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Intermittent Starting Issues

Discussion in 'Gen 2 Prius Care, Maintenance and Troubleshooting' started by chickharley, Apr 19, 2015.

  1. chickharley

    chickharley New Member

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    I have a 2005 Prius. Off and on it has been showing the ABS, VSC, (!) and Brake lights and will occasionally not go into READY mode (just ACC and IG-ON). The lights have been doing this at least 6 months and the starting issues are more recent. I brought it to the dealer last fall and they said the front brakes needed replacing and they did a battery test and said it was fine. I had the brakes replaced, but the lights stayed on.

    Last week I brought it in to the dealer and of course these things just will not show up for them and they said to bring it back when the lights came on again so they could put it on the scanner. I returned on another visit to have them read the codes, and they said the scanner they had wasn't bringing up the code and I'd need a longer appointment to put it on the laptop scanner. I asked if the battery could be doing this as I read on these forums that the 12V battery is often the cause. I did the Vehicle Display Check using the instructions in this forum and it was dipping down to 11.5V when the car was put into IG-ON mode, and I explained that. The service guy said it very well could be and they could do a load test, but it would take awhile. I hadn't planned on a long visit and didn't have time to have them run it then. I also asked if it would start accruing labor fees, and he said yes. So rather than spend $120 on labor on top of the battery, I chose to buy the battery myself and put it in.

    Today I put in the battery with my dad's help. I didn't get any lights on my hour long drive home, but the starting seems to be worse. Shortly after getting home, I went out again to a store 5 minutes away for milk. When I came back out, it took at least 5 minutes to get the thing to go into READY mode. Any suggestions on what could be causing this? I'm afraid if I bring it back to the dealer again the car will lapse into another episode of Dealer Aversion Disorder.
     
  2. Patrick Wong

    Patrick Wong DIY Enthusiast

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    A good idea to replace the 12V battery now if there was any question about the old battery. It doesn't make sense to spend $120 to test the old battery and I am glad you realized that.

    Get Mini VCI so that you can retrieve diagnostic trouble codes as well as the dealer tech using Toyota Techstream with the diagnostic laptop.
     
  3. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    how many miles on her?
     
  4. ChapmanF

    ChapmanF Senior Member

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    Wait, what? Welcome to Zeke's Toyota, where we'll offer you a short appointment to hook up some Acme Scanblaster we know can't read Prius codes, or make you come back for a longer one where we actually use Techstream like we're supposed to?

    :mad:

    -Chap
     
  5. chickharley

    chickharley New Member

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    I can hook it up to my own laptop to run the codes with this?
     
  6. chickharley

    chickharley New Member

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    About 146,000 miles on the car. I bought it used a year and a half ago.
     
  7. chickharley

    chickharley New Member

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    I think they thought I was saying that a check engine light was on, although I was very clear about which lights were on and said that other than the (slightly overdue) oil change light and the aforementioned ones, no check engine light was on. Still, a huge waste of time with a 4 year old and a 2 year old in tow.
     
  8. JC91006

    JC91006 Senior Member

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    You might have a bad brake light switch. Next time it won't start, try pressing HARD on the brakes and then the start button. If that works, your brake switch needs to be replaced or adjusted. Replacement cost for the part is about $40
     
  9. ChapmanF

    ChapmanF Senior Member

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    Yup.

    -Chap
     
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  10. chickharley

    chickharley New Member

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    Last night that wasn't working, but I can't say for sure that it wasn't working before. I'll try again the next time. Would that show up in the codes if I buy the Mini VCI?
     
  11. Patrick Wong

    Patrick Wong DIY Enthusiast

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    A bad brake light switch will not be reported as a DTC. This is something you can figure out for yourself if you park so that you can see the brake lights reflected off a surface, or have a helper verify whether the brake lights work or not as you depress the brake pedal.

    However, if that is a problem, it is not the only problem your car has since you indicate the ABS, VSC and BRAKE lights appear.

    When the Prius is READY, check the inverter coolant reservoir for fluid turbulence. If you do not see this, the inverter coolant pump has failed and that is the cause of those warning lights.

    If the pump is good and you still have those warning lights, you need Mini VCI to determine the DTC logged by the skid control ECU.
     
  12. chickharley

    chickharley New Member

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    Well crap. My spouse drove it to work today and now the brakes are not working properly. They do nothing until you press them hard and then they pull strongly, and if you're holding them down hard at a light, but not all the way, sometimes they just let go for a moment. :-/ Making an appointment now. It's strange that they decided to go all crazy after we replaced the battery. I think the battery needed to be replaced anyway because it would die if you left the door slightly ajar, so at least that wasn't a complete waste.
     
  13. ChapmanF

    ChapmanF Senior Member

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    If your Mini VCI hasn't arrived yet, I am pretty sure you can still get your brake system codes in a Gen 2 by counting blinkenlights. Check this post and the couple right after it for an idea what's involved (though that post was for a Gen 1).

    I don't have a Gen 2 and I wasn't sure that method still worked, but I recently saw someone reporting it still worked even in a Gen 3, so it should be good to go. Your spouse can do it in the parking lot at work with a short piece of wire or even (carefully) a paper clip. We're in the dark without those codes, and it's your brakes.

    -Chap
     
  14. JC91006

    JC91006 Senior Member

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    Isn't there a brake controller back by the battery? I would just make sure all the wires are plugged back in and nothing you've forgotten
     
  15. dolj

    dolj Senior Member

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    Yup, nothing like paying 100 bucks for the dealer to tell you "you're stupid", of course they take no pleasure in that and try and say it in the nicest possible way.
     
  16. chickharley

    chickharley New Member

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    It was the brake light switch as suggested by a couple people. Thanks! They tried to get me to pay them to replace a couple bulbs and the air filter, too, for an extraordinary amount, but I said I could do that stuff myself. Them: It's only $25 to replace these two little indicator lights, not big change. Me: Yeah, but the bulbs cost $3. I'll do that myself and save the $20, thanks.
     
  17. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    well done!(y)
     
  18. JC91006

    JC91006 Senior Member

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    There is a DTC for the bad switch, in fact you were the one that helped me identify the problem when I first got my 2005. I listed all the DTCs and one of them was for the faulty brake switch.
     
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  19. ChapmanF

    ChapmanF Senior Member

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    Good news about the stop light switch.

    Are you also no longer experiencing the hard-stopping/pulling behavior your spouse was dealing with yesterday?

    -Chap
     
  20. Patrick Wong

    Patrick Wong DIY Enthusiast

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    You are right, DTC C1249 is posted by the skid control ECU when it determines a problem with the brake light switch. However I would not have expected all of the brake warning lights to turn on as reported by the OP, simply because of that one issue.