4th generation coming 2015!

The point is if you pay $5K more for a Prius you won't make up the cost difference in gas savings. You can pick away at the list of cars all you want but that is the basic principle I'm showing in the chart. I just want people to consider more than the gas savings. Most people don't think about the extra cost and the extra interest when they do their mpg savings over time. Hybrids do cost more than non hybrids.

When I did my car research back in 2008 I did end up comparing the 2008 Prius Gen 2 with the Honda Civic. To me it was close and my family thought so too. But we did buy the Prius.

 

Sure you will, and easily.

4 cents a mile fuel savings
Break-even after 5000/.04 = 125000 miles

Prius reliability far exceeds 125000 miles

 

Exactly my point. You've neglected to include the interest. That and the base cost difference is the only point I'm trying to make here.

If you pay cash for the car things are then much worse. I expect to make between 5% and 8% on my investment portfolio, and I'm a conservative investor. Do that calculation and you'll see you're much better off taking a loan.

 

And you have neglected the opportunity savings from the fuel savings. It's not much for either, but a wash.
I have also not bothered you with the value of a hedge to future fuel price increases. The simple arithmetic is all you need.

These days the hybrid premium is at most $3,500 is you shop around, and as low as $2000. So the savings start to accrue after as little as
2000/.04 = 50,000 miles, or more typically
3500/.04 = 87,500 miles.

 

You are correct about the opportunity savings.

 

But then you get into the range of asking, why not an old used geo metro?
Price alone wasn't, apparently, the only factor.
If it is, there are much cheaper cars out there.

 

Not including insurance, my total TCO for the 10 years we owned our '04 Prius was ~ 14 cents a mile. I think you will be hard pressed to match that with *any* other car if one includes an expectation to not be stranded by the side of the road and the opportunity cost of downtime from car in the shop is included.

Think about it -- an alternative car that gets less than 26 mpg EPA is already more expensive just from fuel costs, even if the cost of acquisition, maintenance and repair is zero.

 

These days the hybrid premium is at most $3,500 if you shop around, and as low as $2000. So the savings start to accrue after as little as
2000/.04 = 50,000 miles, or more typically
3500/.04 = 87,500 miles.

 

I agree with the value proposition. My point was that if all you are considering is dollars, you can buy a used car much cheaper than any new car, or a bike for that matter.

There are very few cars of a better value, depending upon your requirements for a vehicle.

 

There is at least one other factor involved that I don't think has been mentioned, resale value. From what I understand a Prius has excellent resale value, at least as good as other similar non hybrid cars. So some of the price premium you pay for a Prius you will get back when you sell it used (in future discounted dollars I admit).

On the other hand, most people they won't be driving 20,000 miles a year. In Canada, where I live, I believe the average is 16,000 kilometers, which is 10,000 miles.

If I buy a Prius I expect it to be at best a break even proposition for total cost. If I can break even and create a lot less pollution and use a lot less gas, that would be great.

 

EXACTLY

If only more Americans grasped this simple idea <<sigh>>

 

That chart above also needs carbon emissions added to each car following total miles driven.

 

So what is the current speculation on when the Gen IV is coming out?

 

One consideration for me for purchase of the Gen IV will actually be the quality of the support for iOS and integration of iPhone support.

I drove a recent rental Camry and it seemed to handle access of my audio files fine from my iPhone 5s, but the support seemed a bit rough around the edges.

 

Sorry, but a car is for transportation; it is NOT a self-propelled Media Chamber.

 

A car is a self-propelled media chamber, among other things. And yes I'm serious. It will be a consideration for me when I purchase.

 

Interesting. If it has some sort of Apple-specific technology or support, that would be a substantial turn off for me.

 

It's okay. Each of us have features that are important to us. We read some say they would not buy a G4 if it has the "flying bridge."

I once bought a new car and returned it because the lights were terrible. You rarely if ever get a chance to test drive a new car at night. I am in the market for a specific used car. I want a specific engine; specific transmission and a specific exterior color. I'm in no rush. Why not wait for exactly what I want?

 

Seems pretty clear to me that near future cars will have a nice, dumb screen that mirrors whatever smartphone you care to attach. I would not worry.

 

BringGo