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Overheating, radiator fan not working, and exclamation mark sign on HUD

Discussion in 'Gen 2 Prius Care, Maintenance and Troubleshooting' started by Asim Jahangir, Jun 16, 2014.

  1. Asim Jahangir

    Asim Jahangir Junior Member

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    So a weird thing happen yesterday...

    I am driving smoothly on the highway, doing about 60km/hr, with my A/C working on a full. Suddenly, the check engine and emergency brake light comes up on the HUD along with a beeping sounding. A pull over, and smell a bad odor - like burning rubber - coming out of the hood. I checked and the car was immensely heated and there was smoke rising from a small rubber tube right next to the fuse box under the hood. I turned off the car.

    Whenever I would turn the car back on, the smoke would start coming back. I checked several times. I couldn't find out where the smoke was coming from.

    When the car cooled down a bit, I checked the radiator. The coolant level was a bit low so I filled up with the water. I also noticed that the radiator fans were not working, even when I turn the A/C on. So I called a towing company and got my car back to my garage.

    Now the car heats up after running for a bit and the big exclamation mark sign comes on. The check engine light also comes on. But when the car cools down, the lights go away. I am thinking that the problem has something to do with overheating and the radiator fans not working.

    Any ideas what should I do?
     
  2. JC91006

    JC91006 Senior Member

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    is your water pump belt in place?
     
  3. Patrick Wong

    Patrick Wong DIY Enthusiast

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    When the Prius is READY, look at the inverter coolant reservoir. If you do not see turbulence in the fluid, the inverter coolant pump has failed. The inverter coolant pump is located immediately in front of the main relay/fuse box and behind a headlight assembly.

    Regarding the engine coolant level, did you check the coolant in the radiator itself (not just the overflow tank)?

    Regarding the radiator fans not operating, check the 30A RDI fuse and 7.5A ECU-IG fuse. The first fuse is part of the fusible link assembly housed in a ~5" long plastic box located within the main relay/fuse box. The second fuse is in the fuse box under the instrument panel (driver's side with LHD cars.)

    If the RDI fuse blew, you have a serious problem with the wiring because it is not easy to blow a 30A fuse. It is difficult to replace the fusible link assembly, there are a couple of posts about how to do that on PriusChat.

    If you cannot find an obvious problem then you will need Mini VCI so that you can retrieve the fault codes which have been logged.
     
    #3 Patrick Wong, Jun 16, 2014
    Last edited: Jun 16, 2014
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  4. Asim Jahangir

    Asim Jahangir Junior Member

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    Thanks Patrick. I checked the coolant reservoir, and it was indeed the inverter pump which had blown. It was a very hot day in here (42 celcius) and it might have lead to the blow up. Plus my prius has around 90k miles on it so the pump may have just worn out.

    I checked the coolant level in the radiator and it was not full. I was able to add about 1/2 litre of coolant in the radiator right after I returned. But when left overnight, there was no further depletion in the fluid level. I think the fluid might have evaporated after the car was overheating after pump failure.

    I have taken out the pump and bought a new one from a local store. I plan to install it later today. Please check my message.
     
  5. Patrick Wong

    Patrick Wong DIY Enthusiast

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    Your car has at least two issues which are not necessarily directly related:

    1. Radiator fans not functioning
    2. Inverter pump failed

    I've already provided you with info regarding the radiator fan fuses to check.

    Regarding the inverter pump, look for 12V at its wiring harness connector when the Prius is READY. If voltage is not present, check the 15A AM-2 fuse.

    Regarding coolant, use pink Toyota Super Long Life coolant if locally available, which allows a 50K mile service interval (factory fill lasts 100K miles). If not, try to use the best available coolant. Red Toyota Long Life coolant is OK but has a service life of 30K miles.
     
  6. Asim Jahangir

    Asim Jahangir Junior Member

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    I just came back from the fitting. The inverter pump is in place and working fine. I can see bubbles and rubbles in the bottle connected to the inverter when the car is on ON mode. I put the car in ready mode and it seemed fine. All equipment is working as expected.

    However, the check engine and the triangle lights are still on the HUD. I thought that once the inverter would be connected the lights would turn off automatically; but they are still on. I am nervous whether I should drive or not. Any ideas?

    All the fuses and relays are enact. The radiator fan is working when AC is turned on.
     

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    #6 Asim Jahangir, Jun 17, 2014
    Last edited: Jun 17, 2014
  7. Patrick Wong

    Patrick Wong DIY Enthusiast

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    Try disconnecting the 12V battery for a few minutes to clear the DTC. If the warning lights come back then you need to have the DTC read.
     
