Do you know what Honda Insight owners are talking about recently?

Before I bought Prius I have also test drove Honda Insight. After test drove Prius first, I found Insight looks cheap, has much less power (when needed) and very noisy and busy and small, but cheaper in price and has a paddle shifter. I went with Prius for best mpg and better power if I needed. Today I was just curious on what Honda Insight mpg performance in the real world looks like. I went to their forum and found this topic, link here.
EPA Estimates 2010 Insight vs. 2010 Prius - Insight Central: Honda Insight Forum
You may find it interesting that they are all complaining Toyota cheating on mpg. Go see for yourself. It may amaze you.

I don't know what they're talking about, plenty of us (including myself) get at least 50 mpg in our GenIII.

I like one of the explanations for one Insight driver that was getting poor mileage, "1. Kay is lying (she works for Toyota maybe) 2. Kay is an IDIOT and her driving style proves it". Lets not descend to that level of discourse.

On a more serious note though, I have had trouble getting 50 MPG for an entire tank of gas. During the first two tanks I wasn't making much of an effort to hypermile and I got 44.2 MPG both times (yes, it was exactly the same both times... freaky I know). However, on my most recent tank I really did try harder and only got marginally better mileage, 45.3 MPG. I'm still thrilled with the car and the mileage, and I may try again to perfect P&G etc after my next fill-up. I think both the hills and traffic around where I am make it difficult to get to that 50 mark consistently.

I report on fueleconomy.gov and I noticed that there aren't that many others up there. Report your mileage.

I went there yesterday trying to find out what kind of mileage the Insight was getting. There were a few fanatics there talking about how Toyota is cheating with their market strategy. I found the MPG results were close to the GenII and III according to some of their members data and comments. One thing that was obvious was the fact that the Honda hybrid systems computer was very optimistic by about 2 gallons on MPG. Sound familiar?

I wouldn't call it 'cheating' but it's pretty clear some automakers are designing 'to the test' in order to maximize their published MPG rating. Just look at how much effort went in to making sure the Gen 3 Prius hit the 50 MPG mark by limiting the options packages over a few pounds.

Most people who do the hand calculations see that the display reads a few MPG higher than reality. http://priuschat.com/forums/gen-iii...vs-computer-mpg-please-post-your-results.html Edmunds' test also found the Prius overestimates itself. Fuel Sipper Smackdown 2: Which Car Gets the Best Fuel Economy?

I have to admit that when I purchased the car I expected to get 48-50 mpg without a problem and with some work maybe even 55-60. I've had my gen3 IV for about 2 months now and am slowly trying to reform the way that I drive.

My last car was a mustang and I'm a bit lead footed. If I drive 'normally' I am only getting about 43-44 mpg. If I try really hard on an entire tank I can get it up to about 48.

I don't drive with the AC on much but I do drive with the windows open and I'm sure that adds quite a bit of drag especially since most of my driving is highway.

I've been driving the gen III for almost 3 weeks now and have been getting an average of 50 mpg. I love this car!

That's a big one. The aerodynamic equivalent of driving with a parachute open behind your car.

The point I am trying make was not whether Toyota 'cheated' on their mpg claim. I was amazed by the Insight owners' mind set in trying to compare and bring down Prius as a justification to their choice of Insight over Prius. They seems dead serious. They even mentioned class action lawsuit. And yet, I have not seen a post here trying to compare to Honda or any other Hybrids.

Try not to do this. You'll get better mpg if you roll up the windows and use AC at highway speed.

Wow, they're threatening a class action lawsuit against a company which has in no way harmed them? Exactly how do they have any standing for this suit?

As you say, it really sounds like attempting to justify a choice that's not worked out so well. As the Prius has broken in and I've adjusted a bit, I'm now averaging about 54 MPG (indicated) on my daily commute and errands, which includes city, highway, and backed-up highway miles. Last I checked my spreadsheet, the lifetime MPG based on bought gas is 48 MPG+ (right now I have it set to show whole-numbered MPG, no decimals).

