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check engine light, P0301 Cylinder Misfire code

Discussion in 'Gen 2 Prius Care, Maintenance and Troubleshooting' started by Suzazoom, Apr 12, 2015.

  1. Suzazoom

    Suzazoom Junior Member

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    I apologize in advance how long this post will be but I felt it was important info:
    I bought my 2008 Prius 9-14 with 29,000 miles on it. (rebuilt title-big mistake I now know). I found out after I bought it that it had sat for 5 years before it was rebuilt) I figured it was a miracle the hybrid battery even worked.
    I had no problems until 2-4-15 when check engine light was flashing and the car was shaking. The local mechanic said was the “clutch” (torque converter), took the engine and transmission out of the car to fix it ($2200). But he realized the mass air flow sensor (MAP) was not working even after he put a new one in so had me take the car to the Toyota dealer. The dealer found a cut in the engine harness and advised me to replace the harness which he said would cost $2800. The local mechanic saw the cut via my cell phone photo and offered to fix it for free which he did.

    The next day check engine light comes on after driven 25 miles with code PO 301. (means misfires in cylinder one). The local mechanic switches cylinder 1 with 4, same code the next day, local mechanic switches the coils to the cylinders, still the next day the same code. He switched the fuel injectors. Same problem of cylinder 1 misfire. He cleaned the oil out of the intake manifold, did fuel injection cleaning, and cleaned gunk out of the fuel line. Car would drive good about 20 miles then same check engine light, same code, sometimes code PO300 (random multiple misfires).

    I take the car to a mechanic reputed for repairing hybrids (Curt’s Service, Oak Park, MI). He tests the car for several hours. He notes the problem starts at the beginning of drives then goes away but is intermittent. He spends 45 min explaining the problem could be in the wiring harness (cost $300 to check), could be in the computer control unit (cost $1400 to replace) or could need engine repair.( cost $3300) (local mechanic does not think engine is the problem due to good compression).

    Curt tells me to drive the car many miles to make sure it was more than just a stuck valve. I drive the car 120 miles with no problem. Then it drives rough just backing out of my driveway, I drive a few miles on expressway with engine losing power and sounding louder and louder, I see the hybrid battery charge goes to bottom line violet colored. I drive car off expressway, it drives rough, almost stalling at the stoplight, hybrid battery does not charge. Then about 15 min later the hybrid battery starts charging, the car rides smooth again and I drive home. I drive 300 more miles without a problem.

    I am caught in heavy rain for 15 minutes and the check engine light comes on, the master light in red comes on and the vsc light comes on plus the hybid battery charge is down to almost nothing again, this time with a red warning light on the charging battery display. This is 2 blocks from my house. Shaken, I drive home. 2 hours later I drive slowly near my house in a circle. I get the vsc light to turn off first and the hybrid battery starts charging again. I stop the car, open and close the trunk, and the master warning light turns off. The next day the car drives good and the check engine light goes off. 4 days later I am driving up a parking structure 5 floors. The hybrid battery charges goes really low. It charges up again soon after on the 60 mile drive home.

    Tonight, 250 miles after the last problem in the rain storm, the car drives rough the first 20-25 minutes, the hybrid battery goes to the bottom violet line, then after this the car hybrid battery charges back to normal and the drive home is smooth. The local mechanic and hybrid specialist mechanic do not want me to put more money into the car since they don’t know what the problem is and advise me to sell the car even if I only can get a few thousand for it. I put a total of $14,000 into buying and repairing the car, and I always wanted a Prius after owning 2 honda hybrids so I am hesitant to do this.

    If anyone can give a good guess what is the car’s problem I would like to know. I am guessing the hybrid battery is starting to fail but I am no expert on cars. I have photos of the problems described if that would help.
    Suzazoom
     
    #1 Suzazoom, Apr 12, 2015
    Last edited: Apr 12, 2015
  2. xliderider

    xliderider Senior Member

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    Holy wall of text Batman!

