1. Attachments are working again! Check out this thread for more details and to report any other bugs.

shims, mileage, rough ride help!

Discussion in 'Gen 3 Prius Care, Maintenance & Troubleshooting' started by maurakl, Nov 24, 2014.

  1. maurakl

    maurakl Junior Member

    Joined:
    May 3, 2013
    41
    19
    0
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    II
    I have done searches and read the posts I found about shims. I had wear on the edges of my tires, got the alignment checked, all ok, within the limits. Goodyear suggested shims. Unfortunately, I let them put some on and we got new tires. The car feels like it is hydroplaning everywhere, every road, all weather conditions. So, I went back, they said, it is not the shims, the tires are probably the problem. The ride is way rougher than it was before I ever took the car there (I wish I could reset the car like a computer and set it back like it was before I ever took it there). I also had to go back for a leaky valve (low tire) and balancing as they said the front tire "threw a weight" and was out of balance. That helped a tiny bit. So, I went back and got a refund on the tires as I hate them and I lost TEN miles per gallon since this whole mess started. HELP!! I told them I wanted the shims out too, but they left them in even though they refunded that also. So, I have new tires, ones that I have had before, a diferent brand that I was not unhappy with before. So, I am still getting 40 mpg which is really making me mad, the car still feels like it is out of control and hydroplaning everywhere and it sill feels like the front tires are out of balance. Any ideas on what in the world has happened to my car?? It is a 2010 Prius. It doesn't have all of the fancy stuff.
    I was originally upset because of a sound that sounded like one of the tires was out of balance or the alignment was out. I don't have that sound anymore with the new tires, but all of these other problems started at exactly the time we got the tires at Goodyear and the shims. The drop in mileage was immediate and is still at 40 after I got the first set of tires taken off.

    Any ideas of what the problem might be are appreciated. At this point, I want the shims off. I see them as the problem because it still feels like the car is out of my control all the time. I am also so mad that the front end feels like the tires are out of balance. I will be getting that checked tomorrow again, if possible. I have had these new tires for less than a week. I don't think it is the tires now because I have had this brand and this tire before and did not have these problems.

    My husband thinks I am crazy, but I am the one that drives the car hundreds of miles a week and something is wrong with my car!
     
  2. GregP507

    GregP507 Senior Member

    Joined:
    Apr 5, 2014
    3,002
    480
    0
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    Plug-in Base
    Welcome to the forum. I would suggest you let several people test-drive it thoroughly and give you their opinions. If all of them think it's fine, then I'd stop worrying.
     
    GrGramps likes this.
  3. xpcman

    xpcman Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2009
    1,302
    295
    0
    Location:
    California - SF Bay area
    Vehicle:
    2008 Prius
    Exactly what tires did you buy?
     
  4. maurakl

    maurakl Junior Member

    Joined:
    May 3, 2013
    41
    19
    0
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    II
    The tires that I returned were Triple Treads from Goodyear. I am really upset that I lost 10 mpg and don't know why! It also bothers me that if there is the slightest breeze, the car feels like it is going to blow off of the road. It is like I have to constantly fight it all the time, it wanders. We will get the alignment checked on Wed by a different shop.

    Could the shims be causing these problems? I read that some of the people that put shims on had to adjust them several times or use different ones, etc. At this point, I just want my car back like it used to be.
     
  5. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

    Joined:
    May 11, 2005
    107,772
    48,980
    0
    Location:
    boston
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    Plug-in Base
    how many miles on her?
     
  6. maurakl

    maurakl Junior Member

    Joined:
    May 3, 2013
    41
    19
    0
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    II
    84,000 miles on the car,
     
  7. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

    Joined:
    May 11, 2005
    107,772
    48,980
    0
    Location:
    boston
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    Plug-in Base
    what brand and model of tyres do you have now?
     
  8. maurakl

    maurakl Junior Member

    Joined:
    May 3, 2013
    41
    19
    0
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    II
    Yokohama Avid Ascend tires now.
     
