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My Prius Harpmobile compromised?

Discussion in 'Newbie Forum' started by Mooharpist, Apr 19, 2014.

  1. Mooharpist

    Mooharpist New Member

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    I am new to this community. We have a 2012 Prius v that we just love. Last year alone we have put 23,000 miles on it. I was amazed that my concert grand pedal harp fits in the back.

    Alas, I was involved in an accident. I was t-boned by a SUV. (Fortunately the harp was *not* in the car.) I am wondering how much it take to "total" a Prius? I'm afraid that the frame is compromised. This was the first new car that my husband and I had purchased and we tend to buy cars for long use. I am worried it will never be the same and do not want to spend the next 10 years or so driving a compromised vehicle.

    We did buy the supplemental insurance. So if the car is a loss we should be able to replace it with another Prius v. Any thoughts? Here's the picture:
     

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  2. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    welcome to priuschat, i'm so glad that you, and your harp are okay. when we were younger, my wife and i used to go to a restaurant in cambridge to dine by live harp music. it was beautiful and we were devastated when they closed. it's hard to be sure from the pic, but that looks totaled to me. if they insist it is not, be sure to push for diminished value payment, as you will never get the undamaged value when you sell or trade it in. all the best!(y)
     
  3. jhinsc

    jhinsc Senior Member

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    Ouch! Did the side airbags go off? Is it still drivable? I can't tell from the picture and it doesn't look that bad in the picture. I guess that's how much safer they're making cars these days. Once airbags go off and there is frame damage, most insurance companies will total the vehicle, especially if you can claim diminished value.
     
  4. Mooharpist

    Mooharpist New Member

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    The air bags did not go off despite the car getting pushed up against the curb somewhat. I don't think it is too drivable but the tow guy was able to steer its into place. The electric mode was still working. My thoughts are that it will never be the same and I worry about what would happen if it gets hit again. My inclination is to start over with another Prius if I can get the insurance companies to agree.
     
  5. The Electric Me

    The Electric Me Go Speed Go!

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    Your instincts are right.
    I'd really want a new vehicle after an accident like that, with damage like that.
    Unfortunately might be right on the line as to whether they repair or replace.

    If they don't replace..and insist on repair, the diminished value claim is crucial.

    If they simply don't agree to replacement...then I'd want repair, diminished value, and then I'd trade in or sell and start over.

    Good Luck. Glad nobody was hurt, but too bad your vehicle is in such a state.
     
  6. TomB985

    TomB985 Member

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    Ouch, looks like you took quite the hit. Really glad to hear you're doing okay.

    Lots of people think that once an accident happens a car is never the same again. I've driven and owned several cars that were in serious accidents, and with quality body work they are indeed good as new. Remember that a car is nothing but an assembly of individual parts that are put together by man and machine in a factory. While not every manufacturing process can be duplicated in a body shop, there are perfectly acceptable ways of repairing most types of collisions.

    Repairing your car will most likely involve replacing just about everything that was impacted with brand new parts. New parts are new parts, whether they are installed by a body shop or at the factory, the end result is the same. As long as the damage isn't more than the value of the car it's definitely repairable. Electric Me has a good point about diminished value, my mom was just told yesterday that her Fusion is worth about 10% less on trade-in because it was involved in a serious accident.
     
  7. The Electric Me

    The Electric Me Go Speed Go!

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    I'm really curious as to what the insurance does here.

    I'm no expert, and it's hard to tell from just a picture, but my guess is that is "close" to being a vehicle they would total, but perhaps NOT.

    If your wish is that you simply get replacement? Then it's almost too bad the airbags did not go off. I've heard that replacing the air bags adds a lot to the total of restoring a vehicle, so a lot of times in a decision as to whether a vehicle should be repaired or totaled, it comes down to air bag deployment.

    I've never taken or paid for the supplemental insurance, as I've always wondered that if having it, in a case like this, might actually make the Insurance Company more apt to repair than replace. If they know they are absolutely going to have to pay for the full cost of replacement, are they more apt to decide on the side of repair? Where as, if you don't have the supplement, and the Insurance company is looking at a reduced value for the vehicle, are they more willing to simply write you a check? It's a paranoid worry of mine. But I've always figured on a newer vehicle, even if I didn't get full replacement cost, I'd rather have a big check, and the option to do what I want, even if I have to pay the difference between what I'm given for the vehicle, and what a "new" replacement might cost.

    Anyway, good luck. Whatever happens. Body Shops can do great work. And I think if you get a diminished value claim, the worst case scenario is that you have the vehicle repaired, then get it back, and can then make a decision about what you want to do moving forward.
     
