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Drafting

Discussion in 'Gen 3 Prius Fuel Economy' started by Dan Cathy, Jul 21, 2013.

  1. Dan Cathy

    Dan Cathy Junior Member

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    On my recent trip, I drafted behind slower moving vehicles (60 mph or less). They were tractor trailers, SUV's and vans. I've even drafted behind a Camry. When going up a steep hill, I tried to get behind a truck because I know it'll be climbing at a slower speed. I wasn't able to draft the entire trip because I'd only draft behind slower moving vehicles.

    My 450 miles trip started with an elevation of 550 ft, went as high as 2700 ft and arrived at 750 ft and made the return trip on the same highway. 30 of the 450 miles were city driving. The outside temp was over 90 and I had my A/C set on between 77 and 80 the whole time and I had 4 people including myself. I've never made this trip on a Prius before but under the condition that I just mentioned, I didn't expect to get 57.8 mpg especially when I had to climb 2000 ft with A/C running.
     
  2. JimboPalmer

    JimboPalmer Tsar of all the Rushers

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  3. Dan Cathy

    Dan Cathy Junior Member

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    "The two-second rule is useful as it can be applied to any speed. It is equivalent to one vehicle-length for every 8 km/h (5 mph) of the current speed"

    Are you kidding me? one vehicle length per 5mph? AT 60 mph, that is 12 vehicle length. Maybe some old lady would be following that rule.
     
  4. fotomoto

    fotomoto Senior Member

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    Just pick a spot on or next to the road and when the vehicle ahead passes it count "one-thousand one, one-thousand two". Also, large vehicles such as 18wheelers can straddle and thus not swerve for items in the roadway that can easily damage a car or its tires.

    It's no secret that drafting increases fuel economy but is it worth the few extra mpg's?

    Value judgement: doing this with 3 other people in the car is wrong.
     
  5. Dan Cathy

    Dan Cathy Junior Member

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    I totally agree it's wrong but I feel that I'm less dangerous than that woman I saw talking on her cell phone while driving. I'm less dangerous than the guy who passed me going at least 80 mph. When I draft, I don't make conversation with anyone, I don't even listen to the radio. I had my hand on the gear shift getting ready to put the Prius in "B" in case I need to stop. But to answer your question, No, it's not worth the little gain but it was a fun experiment.
     
  6. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    Experiments can be fun. A more practical approach is to use slower traffic as a 'pacing' vehicle because it works in urban and highway driving:
    • pickup truck with a trailer (often lawn equipment)
    • moving vans (trying to minimize breakage)
    • slow moving, large trucks
    By 'pacing', leave space so if someone cuts in, no big deal. This is especially useful when traffic includes road rage, drivers. Pacing means using cruise control to match the speed. Best of all, following traffic 'sees the Prius stuck behind that truck' and zips around with few, if any, tailgating issues. They see the slow truck and life for everyone is less stressed.

    Bob Wilson
     
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  7. jdcollins5

    jdcollins5 Senior Member

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    I have followed trucks at a safe distance and could still see a +10 mpg increase in mpg. No sense in taking chances for just a few more mpg.
     
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  8. rdgrimes

    rdgrimes Senior Member

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    A semi pulls an envelope of air that's roughly 2x the length of the rig. While its true that the closer you get the more benefit you obtain, its not necessary to get closer than one semi-length to see real benefits.
     
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  9. JimboPalmer

    JimboPalmer Tsar of all the Rushers

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    Driving safely is way more important to me than saving gasoline, Your Motivations May Vary. I post various 'contrary' opinions suggesting NOT to over inflate your tires beyond the label on the tire itself, that you should check local laws BEFORE tinting your windows, and that converting your headlight bulbs to a different technology is illegal in the US unless you convert the reflectors and the wiring harness. These may be unpopular views, but they are the safe way to live.
     
  10. Dan Cathy

    Dan Cathy Junior Member

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    I have heard of one car length per 10 mph, but never "per 5 mph". Here's what would happen in the real world, for me anyway. If I left too much distance between me and the car in front of me, other drivers would definitely cut in front of me. The "safe distance" rule said I should slow down to increase the distance to a safe distance. Again, another driver would cut in front of me. I will have to slow down again, and again, and again. This is one reason why people are not willing to slow down. You will always find at least one a**hole that would cut in front of you if you leave too much space between cars.
     
  11. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

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    Just in case someone likeminded was drafting you: you'd be better off using the brakes immediately, not B. They're going to need all the warning you can give them.
     
  12. Dan Cathy

    Dan Cathy Junior Member

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    I use both "B" and brakes
     
  13. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

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    Here's an interesting video, on advantages of increasing following distance:

     
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  14. Dan Cathy

    Dan Cathy Junior Member

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    This guy in the video did not account for traffic lights. For example, if I let drivers cut in front of me and there are traffic lights a mile ahead and we are all going to the same direction, each car that cut in front of me could cost me 2 minutes or more in delay. In rush hours, I would never let people cut in front of me unless I couldn't stop him/her.

    As I said earlier, leaving too much space between cars is an invitation for people to cut in front of you. This has happened to me before many times, a driver behind me saw that I had plenty of space in front of me, so he sped up to go around me and cut in front of me.
     
