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All EVs, PHEVs specs/dimensions compared

Discussion in 'Toyota Prius Plug-in' started by evnow, Nov 13, 2011.

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  1. evnow

    evnow Active Member

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    I made a list of Plugins comparing their dimensions and other specs.

    My Nissan Leaf Forum • View topic - All EVs, PHEVs specs/dimensions compared

    I thought people here who don't frequent MNL might be interested as well. Corrections welcome. I've the current/future plugins (sold in the US) with some published specs in the list. The numbers come from either the manufacturer or from one of the auto sites like MSN Auto or Edmunds.

    [​IMG]
    Link : Picasa Web Albums - EV Now
    Link to excel sheet : plugin-specs.xlsx - Google Drive
    Last updated : 2/21/13
    9 people like this.
  2. gwmort

    gwmort Active Member

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    I don't know how available the info is but I think adding in the Cda's would be nice.
  3. efusco

    efusco Troll Slayer Staff Member

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    Nice list! Good work. I'll sticky this thread, hopefully you can keep the table updated for us as new information and cars come out.
  4. ryogajyc

    ryogajyc Active Member

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    evnow, where did the 10* for the Prius Plug-In EPA EV range come from? I thought it was suppose to be 15; is it really going to be that low?
  5. Jeff N

    Jeff N Senior Member

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    The 13-15 mile electric range for the PiP is either a result of blending in some gasoline power or careful driving under favorable conditions. Careful driving under favorable conditions gets you 50 miles in a Volt or 100 miles in a Leaf but the chart shows 35 and 73 because it uses EPA estimates for electric and gas in order to be consistent.

    We don't have an EPA electric range estimate for the PiP but it isn't hard to come up with a fair equivalent one. If you look at the ratio of NEDC to EPA range estimates for both the Volt (51.6 vs 35) and Leaf (108.75 vs 73) they turn out to be almost identical. Apply the same ratio to Toyota's self-announced target NEDC electric range estimate of 14.3 miles for the PiP and you get just under 10 miles.

    Here is a related discussion:

    http://priuschat.com/forums/toyota-...rsus-volt-costs-less-drive-2.html#post1405260
  6. giora

    giora Active Member

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    Trying to take results of the two cycles for one car to estimate results for another car can lead to absurd conclusions...
    Example:
    EPA rating of Prius is 50 mpg while CT200h is rated 42 mpg (16% less). But in the NEDC cycle those two cars are rated the same (26 km/l give or take half of a percent depending on wheels sizes).
  7. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    He did use two cars, the Leaf and Volt, before applying it to the PHV Prius.

    As two the NEDC numbers for the Prius and CT200h, instead testing every model and variant, the EPA allows test results from one vehicle to be used for another with similair drive train. Being close in size and weight, with the same drive train, Toyota may have been allowed to do the same in Europe.
  8. giora

    giora Active Member

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    Are you joking or what?
  9. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    I'm serious. The EPA does allow results of a car stand in for a similar one. Manufacturers do most of the testing. The EPA itself only tests new models, redesigns, and some others to double check on the manufacturers. They simply don't have the resources to test all. Until recently, they didn't have the means of testing AWD or full time 4WD, and had to disconnect one set of wheels from the drive train.

    These tests are also done on dynos. Air drag isn't going to have an effect on a stationary vehicle. Wind resistance is simulated by the machine based on cda or the drag is calculated in the fudge factor afterwards.
  10. giora

    giora Active Member

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    These are different cars, not different trims of the same car. What makes you state Euro NEDC allowed for this here?

    Want some real numbers? look at my signiture. If I am not a reliable source for you, look at this post by pakitt.
  11. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    My life time average with a gen2 was in the mid to high 50's mpg. I was regularly seeing 58 to 62 mpg before I sold it. The HHR's numbers are in the signature.

    I don't see what that has to do with a regulatory agency's testing method.

    If model twins, like Ford/Lincoln for example, are deemed close enough, then the test results of one can be used for the other. I don't know if NEDC allows this. I was merely offering a suggestion for why the CT200 and Prius might have the same numbers there since they use the same drive train. The other is that the test doesn't account for the CT's aerodynamic drawback.

    Back to topic. If the NEDC and EPA numbers for the Volt EV mode range and Leaf are the same ratio, then it is a fair assumption to use for the PHV Prius until the official numbers are released.
  12. evnow

    evnow Active Member

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    Thanks - I didn't realize it had been stickied. I'll keep this updated - as I update in MNL.
  13. efusco

    efusco Troll Slayer Staff Member

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  14. evnow

    evnow Active Member

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    I didn't use the method Jeff has explained. But it is good that - that method gives similar figures.

    I used the 30% adjustment that EPA does to all EVs. I've also similarly reduced Tesla S's range.

    Unless EPA changes their policy, I'm fairly sure the range I estimate (that is why the *) will be closer to the EPA range, than the one they are advertising.
  15. evnow

    evnow Active Member

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    Yes - I've some others to add - like Coda, Wheego, Smart EV, Think City.

    There are also the CARB play ones (limited availability) - like RAV4EV, iQ EV, Spark EV, Fit EV, Active E, 500 EV. I might make a separate list for them, though currently none of their dimensions are available.
    2 people like this.
  16. efusco

    efusco Troll Slayer Staff Member

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    Couple more "unofficial" specs for the Model S
    (in addition to the cargo room I posted above)
    length 196", wheelbase 116.5"

    Liquid cooled motor 300kw (402hp)
  17. andyprius

    andyprius Senior Member

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    Nice job on #1 post. It is interesting to see that the PIP exceeds almost every parameter of every car on the list. Thankyou for your effort. :cheer2:
  18. reschen

    reschen New Member

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    Toyota is claiming 87 mpg for the PIP...does anyone know how that is computed? Do they assume a daily average usage and recharge at night?...Do they convert KWH to Gal in some manner?...anyone know? If you only go 10 miles a day, there could be no gas usage...thoughts?
  19. JimboPalmer

    JimboPalmer Nadir of Wrongness

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    [ame=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miles_per_gallon_gasoline_equivalent]Miles per gallon gasoline equivalent - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame]
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  20. daniel

    daniel Cat Lovers Against the Bomb

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    Thanks for posting that chart!

    A question / comments:

    Where did you get the "base" price of $128,500 for the Tesla Roadster? Mine had a base price of $109,000. (Not counting some options which raised the price to about $117,000.)

    The book lists the torque as 273 lb-ft for my non-Sport, and 295 lb-ft for the Sport model. Not the 370 given in your chart.

    Since you didn't give the ground clearance, I tried to measure it. But since it appears the lowest point is not at either bumper, I had to eyeball it. Measuring at the front and looking back, it looks like 5 inches, but measuring from the back looking forward it looks like 4 inches. THIS site gives it as 5.1 inches.