  8. Asim Jahangir

    Asim Jahangir Junior Member

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    went away like a charm.... thanks!
     
  9. Asim Jahangir

    Asim Jahangir Junior Member

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    The car was running fine. For the past 3-4 days, problems have begun again. After 10-15mins of city driving, the big exclamation mark comes on the HUD, sometimes accompanied by the thermostat symbol on the panel. The exclamation sign lasts from 1sec to 30secs, and automatically goes away. I have checked the inverter pump, and it seems to be working fine (turbulence in liquid on car ON). I also checked the radiator fans and they are working fine as well. I have also noticed mild reduction in acceleration of the car, specially at higher speeds (50m/hr +). I am in a fix to what is going on. Any thoughts?
     
  10. Patrick Wong

    Patrick Wong DIY Enthusiast

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    Check the radiator coolant level again.
     
  11. Asim Jahangir

    Asim Jahangir Junior Member

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    Checked. It's full in both the radiator and the access fluid reservoir.
     
  12. Patrick Wong

    Patrick Wong DIY Enthusiast

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    When you turn the air conditioner on, do both radiator fans blow air towards the engine?

    Use a handheld IR instant-read thermometer to measure the temperature of the radiator hose connected to the engine thermostat housing. It should be ~82 degrees C when the engine is warmed up. If much higher maybe the engine thermostat needs to be replaced.

    What is the condition of the engine coolant: any debris or rust within? If the coolant is not perfect, drain and replace with Toyota Super Long Life Coolant or a suitable substitute.

    Check the engine oil level.
     
    #12 Patrick Wong, Jul 10, 2014
    Last edited: Jul 10, 2014
  13. SageBrush

    SageBrush Senior Member

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    Seems clear the engine cooling is not operating right

    The parts/functions involved are:
    Sensor (thermostat)
    Fluid
    Pump/belt
    Free path for fluid flow
    Fan

    Has work been performed recently on the car that might have introduced air into the system ?
    If not, then thermostat or pump/belt remain as possibilities. A defective pump often leads to coolant leak seen as a pink crust in a line from where the fluid was thrown out by the rotating device.
     
    #13 SageBrush, Jul 11, 2014
    Last edited: Jul 12, 2014
  14. Asim Jahangir

    Asim Jahangir Junior Member

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    I got the codes read and the car had two errors: Transmission Control and Inverter Pump. Both the codes were removed. The mechanic said that sometimes the codes are stuck in the system and clearing them helps.

    But I am still getting the exclamation mark error. The error comes after around 10-15mins of driving, and usually when the A/C is on. The error usually remains on from a few seconds to a couple of minutes and then automatically goes away. The sign is accompanied by a thermostat sign on the screen.

    The engine coolant was replaced around January and is in clear condition. Coolant in the extra reserve has been depleting but very slowly. There are no signs on dripping or leakage on the underbody of the engine. I checked both fans, and both are working and pushing air towards the engine. The coolant level in the inverter pump is also full.

    Another thing: when the A/C is running, condensation appears on the A/C pipes leading from the radiator unit and into (somewhere) towards the engine. The condensation is so dense that it sometimes drips as well. Could it cause the error?

    My mechanic is at a fix. Note that there is no authorized prius dealership in where I live. Also, the temperatures are around 95 degree (35 Celcius).
     
  15. Asim Jahangir

    Asim Jahangir Junior Member

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    Patrick, when should I check for the temperature of coolant in the radiator? Right after starting or at the time the error appears?
     
  16. Patrick Wong

    Patrick Wong DIY Enthusiast

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    1. If the engine coolant level in the reservoir continues to drop, this is due to at least one of the following three possibilities: a) engine coolant leak, most likely at the coolant pump bearing, or b) air remaining in the system, or c) the engine cylinder head gasket is leaking which allows coolant to enter the combustion chambers and be consumed.

    2. When the engine is cold, check the engine coolant level in the radiator, again. Remove the large black plastic panel over the radiator for access to the radiator cap.

    3. If the radiator coolant level is low, fill it to the very top of the radiator. Replace the radiator cap. Fill the reserve tank to the full mark.

    4. Check the engine oil level on the dipstick. If you see any milkiness in the oil, this is due to engine coolant contamination which means the head gasket is leaking.

    5. If the coolant level was low in the radiator, you still have air in the engine coolant loop and that is the reason why the engine is overheating. In that case, make the Prius READY. Turn the cabin heater on, set the temperature control to MAX HEAT and turn the cabin fan to the highest speed. While the car is sitting on the driveway and the gear selector is in P, floor the accelerator pedal to rev up the engine as fast as you can make it spin, which will probably be around 3,000 RPM. Rev up the engine for around 10 minutes. The point of doing this is to encourage any air to flow out of the engine coolant loop and into the radiator. While you are doing this, if you see any warning lights appear, stop the engine.

