Tesla Model S unveiling live streaming at 3:30ET

[PeakOilGarage]

Originally Posted by efusco

I ordered...and can't wait the 2+ years it's gonna be until I get it!

I ordered it also.

Tesla Model S revealed Peak Oil Garage

Checkout the 17 inch touchscreen that dominates the center console. They have basically removed every knob or dial from the vehicle and incorporated everything into the touchscreen LCD.

[PeakOilGarage]

TESLA - Model S

Overview

- 300 mile range
- 45 minute QuickCharge
- 0-60 mph in 5.6 seconds
- Seats 7 people
- More Cargo space than station wagons
- 2X as efficient as hybrids
- 17 inch infotainment touchscreen

Range

- Up to 300 mile range
- 45 minute QuickCharge
- Charges from 120V, 240V or 480V
- 5 minute battery swap

Utility

- Seating for 5 adults + 2 child seats
- Unique hatch for oversized items
- 60/40 flat-folding rear seat
- 2nd trunk under hood

Performance

- 0-60 mph in 5.6 seconds
- 120 mph top speed
- Sport sedan dynamics
- All-wheel-drive available

[efusco]

I bet your number is ahead of mine!
I couldn't get on the net until the evening (vacationing in Hawaii), but hopefully I'll be one of the first couple hundred.--evan

Originally Posted by PeakOilGarage

I ordered it also.

Tesla Model S revealed Peak Oil Garage

Checkout the 17 inch touchscreen that dominates the center console. They have basically removed every knob or dial from the vehicle and incorporated everything into the touchscreen LCD.

[daniel]

Originally Posted by PeakOilGarage

They have basically removed every knob or dial from the vehicle and incorporated everything into the touchscreen LCD.

I don't like that. My old Civic was better than my Prius only in two respects: the sharpness of its handling, and the knob controls! For some functions, such as the heater, knobs are far superior to touch-screen buttons.

However, for all that, I'd buy this car if it was available. With production starting in two and a half years, and deliveries starting in three years, assuming no delays (!!!) that seems like a lifetime away.

Hey!!! Has anybody noticed that $49,900 is the base price, and the range is "up to" 300 miles? In other words, they're not saying what range you get for the base price, or what you'll pay for 300 miles!

Would you be just as enthusiastic if you get only 40 miles total range for $50K, and 100 miles cost you $100K? What if $50K got you 20 miles and it cost $200K for 125 miles? More than half the cost of the Roadster is the batteries, and it goes 245 miles on a charge. The sedan will be heavier (twice as heavy, maybe?) so maybe it will get half the range for the same price: $100K for 120 miles? So I would not be a bit surprised if the base model, at $50K gets 30 miles, because with all that handling and technology and "luxury" feel, they're only going to have maybe $10K to spend on batteries.

I'd pay $100K for 100 miles range right now, but if the market keeps going south I might not have $100K to spend in three years. I would not buy this car with a 30-mile range. I don't think I'd buy any car with less than 75 miles, because I'd need that to be a big enough improvement over my Xebra, with its 40-mile range.

Don't get me wrong: I think Tesla Motors is the best thing since brown rice. I just want more information, and the way they've worded the press release, they are giving us a lot less information than they seem to be.

[PeakOilGarage]

Originally Posted by daniel

Hey!!! Has anybody noticed that $49,900 is the base price, and the range is "up to" 300 miles? In other words, they're not saying what range you get for the base price, or what you'll pay for 300 miles!

I think most people spot that right away. The base model has a 160 miles range. There are options at 230 miles and 300 miles of range.

Tesla has made the battery swappable within 5 minutes so it fits into the Project Better Place model.

You can rent the 300 miles battery from Tesla if you are making a long trip. So there is no need to haul that heavy battery around on a regular basis. Most people would be fine with the 160 mile battery if they could get a 300 mile battery for twice per year when they need to make a longer trip. That makes perfect sense to me as an experienced EV owner.

Originally Posted by daniel

More than half the cost of the Roadster is the batteries, and it goes 245 miles on a charge.

That is not accurate. The Roadster battery costs about $18,000 and the price of the Roadster is $109,000. I have bought lithium car batteries from Asian sources and I paid $11,500 for about 34 kwh. The Roadster battery is 53 kwh. I bet Tesla gets a better price than I do.

Originally Posted by daniel

The sedan will be heavier (twice as heavy, maybe?) so maybe it will get half the range for the same price: $100K for 120 miles?

The Sedan is estimated at 4,000 lbs compared to the Roadster at 2,700 lbs.
The base battery for the Sedan is 42 kwh and gets 160 miles of range. The CD of the Sedan is 0.26 compared to the Roadster at 0.35 so that helps with the overall efficiency.
The 230 mile range battery is 70 kwh. There are no specs yet on the 300 mile battery because it is a different chemistry.

I don't think anyone will buy the 300 mile range option because they know they can rent it when needed. There is no need to haul that extra weight around every day.

Originally Posted by daniel

Don't get me wrong: I think Tesla Motors is the best thing since brown rice. I just want more information, and the way they've worded the press release, they are giving us a lot less information than they seem to be.

The information is out there on the internet, but the press release doesn't have all of the details. All of the Tesla articles in the news have more details and www.teslamotorsclub.com sort of aggregates everything together by the fans.