  9. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

    Joined:
    May 11, 2005
    107,772
    48,980
    0
    Location:
    boston
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    Plug-in Base
    i suppose the best thing to do now is take it to a specialty alignment shop and have them drive it and try to diagnose it. did goodyear give you an alignment printout after they shimmed it?
     
  10. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

    Joined:
    May 11, 2005
    107,772
    48,980
    0
    Location:
    boston
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    Plug-in Base
    it's possible that your struts need to be replaced and caused the feathering. how many miles were on the tyres you had replaced the first time?
     
  11. maurakl

    maurakl Junior Member

    Joined:
    May 3, 2013
    41
    19
    0
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    II
    I will have the struts checked. Hmm, the old tires may have had about 50,000 miles on them. That is a guess. I got a print out and will try to post a pic of it if I can. I just read a post here that said the shims were not for disc brake cars, then it said all Gen III's were disc brake cars. It also sounds like if you have the shims you have to keep checking them all the time, like weekly for a while, etc. I really think I just want them off. Will that be a problem to have them removed?
     
  12. maurakl

    maurakl Junior Member

    Joined:
    May 3, 2013
    41
    19
    0
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    II
  13. maurakl

    maurakl Junior Member

    Joined:
    May 3, 2013
    41
    19
    0
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    II
    That print out was from the day I went back to have them check the balance and they said the driver front tire was 2 degrees out of balance or something like that. So, that reading is from a few days after the shims were installed and the tires put on (the ones I have since returned). Does it matter that they put that it is a plug in, when it is not a plug in? Would the recommended numbers be the same?
     
  14. maurakl

    maurakl Junior Member

    Joined:
    May 3, 2013
    41
    19
    0
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    II
    Does anyone have any ideas? I am so furious. I really think my car is ruined and no one seems to care but me and no one thinks there is a problem! I am STILL getting 40 to MAYBE 43 mpg which is making me mad. The front end feels completely messed up. It bumps ALL the time and I have had the front driver tire balanced THREE times in the past month. And it was not the same wheel every time. What about a bent axle or something like that? Would that cause the constant bumpy front end? I also hear a rubbing noise that was not there before. I am wondering if that is the shims. The local tire shop said you can't check the struts, and my car is apparently not near the mileage when you need new struts??

    Let's just imagine that Goodyear messed something up with the shims. Could having the shims not installed correctly be causing all of these problems? I am at my wits end here. I am just mad every time I drive the car now and I drive it at least 300 miles a week.

    help??
     
  15. DoubleDAZ

    DoubleDAZ Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2014
    1,209
    322
    0
    Location:
    Peoria AZ (Phoenix)
    Vehicle:
    2014 Prius
    Model:
    Four
    The only way to know if it's the shims is to have them removed. If they are the wrong shims and are off-center somehow, they would act just like an unbalanced wheel. Unless I don't understand what you mean by "shim", AFAIK, all a shim does is move the wheel out a bit and that's usually done to move the tire away from the inside wheel well. Not sure how that would cure a problem causing tire edge wear unless they though the tires (or tires) was rubbing on something. However, assuming you have standard wheels, etc., that would be a dumb way to fix something like that.

    Did you have wear on both the inside and outside of the tires? If so, might just have been low air pressure. All 4 tires? I assume Goodyear would have checked all that, but I have never trusted Goodyear centers after I used a coupon once and they tried to sell me a whole bunch of services I didn't need or want. And after I got only 18,000 miles on a set of Eagle GT+4's on my '88 Grand Prix, I'll never buy another set of Goodyear. Unfortunately, my Prius came with Goodyear, so I'll be glad when I need new tires.

    I can't believe they can't identify the problem after a test drive.
     
