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Any interest in a 1,000 mi, tank club or contest?

Discussion in 'Gen 3 Prius Fuel Economy' started by bwilson4web, Mar 25, 2014.

  1. Robert Holt

    Robert Holt Senior Member

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    Hey Marc, let's put our heads together to find a loop somewhere in the DC area where we can try this! I was using Route 28 out near Dulles airport, but it proved to have more traffic,in the midnight to 6 am period than I had anticipated, plus more elevation change than desirable.
    Can we tag team the driving so we do not each go crazy with boredom whilst puttering along at 25mph? Is that allowed in Bob's rules?
     
  2. MarcSmith

    MarcSmith Active Member

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    Robert....you did not by chance ever live down in Florida did you???

    what about the dulles airport access... you could go from Arlington to dulles and back.. about 40 miles one way...

    of coure you have the beltway. but you'd get run over at anything less than 50 GW parkway...no lights, but not really flat either....

    from rt 7 to 66 on 28 is probably not a bad trip.. to get flat land though we'd need to go east...

    think dulles airport would let us run laps overnight...or maybe we head out to summit point... but then you get too many hills. We could rent out Richmond International raceway for 1400 laps at 25mph it would take a solid 40 hours...

    I think one further restriction on the trip needs to be that you CANNOT run the tank dry, IE run out of gas.
     
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  3. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    • Impossible to tell - a photo at the 'end' with the 2010 Prius gives no indication that the car ran out of gas.
    I have no problem with folks using a 1 gallon spare can once the car is on "flash" and continuing until it is out of gas. I do not recommend driving more than 1 mile, 1.6 km, to find a safe place to park; take a photo, and; refuel safely.

    Bob Wilson
     
  4. MarcSmith

    MarcSmith Active Member

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    its impossible to tell if someone ran 1000 miles on a single tank. the car doesn't indicate that either.

    The whole contests is "Corinthian" in nature. if someone is going to lie about running out of gas, they'll lie about going 1000 miles on a tank of gas...
     
  5. Seanzky

    Seanzky Member

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    Bonneville Salt Flats allowed? This is an impossible task for a New Yorker. :LOL: I've tried hyper-miling it on the LIE at night and even that's impossible.
     
  6. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    Actually the photo does a pretty good job:
    [​IMG]
    • 1000.8 miles / 91.8 MPG = 10.90 gallons
    • 10.90 gallons < 11.9 gallons rated capacity
    Actually I'm OK with up to 12.2 gallons because that has been the maximum I've calculated after running out of gas, adding one gallon, driving a few miles to the station, and then filling the tank. I'm not going to quibble about that 0.3 gallons as the fuel metric comes from the photo. We are treating the fuel counter, miles divided by MPG, as accurate or the metric equivalent.

    The mileage is one 'cheat' that can not be detected. The 'cheat' is to put smaller diameter tires on the car to inflate the miles. In theory, one could four, donut tires on the car and cover a shorter distance but the indicated miles would be higher, inflated.

    I'm OK with a GPS or other records showing the calibration offset. For example, photos can document a GPS and trip meter showing for every indicated 100 miles, our NHW11 goes 105.9 miles. Alternatively, the specifications for our oversized, Sumitomo T4 also show a 6% reduction in revolutions per mile. Any reasonable documentation works for me.

    Bob Wilson
     
  7. MarcSmith

    MarcSmith Active Member

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    Duh....too many gin and tonics last night... for got about basic math...and what the displayed showed...
     
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  8. Robert Holt

    Robert Holt Senior Member

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    We've camped a lot in Florida but never officially resided there.
    Not sure Homeland Security will be OK with us running laps around the Dulles runways all night long and although I used to know the guy operating the airport, I think he has since retired.

    I've used the rt 28 corridor for trials at 55 and 45, but too much traffic to go slower even at 5am on Sunday. Also has noticeable elevation changes.

    Dulles toll road might work, but would my EZ pass be charged for each leg?? That could get prohibitively expensive. But we could swap drivers at the Dulles airport lounge which would be convenient, especially if they don't mind us sleeping there between stints.

    Summit point too hilly for this I agree. Richmond speedway might work, so need to check it out for hills and judge affordability of rental fee for say a 48 hour lease.
     
  9. Seanzky

    Seanzky Member

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    I've figured it out!!! Set up a home-made, dyno-like contraption. Strap in the car, floating on the dyno wheels and let it coast EV mode. Sit outside, open a can of beer. Done.
     
  10. MarcSmith

    MarcSmith Active Member

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    robert. I dulles airport access... not the toll portion... at the end of the airport access but before it turn s into 66 you could do a u turn int he median otherwise you'd have go all the way into arlington to do a u turn on city streets and stoplights...

    if you had a switchable ez pass we could use the HOT lanes on 495...

    but going so slow would draw some attention..
     
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  11. Robert Holt

    Robert Holt Senior Member

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    Whoa, that sent me to Google for the "Corinthian contest " concept, where I found the quote from the King James Version (I'm old fashioned.) :

    "And every man that striveth for the mastery is temperate in all things. Now they do it to obtain a corruptible crown; but we an incorruptible."

    Well, I guess we couldn't be much more "temperate" than driving a car at 25 mph for almost two days straight! The incorruptible crown should be non biodegradable plastic crown or laurel wreathe, I guess, but that would fit with the cheap, tacky prizes planned for the contest by the OP.

    I was more thinking it would be a "Pyrrhic Victory", but I suppose it is entirely possible to have a Pyrrhic Victory in a Corinthian Contest.