[PeakOilGarage]

Originally Posted by efusco

I bet your number is ahead of mine!
I couldn't get on the net until the evening (vacationing in Hawaii), but hopefully I'll be one of the first couple hundred.--evan

They are going to take in all of the orders between now and the end of April. Then in May they will release the production order list.

It will go in this priority.
1) Tesla Roadster owners (receive a $10,000 discount as a thank you for their patience the past two years).
2) Friends and family of Tesla Roadster owners. Each Roadster owner gets to give out 5 priority orders to people to get them moved up in the line.
3) Non-Roadster owners.

I don't think there will be a long wait though. The factory is being scaled for 20,000 cars per year. So once production begins, they will be delivering quickly.

There are two different Model S Sedans available. The first 1,000 produced with be a Signature 1,000 series. There are 1,000 for a European series and 1,000 for the American series. The Signature series typically have every upgrade option included (that is how the Roadster signature series worked), so expect that final price to be closer to $65,000 (the price is not final yet).

Then the regular Model S production begins and that price starts at $57,400 then you subtract off the $7,500 federal tax credit for a price of $49,900. Then you might have state incentives also. For example, in my state of Washington there is no sales tax on electric vehicles.

The base model will be able to do 160 miles of range.
0-60 in about 5.5 seconds.

There is a Sport model coming that will do 0-60 in under 5 seconds.

[efusco]

Originally Posted by PeakOilGarage

They are going to take in all of the orders between now and the end of April. Then in May they will release the production order list.

It will go in this priority.
1) Tesla Roadster owners (receive a $10,000 discount as a thank you for their patience the past two years).
2) Friends and family of Tesla Roadster owners. Each Roadster owner gets to give out 5 priority orders to people to get them moved up in the line.
3) Non-Roadster owners.

I don't think there will be a long wait though. The factory is being scaled for 20,000 cars per year. So once production begins, they will be delivering quickly.

There are two different Model S Sedans available. The first 1,000 produced with be a Signature 1,000 series. There are 1,000 for a European series and 1,000 for the American series. The Signature series typically have every upgrade option included (that is how the Roadster signature series worked), so expect that final price to be closer to $65,000 (the price is not final yet).

Then the regular Model S production begins and that price starts at $57,400 then you subtract off the $7,500 federal tax credit for a price of $49,900. Then you might have state incentives also. For example, in my state of Washington there is no sales tax on electric vehicles.

The base model will be able to do 160 miles of range.
0-60 in about 5.5 seconds.

There is a Sport model coming that will do 0-60 in under 5 seconds.

Wish I knew someone to get me on the Friends & Family list. But it's not a huge rush, and hopefully I'll be in the first couple hundred at least.

Curious to hear more on the sport model, but I really don't think I need a sub-5 sec. 0-60...though it would be fun to embarrass the ricers around here with a 'damn electric POS'!!

RE: your comments about the 300 mile range. Some of us will be very remote from any of the big city centers..and thus a swappable battery. I'm 8 hours from Chicago which, I assume, will be the closest Tesla dealer. Even St. Louis is 3 hours away and just inside the 160 mile range if they put a battery swap center there. So, if the Tesla is going to become a family travel vehicle for me the 300 would probably be the way I'd have to go.

As Darrell suggested though, I'd probably go for the 230 mile battery. I think I could do almost all my driving on that and either rent or use my wife's Highlander hybrid for longer trips.

Budget will certainly be a consideration too. No telling what nice accessories like the 3G and such will run, the larger packs will add to the price tag quickly, there's that replacement plan they talked about where in 3 years you get a brand new battery if you pre-pay. Before you know it that price could be pushing $70k pretty easily. And my wife will totally choke at that!

[PeakOilGarage]

The battery is projected to last 100,000 miles or 7 years. The chemistry is strong enough to provide that now. No telling what it will be in 2011 or 2012 when these cars are produced. The battery technology could really improve the estimated specs of the Tesla Model S.

I am positive they will last a lot longer than 3 years.

[daniel]

Thanks for the clarification. Of course, swapping for a bigger battery only applies if there's a swap center nearby. But I don't think I ever make any trips between 75 miles and 300 miles. Revelstoke and Golden BC (where I go for hiking) are both around 330 miles away, and Seattle is just under 300 miles, but with mountains in between, so I'd want a 400 mile range before I'd attempt it.

However, except for extended road trips, a 100-mile range is plenty for me. I could drive all the way to Coeur d'Alene, give several people rides on the freeway, and come home again. Once the highway is electrified (fast charging or battery swap) those trips would be easy. Until that time, I'd probably have to drive the Prius.

[daniel]

Originally Posted by PeakOilGarage

The battery is projected to last 100,000 miles or 7 years. The chemistry is strong enough to provide that now. No telling what it will be in 2011 or 2012 when these cars are produced. The battery technology could really improve the estimated specs of the Tesla Model S.

I am positive they will last a lot longer than 3 years.

Are you talking Li-Ion, or LiFePO4? I have seen the 7-year figure for the latter, but it's too new to have provided any hard data yet. I've got LiFePO4 in my Xebra (one of only a very few Xebras to have it) and the Porsche has LiFePO4 (if they ever finish it).

I think we're all optimistic about improvements in battery chemistry and reductions in price.