You have now.

Tom

The 2010 Prius 50 mpg claims by Toyota were tested by the EPA and the EPA allowed Toyota to put those numbers on the car. Toyota can say the 2010 Prius is a 100 mpg vehicle but until EPA verifies those numbers they can't put them on their cars. So, if there is anything to take issue with the 50 mpg claims...it should be with the EPA.

And mpg is all relative to the driver's ability to get higher mpg when you are comparing the Insight and the Prius...both high mpg cars. For every Insight driver getting 50 mpg you will find a Prius driver getting the same mpg across the board. Same goes for 60, 65, 70+ mpg drivers.

50 mpg in either car is low IMO. 55-65 mpg is a piece of cake with a little practice.

Weird...I'm on my 3rd tank...first tank was about 48.5mpg, second was 50mpg, and I'm doing 53mpg so far on this tank. I live in LA, drive in the hills a lot, always have the A/C on, and do a lot of short trips. I do pretty much keep it in ECO and avoid the Power bar on the HSI. 50mpg seems quite reasonable to me if you don't drive super hard...my wife is driving it today, so we'll see what my MPG is when she gets back!! haha

Mike

When I get out of my routine commute (road trip!) I can easily hit the low 50's. Here in La Mesa everything is hilly and my 2 mile commute to work has about 6 traffic lights. I am getting 44+/- .5. Better than my 2005 got on the same commute. Longer distances seem comparable between the two.

Don't forget, I believe that the 2010 Honda Insight has problems with accuracy with the MPG dash. That it reads higher than actual miles per gallon.

The same holds true, at least in our Prius, that consistently, for the last 8,000 miles, the guage always, I mean always, 100 % of the time, reads higher than actual miles per gallon calculated by miles driven and gallons of gas used.

Usually off by 2-3 miles per gallon, but the last read was 51.1 MPG indicated, and the acutal miles per gallon was only 47 MPG.

I know it seems to silly to complain about only getting 47 MPG, but thats what happens when you own a Prius or a high MPG vehicle.

One more point, when I drive the car I nearly alway get over 50 MPG, actual. When my wife drives I can expect 46-48 MPG.

Alfon

You are right, Tom. I did stir up the soup.

As far as 'not getting 50 mpg' issue as many newbies like myself encountered, I have a explanation which may make sense. Prius Gen III has a bigger gas engine, 1.8L compared to Gen II's 1.5L and Insight's 1.3L, which means when the same amount of accelerator pedal force applied shall generate more power and thus uses more gas than Gen II and Insight. Newbies like me don't know how to drive lightfooted. Therefore Prius' mpg swing is bigger than others. The ave lower mpg would be lower than others as well.
Just my 1 cent.

FACT: you would have to drive your Prius a lot to make up for the difference (I think over 300K miles!) in price tag between the 2 cars (I read an article comparing both and doing the math but can't find it), in other words, even though the Insight gets lower MPG, the final cost of the Prius considering its price tag and gas expenses compared to the Insight is considerably higher.

HOWEVER: I did research and test drive both there is no question to me, the Prius worth the extra money.

Most car trip computers are too optimistic about with their MPG readings.

Based on my data, the difference between displayed (indicated) and actual (calculated) MPG is:

2010 Prius: 3-5%
2007 CR-V: 1-2%
Insight: I wonder...

The displayed is always higher than the real…

This is the fundamental problem with most of these "how many miles to break even" arguments. How many miles do you have to drive a BMW to break even? How about an Audi? No one talks about the break-even point for one of these premium vehicles, but as soon as you mention a Prius there is always a discussion about the "Prius Premium" and how long it takes to break even. The cost of a Prius isn't all about mileage. A lot of the cost of a Prius goes to good features and reliability. The Prius would be a good car even without the outstanding mileage.

Tom