    Have found non-alcohol gas in Wisconsin and will try for 600-700 mile tank, and will report back on results if DW does not strangle me when we run out of gas. That might be part of the solution, assuming it is not part of the precipitate..(the gas, not the strangling)

    Will check out Dulles access road for feasibility when next possible and check for elevation changes and look for that U turn spot, but do you really think we can do a steady 25 on it? Isn't there a minimum legal speed on it?
     
  12. MarcSmith

    MarcSmith Active Member

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    yeah I'm sure the Metro Airport police would give us a bunch of crap for only going 25mph in a 55 zone... no matter what time... and there is some elevation...
     
  13. SageBrush

    SageBrush Senior Member

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    A 1000 mile tank might be possible in our Prius Vagon, but a cheat that restricts the car to competition type driving for the duration is needed:

    • No wife driving
    • No highways
    • No short trips
     
  14. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    Pssshaa, 25 mph is easy . . . drive towards the traffic jam. But seriously, there are lots of areas to do laps. Just use Google map or Google Earth:
    • Driving clockwise: Galleria Drive and International Drive.
    • Right from International Drive onto Westpark Drive
    • Right on Galleria Drive
    If too much traffic or light timing wrong, substitute Tysons Blvd for Westpark Drive.

    Understand doing laps is boring as heck so you'll soon learn the value of having podcasts, MP4, or other quality music and talk material.

    Bob Wilson
     
  15. MarcSmith

    MarcSmith Active Member

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    bob... you are too funny... of course not that you'd know unless you lived here...

    doing circles around the "richie rich mall"... and 4 traffic lights that affect cross traffic... we'd not stand a snowballs chance in hell.... I'd venture to say the cops would stop us within the first hour....there would be no way we could get a stint with out having traffic issues..

    one of the problems with living in a metro area...
     
  16. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    • 1973-1984 - Arlington, NW DC 16th St., MacArthur Blvd, Falls Church VA, Lanham MD.
    • 1985 - alternate weeks in Huntsville and Lanham MD.
    • 1985 - permanent move to Huntsville.
    • 1995-2000 - lived 1 mile from end of Orange Line to commute to NASA HQ, 300 E St.
    • 2000-current - glad to be back in the land of grits, chicken fried steak, and Dr. Pepper in the Coke machine
    Ok, give me an intersection that you can reach at 25 mph and let me look around. Granted, I've been away for a while but there are patterns. But also understand, even with these relaxed rules, there are places where it is especially hard to do a 1,000 mile tank.

    Part of the contest is learning a little bit about 'route planning' and 'surfing traffic.' Talking the rules is not nearly as effective as 'taking the test.' <GRINS>

    One other thing, if you can get 100 miles at +90 MPG, you have a shot. Doing the whole 1,000 miles becomes just repeating this effort 10 times. No prize but at least you would know it is possible. Also, if the first attempt doesn't seem to be working, share the details and not just me but others may have some insights to share.

    My first attempt failed after a couple of hundred miles but I realized what I'd done wrong. In my hurry to get back on the task, I rushed filling up on the wrong side with the nozzle upside down. I didn't get a full fill but by the time I realized it, I could also tell I was going to be close. So I made the 1,000 miles only to run out on the way to the gas station!

    Bob Wilson
     
  17. MarcSmith

    MarcSmith Active Member

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    bob,

    I've been here since 2000, its pretty amazing how much change has occurred in 14 years...

    problem with nova is finding flat land...light traffic and a route to minimize stops/hard turns in a setting where you can get away with going 25-30 mph without getting shot..

    its going to be difficult to find a suitable location thats for sure..

    is 25 the ideal speed for max mpg?
     
  18. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    As part of my preparation, I'm driving on flash with the last of the Costco gas and a spare, 1 gallon, can of straight gas from Jet-Pep. This evening I'll head home via Brindley Mountain and do a quick, gasoline energy study of the Costco gas. Once this tank is dry, I'll put in the straight gas, fill-up, and re-run the test.

    The gasoline energy test starts at the base of Brindley Mountain, a 1.2 mile long, 525 ft., 8% grade hill:
    • park in small lot at base of hill pointed to exit
    • force-charge traction battery until engine stops - normalize traction battery to peak charge
    • wait for traffic to clear
    • start cell phone video recording
    • pull on to road and floor the accelerator to the top
    • announce when I've reached the top
    • park and save the video
    After the tank is dry, I'll put in the 1 gallon of Jet-Pep straight gas; fill-up, and; repeat the above test. Dividing the distance by MPG gives me the fuel consumed to reach the top. I'll also check the elapsed time but this typically takes about 100 seconds and timing is not exact enough. But the fuel consumed to reach the end will always be inversely proportional to the energy content. Higher energy gasoline burns less at full throttle to reach the top.

    I have to go out of town but I'll arrange to be out of gas when I get back. Then I'll try Shell 87 that used to be the highest energy gas. Understand that my results are local to the Huntsville gasoline market. Also, we are probably going through winter-to-summer switch and I can't be sure of the exact mix in the station underground tanks. But without some sort of metric, there is no basis for choosing straight-gas over E10, Shell 87.

    Bob Wilson
     
  19. bestmapman

    bestmapman 04, 07 ,08, 09, 10, 16, 21 Prime

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    Hi Bob,

    This sounds like fun. Count me in. Just a thought have you check with Toyota about using there test track at the Georgetown KY factory. That might work good.
     
  20. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    I have posted the contest announcement. It starts June 1.

    Feel free to share with others but there is a requirement to post a start note in that thread . . . After June 1, 2014.


    Bob Wilson
     
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