    Please edit and break it up into some paragraphs. ;)
     
  3. Suzazoom

    Suzazoom Junior Member

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    I guess I was trying to make a long post shorter without the breaks but you are right it needed the breaks so I put them in. thanks for the feedback. suzazoom
     
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  4. Patrick Wong

    Patrick Wong DIY Enthusiast

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    1. You did not mention whether the iridium spark plugs were swapped / replaced, but if that has not been tried yet, do that now.
    2. The intermittent nature of your car's problems definitely points towards a wiring harness problem.
    3. You previously were quoted $300 to check the wiring harness. That check needs to be done by someone who actually knows what he is doing.
    4. If you wish to do the wiring harness check yourself you can download the electrical wiring diagram at techinfo.toyota.com - this assumes you have a digital multimeter and know how to use it to perform resistance checks. Further, this assumes you are able to disassemble the car as needed for access to the engine ECU (behind the glove compartment) and the various connectors in the engine compartment. Start by verifying the electrical wiring harness connections for the spark igniter and fuel injector for cylinder 1 since you have a known misfire issue at that cylinder and parts swapping did not move the problem to another cylinder. You would need to flex the wiring while measuring resistance to see if you can find a fault.
    5. How was the cut wire repaired, and where is its location? The wire should have been soldered and heat shrink tubing used to insulate/protect the soldered joint.
    6. Figure out how the cut wire was cut. What other wiring harness damage could have been caused at the same time?
    7. Get Mini VCI so that you have your own means to obtain the DTC logged by the various ECUs in the car.
    8. Intermittent electrical issues can be very difficult to resolve. Wiring harness damage may not be obvious - look around the area of the cut wire to see what other problems exist. That is why the Toyota dealer's answer is to replace the entire harness which costs four-digits and tremendous labor effort. If you wish to avoid that repair, someone needs to spend a substantial amount of time and effort to verify the wiring harness is doing its job.
    9. If the wiring harness and connectors are found to be good then you can try replacing the engine ECU with a used unit. That will probably cost around $300 or so on eBay. However, failure of the engine ECU is a very low-probability event, that is why the price of used units is so low. So you really need to work on the wiring harness first and make sure it is electrically perfect before you start to look for other causes.
    10. It appears that the work to remove the engine/transaxle was unnecessary, and that may have resulted in further damage to the engine compartment wiring harness.
    11. In the future, avoid any car with a salvage title - unless you really want a project car and are prepared to deal with thorny issues as described in your OP.
     
    #4 Patrick Wong, Apr 13, 2015
    Last edited: Apr 13, 2015
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  5. Suzazoom

    Suzazoom Junior Member

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    Thank you very very much Mr Wong. The spark plugs were switched. I was thinking of buying my own mini VCI and I will do so at your advice. I will never ever ever consider buying a rebuilt car again. I will ask my local mechanic details about how he repaired the harness wire to see if he did it correctly. We could not figure out what caused the cut. He said it would have had to be cut by something sharp. The dealer said my local mechanic did it when he replaced the torque converter and the local mechanic admitted they made have made it worse when they took the engine/tranmisssion out and he can't believe he did not see it himself when they took the engine/transmission out. I did not get a good look at it due to the placement of it but it looked to me like there was a little rust in it so I wondered if it had caused the torque converter to go bad in the first place. cut .jpg finger.jpg . I will check the engine harness myself for more cuts, upload photos of the cut and location, and have the hybrid specialist check the engine harness for the $300. Suzazoom
     
    #5 Suzazoom, Apr 13, 2015
    Last edited: Apr 13, 2015
  6. Patrick Wong

    Patrick Wong DIY Enthusiast

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    I assume that your finger is pointing to the general location of the damaged wiring in the second photo? You would need to remove the plastic armor that surrounds the area that was damaged, and carefully inspect the wiring within.

    With 29K miles on the odometer, it is highly unlikely that anything was wrong with the transmission input damper assembly located between the engine and transaxle. That part is just a spring-loaded mechanism. There is no fluid-filled "torque converter" that you would find in a normal automatic transmission.
     
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  7. Suzazoom

    Suzazoom Junior Member

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    yes my finger was pointing towards the location of the damaged wiring. it was turned so that you could not see it from the top of the car. Thanks for the information. I have the car scheduled on 4-16-15 to have the engine harness looked at in the way Patrick wong detailed by what was told to me is a hybrid specialist.
     