  16. maurakl

    maurakl Junior Member

    Joined:
    May 3, 2013
    41
    19
    0
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    II
    Thanks, Dave. I just have this feeling that I am right and the shims are causing a lot of problems. I have been told that I am "crazy" if I take them off, but I can tell you that it was a different car before I had the shims put on. So, the shims are supposed to make the rear tires now straight and ride flat on the road as opposed to the way that Toyota designed the car for handling? I have no idea what to believe anymore.

    I may just insist on getting the darn shims taken off and see what happens. It makes me mad that I am going to pay someone else to take them off, too. I don't think that the majority of Prius owners have shims installed, so surely, they are not necessary. At this point, I want a different car, but I think I may be stuck with this piece of junk until I pay it off in several years. Huge sigh. I had a Saturn that I have 325,000 miles on and got this to replace it. I am afraid this car won't make it until I pay it off. The Saturn went for several years after being paid off. another huge sigh.
     
  17. DoubleDAZ

    DoubleDAZ Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2014
    1,209
    322
    0
    Location:
    Peoria AZ (Phoenix)
    Vehicle:
    2014 Prius
    Model:
    Four
    Sorry, I was talking about spacers and didn't think about the shims they use during front-end alignments. If they say the alignment is right, and the image you posted suggests it is, then I'm not sure how those would give you the ride you are describing unless they are somehow making the wheels wobble or something. If the wheels are aligned and the tires are balanced, then it might be tie-rods or struts, though neither seems likely given the mileage unless there was damage somewhere along the line. Might be time to find another shop who specializes in front-ends and see what they say, sounds like Goodyear has washed it's hands of helping you. I still don't understand why they don't see the problem if they take it for a test drive. I once had to take a Meineke mechanic for a test drive twice before he heard the brake problem I was describing and then he knew exactly what it was.
     
  18. HaroldW

    HaroldW Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2012
    716
    95
    0
    Location:
    Grand Forks BC Canada
    Vehicle:
    2014 Prius
    Model:
    Three
    What air pressure are you running? I would have someone else check the alignment to insure the alignment is correct. Assurance fuel Maxx may have been a better choice? Hal
     
  19. wigwag

    wigwag Junior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2010
    14
    5
    0
    Location:
    CA
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    II
    It's troubling that you are being called crazy; new tires or alignment changes can dramatically alter the way a car drives and handles and apparently both these things have been done to your car at the same time. The alignment printout you posted (assuming it is accurate) doesn't show anything that would produce the symptoms that you are describing but I feel that the shims should be redone or removed because the rear alignment settings are now outside the range specified by Toyota for your car. As I say, I doubt this would produce your problems but could well alter the emergency handling in unpredictable ways. The ideal solution to maximize tire wear in my view would be to reshim to one degree negative camber and as close to zero toe as possible. (toe is a much greater factor in tire wear than camber). It may be beneficial at this point to look at the car on another alignment rack to eliminate possible rack calibration errors or operator error. I'm curious why a Goodyear dealer would sell you Tripletreads- showing up in a Prius would tell them that gas mileage mattered to you making Assurance Fuel Max a better choice. You should not have to pay to remove the shims- a conversation with the store manager or Goodyear customer relations is in order. Gently point out that they created a potential liability problem by going outside the accepted range.
     
    DoubleDAZ likes this.
  20. Yakoma

    Yakoma Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2014
    470
    122
    0
    Location:
    ATL-ish
    Vehicle:
    2008 Prius
    Model:
    N/A
    ^^ I agree with WW above...get Goodyear to put it back the way it was. If it still doesn't work to your satisfaction (and I hate to say it because I loathe dealerships, but), it may be time to bite the bullet and take it in to a reputable Toyota dealer for analysis and repair. It's going to cost more, but (1) you will have peace of mind that Prius "experts" have diagnosed and corrected the issue, and (2) you SHOULD have more leverage if you have additional problems. It doesn't appear that you want to do the analysis yourself - you just want to get it fixed, right? Locate a dealer service center with a good reputation and speak frankly with the service manager about the issues you are having.
     
    DoubleDAZ likes this.