  8. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    there are body shops, and then there are body shops. if you have to fix it, i hope you get a good one. serious internal damage that isn't visible upon disassembly will not be covered forever.
     
  9. Mooharpist

    Mooharpist New Member

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    Thanks everyone for the input. I am going to ask for a "tear down" to make sure all the damage is accessed. As for the supplemental insurance, it is a separate company from the main one.

    I stopped by the dealership to remind my self where exactly the frame is located. Looking at a newer Prius I figured out that yes, the frame was hit. Not only is there a kink there now but that whole area has been pushed in about 2 inches. I also found out if I get a new one my extended warranties I purchased could be transferred.

    So far, I am leaning towards a new one. I grew up in a Goodyear family and have a good idea what happens to tires when an alignment is not perfect. Also, that is the area that the main part of the harp would be and I don't want to endanger my $30,000 instrument if I get hit there again. (Yes, a harp costs as much as a Prius.) :) Hopefully, the insurance companies will play nice. :p
     
  10. TomB985

    TomB985 Member

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    Frame alignment isn't the same as wheel alignment. And on a unibody car there is no explicit frame, it encompasses the entire body of the car. You can have a badly tweaked frame and still get the wheels to align within spec. Of course there's no reason that should ever happen on a professionally repaired car.

    Seriously, if they repair it right you should never notice the difference. And most body she's I've ever heard of offer a lifetime warranty, so five years down the road if it gives you any issues they will take care of it. Make sure you find a body shop with a good reputation and ask about their warranty.
     
  11. Mooharpist

    Mooharpist New Member

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    Kinda makes me nostalgic for my first car a '75 MGB that my dad and I put in a new clutch (which involved lifting the engine). I replaced the water pump & belts in front of my dorm. Then my boyfriend and I replaced the rocker panels and did a repaint ourselves. (Being poor broke college students) I also put in a radio/tape player which was an adventure since the Brits marked the ground wires differently. Later, in grad school, I had a misadventure involving a vacuum pump on a Mercedes 300D. Cars were a lot more straight forward then.

    Now, I'm not sure if I want to even change the oil.:)

    I should find out something this week. Until then I am driving a rental Altima. I drive about 80 miles a day and really miss my Prius. I'll let you all know when I find out something.
     
  12. The Electric Me

    The Electric Me Go Speed Go!

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    I'm assuming the Harp is insured.
    That I'd definitely want a policy that offered full replacement value.
     
  13. Mooharpist

    Mooharpist New Member

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    Oh yes, the harp is *very* insured along with its case. Mine is rather special because it was a gift from a bunch of great people. It is about 16 years old (I got it new) and harps only get better as they age.

    The body shop is supposed to do the "tear down" tomorrow. When I went over to get some of my stuff in the car I did see that the bar between the doors had kinks as well as being bent. Also the back door can't open more then 4-6 inches. The part around the doors is also toast. Hopefully, I'll know more tomorrow.

    Update per the police report. The other driver was not turning left but going straight. I remember there was no skid marks which means my car took the full brunt of the energy. Also the police report had notated that the other was distracted which I find interesting.

    BTW, what is the structure of the unibody. Someone was saying that there is an outer shell and an inner shell with a "subframe". They opined that the under part should be okay which I find rather hard to believe. I am a little confused. This is starting to resemble a nightmare as my neck and back have stiffened up. Fun. :(

    Again, thanks.
     
  14. cycledrum

    cycledrum PSOCSOASP

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    I very much beg to differ. There are genuine Toyota parts, built to their exacting specifications, then there are copied, aftermarket parts designed to be 'good enough' for repair.

    This is a photograph of a Pilkington brand windshield, said to be a good quality aftermarket windshield. This was to be installed in my car last Saturday. They couldn't even get the rear view mirror mount in the right place. Is it not outside the dotted visor area?? Also, there were holes all over the black painted border.

    camera 632.jpg

    Below is where Prius liftback mirror mounts:
    camera.jpg

    This below is a proper Prius windshield for the non auto-dimming rearview mirror, clearly showing the mount wihting the 'third visor' area. Almost all Toyota windshield are mfrd by AGC corp from Tokyo Japan, that's Asahi Glass Company. If Pilkington can't even get a mirror location right, how could Tong Yang or a slew of aftermarket, knock off part companies get things like doors, bumpers, etc, etc ... right? Many parts probably do work, but I'll bet many leave you with crooked this and that.