    #7 Suzazoom, Apr 13, 2015
    Last edited: Apr 13, 2015
  8. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    there was another guy who pinched the wires when replacing the transaxle.
     
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  9. Suzazoom

    Suzazoom Junior Member

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    The hybrid specialist mechanic worked on my car 3 and half hours yesterday but could not find the cause of the previously described intermittent cylinder misfires. He ran a simitech sweep test on ecm and engine harness, inspected all power and ground connections, signal return to all electrical components in fuel and ignition, emission system, run voltage drops and wave patterns, pulled fuel injectors. Found code PO300 (random misfire), PO301 (cylinder 1 misfire),PO303 clylinder 3 misfire) PO304 (cylinder 4 misfire), P3190 ( Poor engine Power). He pinned out ignition coils and power grounds. He did find a fuel supply line fitting that was sweating fuel so he repositioned the O ring for the connector.
     
  10. exstudent

    exstudent Senior Member

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    HOLLY SHITE! What were you thinking, besides wanting to really have a Prius? Did you buy, knowing it was salvaged? Did you not pay for a Car Fax report? Unfortunately, mistakes are how/when we learn best sometimes.

    What was the original purchase price of this salvage? Hopefully $1 (one dollar)?
    Your $14,000+ so far could have gotten you this on Cars.com, zip 48201 (Detroit, MI), 30mile radius: Used Toyota Prius - in 48201 - on Cars.com
    A 2006 for $5,900 all the way upto a 2012 for $12,200.​

    You should have stopped spending money on this car many thousands of dollars ago. Cut your losses and buy that 2006 from Cars.com.

    If you want to spend more money, contact Steve (Autobeyours.com), talk to him about your situation and options. He has a solid reputation and rebuilds salvages into truly working order, unlike your rebuilder. You would obviously need an expensive tow, or a friend who has a truck and rent a car dolly to tow to Steve. Maybe he'll swap your work in progress for a salvaged, but working Prius, on his lot, as fair trade?

    This should be a lesson to all, don't buy a salvage unless:
    -you have the desire/skills to undertake a potential nightmare
    -have good friends who want to help, and are even more knowledgeable
    -have tools
    -have unlimited finances​
     
  11. Suzazoom

    Suzazoom Junior Member

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    I had NO IDEA the nightmare buying a rebuilt car would cause me!!!!!!!. I had one in the past that worked fine. I am a social worker who has worked with the poor 32 years and not making that much money myself and after being in a car accident with car insurance rates more then doubled I was just trying to buy something affordable. It is the worst financial mistake I have made in my life. I have looked at sale ads for honda civics and prius in my area at cars.com , craigs list and detroit auto trader for many hours this last month. I already have the seller you mentioned in the post above on my list to visit later today.
     
  12. exstudent

    exstudent Senior Member

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    If you do buy another used car, pay for a car fax report and a comprehensive vehicle inspection by a trusted mechanic, who knows and works on Prius'.

    Still contact Steve. Maybe he'll buy your salvaged Prius for an agreed upon amount? Maybe a repair to that cut wiring harness could eliminate all of the other problems? Or it could possibly reveal additional problems?

    Good luck w/ whatever you decide.
     
  13. Suzazoom

    Suzazoom Junior Member

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    I bought unlimited car fax reports and vowed to take what ever car I want to buy to a trusted mechanic first. I will contact steve. It is good to know someone on prius.com who believes he can be trusted. My car was not even rebuilt that well on the outside so I doubt he may want to buy it. thanks for your imput, exstudent.
     
  14. exstudent

    exstudent Senior Member

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    Found it! A similar story like yours, but happy ending.
    I was robbed...... | PriusChat

    Please do contact Steve. Maybe he will buy it as a parts car for upto $1k? Just guessing.