  15. ursle

    ursle Gas miser

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    Drafting close @70 with a car full of people......bad idea

    Staying close to cut people off from changing lanes......bad idea
     
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  16. sisharp

    sisharp Member

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    Dan for the two second rule, 12 car lengths is the right distance. At 60 mph, you are moving 88 feet/second. 2 seconds means 176 feet. The prius is 14.7 feet long. dividing 176/14.7 = 11.97 car lengths. So 2 seconds is spot on to 12 car lengths.

    "As I said earlier, leaving too much space between cars is an invitation for people to cut in front of you." - Dan

    I don't understand why you, like many many people think this way. Having people cut in front of you is NOT bad. If you let this get to you, you will/are an angrier person in general. I'm not saying that you might be all the time but this behavior doesn't help you. If you drive by leaving a larger gap and don't try to "block" people from getting in you will probably be a calmer driver. Do you find that after driving you are on edge? It's probably because of the way you drive.

    I know it's annoying letting people in front of you especially when so many people are jerks and have road rage up the wazoo. You're driving a Prius. The slower you go the better gas mileage you get. Keep in mind that people that drive aggressively get lower gas mileage than people who drive calmer. If you haven't seen the mythbusters, they did an episode on this. So, for instance, a camry that cuts you off, that is designed for 25mpg is driving like this all day racing around cars and trying to get that next empty spot will maybe end up with 20 mpg at the end of the day or worse while you, driving safely with a 2 second gap and remaining calm through your trip will not only get above the 50mpg average stated for the car but will be happier and not always on edge about people cutting you off. I take comfort in that the aggressive drivers' rage is costing them money.

    If you try to drive safely but also blocking drivers then you no doubt have stepped on the gas harder than you normally do to speed up to close the gap to prevent them from cutting in right? Then what happens in a traffic jam? The cars in front of you speed up like crazy and now a gap forms. So what do you do? Speed up to close it once again. It's a vicious cycle that eats at your mpg.

    In contrast, when you drive behind vehicles, don't you feel generally calmer than when you are worried that someone is cutting in front of you? You have no worries that someone will try to get in front, usually because there is always that 1 idiot, so when you get to where you are going you're not on edge are you?

    I feel it is important to drive this way for 2 reasons. 1) For my mental sanity at the end of the day. 2) For my wife's sanity at the end of the day. I don't know if you're married or not, doesn't affect anything, but you are around people are you not? If you have a bad drive to work you might be on edge with your fellow co-workers. If you have a bad drive and get home, you might be on edge at your wife or girlfriend or roommate. And this I believe is way more important than preventing that 1 or 50 idiots from cutting in front of you. Imagine how those drivers are to be around at home or work. Always on edge. Not cool.

    I say give this a shot Dan. Thank you for reading this far btw. You might find your drives more pleasant, begin and end the day in a better mood, and save money in the process. It feels great to be honest. Let the other people burn their gas and waste money. Let them be angry all the time. Let those truck drivers, not the semis the regular pick up trucks, think they are kings of the road by speeding by and going around you. They might end up with 15mpg if they're lucky. Cost to fill up for them? $70-$100. trip distance maybe 250-300 miles. Cost to fill up for you maybe $35-$45 depending on gas prices. Trip distance 500+ Who wins in the end?
     
  17. Dan Cathy

    Dan Cathy Junior Member

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    sisharp...thanks for the advice. I don't drive aggressively all the time, only when I need to get to work. I'd rather burn more gas than being late. Time is money and gas is cheap compared to my time. The only way that I could get a pleasant drive is leave the house 1/2 hour earlier in the morning. On weekends or evenings, I couldn't care less how many people cut in front of me.

    Let me give you a couple of reason why I don't let people cut in front of me. 1) I was looking for a parking space, a driver cut in front of me and he took the space that I would have gotten if I prevented him from cutting in front of me. 2) a driver cut in front of me and we both approached a traffic light, we both could have turned on red since it is legal. Instead, the idiot sat there and waited for the green light. That costed me time. If I had to encounter 10 of these idiots per day, that's a lot of time wasted per year. It is hard to tell who are the idiots and who are not out there, so it is better to have as many of them behind me as possible.
     
  18. PLSPUSH

    PLSPUSH Active Member

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    unbelievable
     
  19. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

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    It's easy to spot the idiots, George Carlin explained it very eloquently a few years back:

    "Anyone in front of me is an idiot, and anyone behind me is a maniac"

    (I'm likely paraphrasing a bit)
     
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  20. TonyPSchaefer

    TonyPSchaefer Your Friendly Moderator
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    I think what we're seeing here is the "don't say we didn't warn you" approach.

    I'm sure most of us have drafted. Even at one semi length, it's still drafting because the intent of why you're hanging out back there. When I have long drives, I look for semis who cruise at a constant speed and I hang out as far back as I can while still enjoying some perceived benefit. After a while, I get bored with the view and either pass or let him get away.

    As a Moderator, I feel obligated to say, "It is PriusChat's stance that we're all mature adults here. What you do to and with your vehicle is your own responsibility. Input or encouragement from other PriusChat members does not make PriusChat responsible if that activity harms yourself, your car, or anyone else."

    Having said that, I like the grown-up discussions on this topic so far. Let's make sure we keep it that way and not dissolve into "you're an idiot if you do this."
     
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