    I know of a radiator mfr that makes cheap, made in China radiators that look like originals, but sell for like $60 to repair shops and come up leaking often and after short periods of time. You'd be surprised how many shops will stuff them in for repairs. new parts are new parts, yeah, sure.

    The real stink is that dealer parts cost waayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy more than aftermarkets. Know how much I was quoted for a Prius windshield???

    $ 1, 280 One thousand two hundred eighty dollars folks.

    Know how much aftermarket windshields cost?? A couple hundred, sometimes less. Something real fishy about that. And, most insurance companies reject dealer parts up front. You'd have to build one heck of a case to justify all dealer parts, original parts at their exorbitant cost.

    camera 637.jpg
     
  15. TomB985

    TomB985 Member

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    OEM Toyota body repair parts are available, and of course it depends on whether or not their insurance company is willing to pay for OEM parts. Some are, and some aren't. I have to agree with you that the quality of aftermarket parts isn't as good as OEM.

    My mother had an aftermarket bumper cover installed on her '08 Fusion when it was damaged in a serious rear end accident. The replacement cover didn't fit right, and I could tell from about 10 feet away that it wasn't quite right. I brought it to the attention of the body shop when we picked it up, and they said they'd get approval for an OEM part and call her back. They never did, and my mom declined to press the issue insisting that it was a 6-year-old car and that it didn't matter. Of course when she went to trade in the car last weekend the appraiser for the dealer noticed and made a deduction to cover the cost of getting the rear bumper fixed.



    There is quite a price markup from dealers, the wholesale price they give other shops is significantly less. I find it ridiculous to think that it costs significantly more to manufacture an OEM windshield compared to an aftermarket. And believe it or not, Pilkington is the OEM for the glass in several Toyota models including the Venza. Says so right on the glass of a brand-new unit parked at the dealer.

    Anyway, I would highly recommend the OP push for OEM parts if she can get them. Certainly not the end of the world if they don't, but make sure it fits perfectly. If you can tell something isn't right a potential buyer will be able to tell the same.
     
  16. TomB985

    TomB985 Member

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    They may be responding to your concern of wheel alignment. There are typically a front and rear subframe that the suspension components bolt to, and I highly doubt those were affected by the impact. They're called "subframes" because it isn't a true frame, it simply forms the support structure for the suspension.

    To get a better idea of what the "frame" is see below. I tried finding one of a Prius but was unsuccessful, but here's one of a new Corolla.

    Untitled.jpg


    It's mostly one piece. They can cut the welds and replace parts of it and make it good as new. Of course like cyclodrum mentioned some of that depends on whether they use OEM parts or not. Remember that structural parts are part of the vehicle's crashworthiness, and the repair standards are very strict because they would be liable for a substandard repair that caused injury.
     
  17. usnavystgc

    usnavystgc Die Hard DIYer and Ebike enthusiast.

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    I don't believe your car is totaled. I'm just going by what I see and barring any unseen damage, that is fixable. I could be wrong though (won't be the first time). Pls let us know what happens.
     
  18. cycledrum

    cycledrum PSOCSOASP

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    Speaking of aftermarket parts, look at post #7 in bottom link to see pics of Wavy Gravy made in China windshield put in my car yesterday. You won't see 'Made in China' stamped on the part. Mine says DOT 563 which stands for Shenzhen Auto Glass Co in PR of China

    look it up - DOT number search: DOT Number Database

    Toyota windshields are DOT 20, Asahi Glass Co, Tokyo Japan. Quality glass. Not wavy junk.

    It'll be out of my car next week, but really, I don't want techs repeatedly hacking on my car to replace. Who said 'new parts are new parts'. They are not even close to being all the same.

    Anyone have Pilkington Brand Windshield Replacement? | PriusChat

    Sorry to poop on thread, but I'm going thru it now.
     
  19. hill

    hill High Fiber Member

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    First -
    WELOCME !!!
    As for the prius pic? Bah ... that'll rub out ;)
    Our hybrid Lexus SUV is in the shop right now with just a teeny bit more gouging on the drivers's side. My wife didn't realize that her chemo treatments affect her preception/driving skill as much as it does. I heard the crunch from the stair well in the house. She drove off & never realized she'd smoked one of our cars into the other.
    :eek:


    Fortunately it was a good object lesson - & I'll still have to be the chauffeur for at least another month. Long story short, our damages came out to about $3,500. I just hope the goldish metalic paint looks as decent as it did prior to the hit.
    If your insurance co says it'll be ok, chances are it will. What company are you with? That can make a big difference.
    .