    If you have a friend w/ a truck, rent a car towing trailer from Uhaul, Ryder, etc, to so he can look at it and see what else needs to be done. Maybe it might just be that damaged wiring harness and no more. If it turns out there is additional damage that will cost more than say $1,000, $2,000, (pick your cut off amount) etc, to fix, then just sell the car to Steve. Or maybe he would be open to selling or swaping your Prius for one of his salvaged Prius, that is ready for sale, but operating correctly. He is the man to go to if buying a salvage, getting help fixing a salvage, getting HV Battery help, or just some parts.
     
  15. Suzazoom

    Suzazoom Junior Member

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    thanks for posting this thread that tells about the other woman who had a similar experience with buying a Prius.

    I will call Steve to see what he says. My car does not have to be towed as a car works very well about 97% of the time. It only gives me a rough ride every 122 to 300 miles and then only for 6 to 20 minutes. I have figured out that when the car drives rough, which I think is due to only being able to use 3 out of the 4 cylinders, if I stay on surface streets driving 35 mph the problem goes away in 6 minutes where as if I drive on the express way the hybrid battery charge goes down all the way and I have to get off the expressway so the problem will go away. The only other time I had a problem was very driving in very heavy rain for 15 minutes and the car may have skidded on the several inches of water in the road.

    I drove the car 167 miles today with no problems, averaging 47.4 mpg. I might just keep it and use it for drives to work (5 miles) or nearby and buy a older honda civic for long drives. The mechanic who worked on it said he felt it was safe to drive the 4 hour drive to my sister's house.

    I do wonder if the repair to the engine harness was done correctly. My local mechanic said he knows a mechanic 5 miles from me who specializes in electrical repairs and although I don't want to waste more money on the car I might ask him to check out the repair. I also don't know how much of a hybrid specialist mechanic the one I had work on the car a total of 7 hours, would know enough to inspect he engine harness. He told me the wiring my test well while sitting there but not be able to perform under "a load" (driving) and that makes sense to me. . As Mr Wong said, the intermittent electrical problems are very hard to diagnose.
     
  16. Suzazoom

    Suzazoom Junior Member

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    I just looked up the website autobeyours and found that it is only 6 hours 20 minutes from where I live. If he could fix my car for under $1000 It would be worth it to me to drive there. I will write or call him soon. I won't get my hopes up but it is worth a try.
     
  17. Fishcrab

    Fishcrab Member

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    To the OP, DONT feel bad about your mistakes, we all walk different paths.
    Not everyone has the insight or hindsight to rationalize things in the mechanical world of CARS , in your case where to stop.
    I wish you the best.
     
  18. JC91006

    JC91006 Senior Member

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    I know you'll probably not buy another rebuilt title again but the mileage that shows on the rebuilt car can be false. The rebuilt car can have a different transaxle, engine, odometer, basically anything. There is no law that prevents them from stating whatever mileage they wish, as the car is considered "rebuilt".

    On your car with such low mileage, I would not assume anything is original on your car, as everything and anything could have been switched out
     
  19. Suzazoom

    Suzazoom Junior Member

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    you are right that the car has parts from different years. One door on my 2008 toyota prius has a 2006 vin number, the manual is a 2006 manual.The mechanic and his partner did say the engine, exhaust system and transmission looked low miles. as for the rest well...
     
    #19 Suzazoom, Apr 18, 2015
    Last edited: Apr 18, 2015
  20. exstudent

    exstudent Senior Member

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    My money is on Steve being able to fix the intermittent problem. Performing Prius surgery: slicing, dicing, reattaching donor parts, etc. This is his business and his livelihood.

    Please do make that phone call, and tell him the complete history. He might be good enough like Click and Clack (the Magliozzi brothers from Car Talk on NPR), and give a near accurate diagnosis over the phone. You will probably have to leave the car w/ him for a few days. Do inquire with him if a swap is possible; your semi-functioning salvage for one of his working salvages, for zero dollars or for a few dollars?

    My guess is all the people who touched your car, mechanically wise, learned about Prius' at your expenses. They might be competent with conventional cars, but the Prius is a different beast. Did they even have Techstream software and a mini VCI cable?

    I am confident you will NEVER, knowingly go down the salvaged path again. If not, you are a masochist.

    Do report back here w/ Steve's findings and the ultimate outcome. I'm sure everyone here wishes you the best.