Do NiMH Batteries Still Have A Long Future?

Obviously, there will always be a market for NiMH batteries in hybrids and mild-hybrids anticipated for start stop technology vehicles.

Since hybrid and mild-hybrid batteries require less capacity than full BEV's, the advantage of lighter weight lithium-ion batteries are minimalized by the requirement of added safety hardware.

 

It sounds nice but we need to see the original paper. Just a quick reminder:

1. 1.2V - current generation, single NiMH cell voltage potential
2. 3.3-3.6V - single LiON cell voltage potential (depends on chemistry)

Until we see stable, multi-valence batteries, it will be the single-cell voltage that determines the energy density.

Bob Wilson

 

I've learned a long time, ago, that the latest and greatest high technology system are NOT always the best for the application desired.

Simpler and more reliable older technologies that serve the purpose can be better.

 

Like your 10 year old Nokia that got 7 days standby time and picked up a signal in the middle of nowhere, compared to the new 'smart' phones that struggle on standby for 24 hours, are loaded with bloatware and drop calls when you're 2 miles out of the city?

When my Samsung dies I won't bother with a new one; I'll go back to a cheapo phone that does the job of being an actual phone that works.

 

Isn't this the same thing done with NiMH in hybrids for the same reasons?

Because it may not remain cheaper. The two may even be on par in price for EV batteries right now.

BASF is aiming for a $175 kWh NiMH battery. No timeline is given in the article on when that may happen. Meanwhile, this paper is claiming $200 kWh Li-ion by 2020: The Lithium Ion Inflection Point | Battery Power Magazine. Tesla's gigafactory will be online before then, and it is supposed to get prices to that $200 mark in order to make the Model 3 possible.

 

I normally do not comment on new battery technology posts, because of course anything is possible.
But I know how many years and how hard it is to get through the R&D cycle and make it into a commerical product, for any technology.

 

That being so, the airlines have again banned shipment of large quantities of small lithium-ion batteries.

I'll stick with the ultra reliable NiMH batter that I have in my Prius.

 

I think you are misremembering the past. If you don't use the smart features some of today's phones have much longer talk and standby time. This one even has 9.5 hours of internet time over the cellular network.
HTC One M8 Review - Smartphones - Laptop Mag

On cell service, in the US I get much better service than I did a decade ago. I don't know if it is worse in the UK. Service is all about the cell providers, and I can belive they have gone down hill in the UK. In the US some providers (Verison and AT&T) have good coverage while people on other networks seem to always be borrowing my phone ;-) Now 10 years ago, I used to buy an extra battery and carry it with me on trips, now I have an iphone which can't swap batteries, but I charge from my laptop on trips ;-)

Same phone or laptop, you get a lot more with lithium than nimh. Prices now are low enough for lithium that for everything but toyota cars, if you buy a decent device it will use the better lithium technology. BASF isn't going to make any nimh car batteries. They may make some nimh for very cheap devices where people want to save $0.50 by going with that technology.

 

lol I don't believe I am.

Sure a smart phone might last two days on standby if I leave it in the house. But drive about causing it to search for masts and the battery disappears.

My old Nokia in a top drawer in my spare room charged up fine and lasts about 10 days on standby and a good week if driving about.

Maybe it's an adroid thing but I'm fed up of the phone updating bloatware pretty much every other day - at my expense. Grrr

 

Fair enough, my experience was different. I turn off wifi and bluetooth when traveling, then it lasts much longer. That htc claims 21 days standby time on just cellular. But ok, I have an iphone. I decide when it updates its os, and version 8 did cause a big hit to my battery life, but then I got a iphone 6 with a bigger battery. Definitely your changes had to do with the phones not the batteries which are much better today.

 

Well lets see what they are doing, and see if your speculation makes sense.

Toyota Makes Moves to Secure Lithium Supply in Argentina - Gas 2
hmm that seems to mean toyota sees a lot more lithium in its future. What about panasonic? They bought sanyo for their lithium technology. They are charging ford less for a lithium battery in their hybrids than they were selling them nimh batteries.

No neither company seems to think nimh is the future. Now Toyota/Panasonic have a lot invested in nimh. That means that toyota may be slower moving off the technology, but the move is inevitable. Today it looks like lithium batteries are less expensive than nimh. The electronic control circuitry though is more expensive, and there is testing to conform to CARBs 10 year warranty. Electronics follows moore's law and is going to drop in price in the future. A drastically new nimh chemistry would require just as much testing as a new lithium chemistry. Toyota is not going to move backwards on its phev tech and put a nimh in the next phev. They anounced that some gen IV prii will use lithium but most will be nimh.

 

Some thread on PC linked to an article showing the NIMH chemistry was less affected by higher and lower temperatures than Lithium ion chemistry.mthat suggested to me that for those of us in wide-temperature-swing states the NIMH chemistry may be more durable/effective in practice.

 

Neither Lithium or Nimh like being charged at high temperatures. In Lithium though it doesn't just degrade the battery it can ruin it, so it requires sensors, but the nimh if treated properly should also not be charged at temperatures much over 100 degrees fahrenheit. They can discharge hotter to start the car though. In cold weather most lithium chemistries do worse than most nimh, although you can make lithium chemistry to discharge slowly at -40 degrees which is lower than most nimh. I believe panasonic made a chemistry that works well in the cold for the toyota alpha and the ford hybrids.

 

BASF is just going to offer licenses for its Ovonic™ Nickel Metal-Hydride (NiMH), so they won’t make batteries or battery cells. I believe they just want to make sure nobody steals their original investment, which is purchasing Ovonic. The original patents owned by Chevron expired in 2011, so BASF is looking to solidify their offerings by putting money into an investment.

Toyota, after reading all the various articles posted here over the years, hasn’t given up on NiMH and may have the same advancements as BASF. They’ve repeatedly said in the past (Green Car Congress: Toyota broadly outlines next-generation Prius; developing wireless inductive charging for the plug-in model; bullish on hydrogen) they significantly increased power density levels in NiMH as well as motors. They’ve also learned not to be so conservative with their NiMH batteries as they are far more durable and tolerant of large power swings than even they thought they’d be. So the 4th Gen Prius with its new engines, motors, and batteries may become diesel killers. But in the age of new low gas prices, and the reluctance of the new Congress to give anybody a tax break, they may have also killed off their own FCV.

Now if they can just get away from their polarizing styling problems ......

 

Tough to parse but here is the statement

Since toyota's Li-Ion batteries in the Toyota alpha and prius phv have significantly higher energy density (both wh/kg and wh/l) than their nimh I would expect that the higher energy density toyota batteries would stay lithium. The lithium batteries require more expensive electronics.

DailyTech - Next Generation Prius to Offer NiMH and Li-ion Batteries, Possible AWD Variant

In the Japan and the US the chief markets for the prius, the prius liftback already sells much better than any diesel. If the gen IV improves the design, I would think that hybrids would increase their lead over diesels. ;-)

Congress and the state of california looks to be providing over $350M for fuel cells and hydrogen fuelin the next 3 years, during the period toyota only expects to lease or sell 3000 fcv in the US and expects the all players to lease or sell less than 10,000 in the period. California will give additional subsidies of $5000 and 9 zev credits to each one.

Toyota sells more prii in a month than they expect to make fcv in the next 3 years (and Japan is providing a 3m Yen subsidy per car in one district and massive R&D and hydrogen fueling support).