    6. There is no point in checking engine coolant temperature until you see an overheating indication. Check the temperature at the engine thermostat outlet, not at the radiator.

    7. Inspect the engine coolant pump bearing for coolant seeping out. If you see a pinkish or whitish deposit on the inside of the pump pulley or a deposit buildup on top of the air conditioner compressor housing, that is evidence of a leaking pump and that should be replaced.

    8. I assume that your location has very high humidity. It is quite normal for the cold air conditioning plumbing to condense the humidity out of the air and substantial water droplets will form as a result on the cold pipes.

    9. Do not drive the car until you figure out why the engine is overheating. You are risking permanent damage to the engine when it overheats. The engine head and block are both made of aluminum and will not withstand abuse.

    10. If you can't find any other problem, replace the engine thermostat.
     
    #16 Patrick Wong, Jul 20, 2014
    Last edited: Jul 20, 2014
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  17. Asim Jahangir

    Asim Jahangir Junior Member

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    Thanks for the detailed post.

    1. I have been checking the coolant level in the reservoir since I last replaced it (which was in January). The coolant level in the radiator is always full. And it is always a couple of quarts low in the extra reservoir. This had been the case even before the current problems began.

    2. Just checked, the coolant level in the radiator was full. The reservoir needed about 3 quarts (700ml) to fill.

    3. Both radiator and reservoir filled again.

    4. Checked the engine oil level. The level is up to mark on the dipstick and appears in a clean healthy state. The oil was replaced around 500 miles ago.

    5. So I tried doing this. Even at the maximum temperature on the climate control, the A/C is throwing out cool air. Is it supposed to churn out hot air? I think this is because the temperature in the cabin is higher than the max temperature possible on the A/C. Is there a way to force A/C throw hot air? Or would this trick work even if A/C is on cool air?

    6. Can you please guide where is the engine thermostat outlet?

    7. The inverter pump appears clean. This pump was replaced a few weeks back as well. Is there another pump that I should check?

    8. Should I worry about the condensation?

    9. Thanks.

    10. Where can I find the thermostat? Is it possible to replace myself?
     
  18. Patrick Wong

    Patrick Wong DIY Enthusiast

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    1, 2, 3: When was the last time you had checked the engine coolant level prior to today, and how many miles have been driven since that time? Three quarts is a huge amount, and if that had leaked out it should be pretty obvious where it is going.
    4: OK
    5: The A/C compressor should be turned off when you are trying to run the cabin heater. If you cannot get a tremendous amount of heat out of the cabin heater, the cabin heater core may be clogged.
    6, 10: See my thread: How to replace engine coolant pump and thermostat | PriusChat
    7: The inverter coolant loop is separate from the engine coolant loop, so if the inverter coolant reservoir is staying full, you don't need to worry about that.
    8: No

    Please post sharp and well-lighted photos of your engine's coolant pump, air conditioner compressor, engine radiator, and the radiator reservoir. I do not think the standard reservoir holds more than one quart of fluid.
     
  19. Asim Jahangir

    Asim Jahangir Junior Member

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    My bad in the calculation. I meant 2-3rds of a quart. (about 600 ml).

    I routinely check the reservoir. Last I checked was about 2 weeks ago.

    So this is what I did this evening: I drained the coolant in the radiator and refilled it with coolant. While refilling, I kept the engine on READY and with AC running, and kept pumping the radiator hose going into the engine. I was able to get a lot of coolant in the radiator - I think about over 3 liters of it. There was a lot of air bubbles coming out of the radiator lid. All this process took about 15mins during which I kept the engine reving and kept adding the coolant. After about 10mins of AC running, hot air started to blow, so I think the A/C is working fine. When I last filled the coolant, I was only able to add around 1 liter. I was surprised that time as well as very little coolant was added. I think now there is adequate amount in the system.

    I also took one pipe out of inverter pump and drained a little bit of coolant to take the air out. I don't think there was any air in the inverter pump.

    During this entire process, no warning lights appeared. I drove the car for about 20mins with AC soon after. There was still no light. I hope this permanently fixes the issue.
     
  20. Patrick Wong

    Patrick Wong DIY Enthusiast

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    A good start, and a good sign that the cabin heater is functioning.

    Check the radiator and reservoir levels after the engine has cooled down. Refill as needed. Repeat this check daily, until you no longer see either level drop.