1. people want it ... or should I say they don't want a plug in car.

Second - even if you plug in and save money on your gasoline bills, you still contribute to the greenhouse effect, because the power to recharge your plug in car came from somewhere. -

My thought is: your prius polutes less than ANY vehicle on the road...this is the best thing anyone could do (to the automobile). As a bonus, you get great gas mileage! And... the freedom to go where ever when ever you want.

[Dave in KC]

I understand your reasoning. Most electric cars are toys. The hybrids are real automobiles. I'd just like the option of charging either from the engine or from the grid.

Dave in KC

[skruse]

The Toyota RAV4 EV (pure electric) is not a toy. It is used by fleets (utility districts, cities, counties, large companies) around the country. With a range of 100-120 mi, the RAV4 EV is perfect for the average person.

Because I commute 30 mi each way and am able to plug-in at home and work, a RAV4 EV is perfect for my and many other people's needs. Only problem: Toyota canceled sales to individuals stating there was a "lack of demand."

Starting with an ICE-electric hybrid, then moving to a hybrid that can also plug in is the best of both worlds. You can drive beyond the plug-in range for extended trips and do a daily commute in the EV mode. Because a hydrogen economy is very distant, I predict we will see hybrids that also plug in.

[Ray Moore]

I just don't understand why so many people consider a hydrogen economy to be a foregone conclusion. Nanotechnology will allow solutions to cost and capacity issues in both the battery and photovoltaic industries. We will be charging our fully electric vehicles from our home based solar arrays in ten to fifteen years.

[prius04]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Dave in KC\";p=\"75203)</div>

I'd just like the option of charging either from the engine or from the grid.
Dave in KC[/b]

I have no doubt that a plug in hybrid is on the way. But I think up to now a plug in Prius would HURT the hybrid concept. I can tell you from experience that numerous people still try to make fun of my car by saying something about plugging it in.

And when the plug in does come on the market, Toyota will promote it in such a way that plugging it in will be VOLUNTARY. In other words, if you want 50MPG just drive it.....If you want 120MPG then you can plug it in at night.

This will be a marketing technique to slowly get America to accept the plug in. Like you, I would love a plug in now, and there are surely many thousands like us, but Toyota needs to sell cars in the BILLIONS of numbers. And to sell in those kinds of numbers, change comes VERY slow. Toyota has to be careful. There is a lot of money to be made and some VERY rich companies want the hybrid to fail. And there is no doubt in my mind that millions of dollars are being spent to foster that failure.

Personally, I can't wait for a plug in version, that's why I signed up with the people who are trying to make a plug in now. You can read about them here:

http://www.evworld.com/view.cfm?section=ar...cle&storyid=818

Or here: http://www.priuschat.com/forums/-vp71440.html#71440

[prius04]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Ray Moore\";p=\"75223)</div>

I just don't understand why so many people consider a hydrogen economy to be a foregone conclusion. Nanotechnology will allow solutions to cost and capacity issues in both the battery and photovoltaic industries. We will be charging our fully electric vehicles from our home based solar arrays in ten to fifteen years.[/b]

I cannot agree more. The Prius has gotten me to do a lot of internet searching on living green and future technology and stuff. And from what I've seen, there are a ton of possibilities out there.

What I suspect will happen is there will be a major battery breakthrough where battery capacity will skyrocket. And what precipitated this breakthrough? The hybrid.

And these batteries will be standardized across all cars and there will be a door in the side of the car where a battery can slip out just like the battery on a cell phone. So for week to week, you would plug the car in, but on long trips, you will simply change your battery every 500 miles or so.

This is great! Every time someone starts a thread like this Toyota will notice the increasing demand for a plug-in option and bring the plug-in Prius closer to production (rumour is it's being tested this year in Japan). Now all we need is a full scale campaign!

Oh, and speaking as someone with a background in physics and an eye on what's coming out of the lab these days, I couldn't agree more with what Ray Moore said!

[jayman]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Ray Moore\";p=\"75223)</div>

Nanotechnology will allow solutions to cost and capacity issues in both the battery and photovoltaic industries.[/b]

Ray:

Nanotechnology is just in its infancy right now, and the solutions are truly mindboggling. What you describe may be the minimum contribution nanotech provides for us.

As an example: when semiconductor devices were first demonstrated - the transistor - did anybody foresee computers not only in virtually every home, but every car and watch? Ok, maybe Arthur C Clarke did. But that was during an era where you were lucky to find one enormous computer in a large city.

Thanks to Moore's Law, trying to predict the future becomes a pointless - but fun and interesting - debate. I'm personally waiting for little nanotech robots swimming inside me, keeping an eye on my blood vessels and heart.