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Has anyone added a second traction battery?

Discussion in 'Gen 3 Prius Technical Discussion' started by Joe-G, Apr 25, 2013.

  1. Joe-G

    Joe-G Member

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    Has anyone purchased a second traction battery and installed it in parallel with the existing battery? Perhaps one from a wrecked Prius.

    I'm thinking that would double the Ev range, which would be very handy in my current commute due to long term construction on one of the highways I use. I am in sub-5 mph stop and go so long each day that I wear down my battery and the ice ends up running while stopped, thus killing my hypermiler goals.

    Thanks in advance for experience or thoughts.
     
  2. xpcman

    xpcman Senior Member

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    You will need custom electronics since the system is designed for a specific size battery. Not an easy job. Good Luck
     
  3. patsparks

    patsparks An Aussie perspective

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    Attempting to add batteries to a Prius has been done. Try the search function, I suspect you will find lots of info. Battery module is I believe the same in gen II and III.
    You can also get plug in conversions, I think this might suit your purpose more.
    Remember that all the energy in the battery is coming from the ICE anyway. Having 2 battery packs each at 50% usable charge would be no better than having 1 battery at 100% usable charge. I suspect an additional battery without plug-in would just add weight with little if any nett gain.
     
  4. BZzap!

    BZzap! Senior Member

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    Also, sustained traction motor operation would probably cause over heating problems. Additionally the ICE would have to run much longer to bring both batteries up to charge.
     
  5. Joe-G

    Joe-G Member

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    I'm thinking that charging the second battery while cruising wouldn't cost much energy from the ICE.
    The weight would be a little penalty.

    But doubling the range on battery would help my drive.
     
  6. Joe-G

    Joe-G Member

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    I did do a search...but had no luck by the way.
     
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  7. cwerdna

    cwerdna Senior Member

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    PHEV mod under way, Bristol, UK. | Page 17 | PriusChat is what happens when it goes wrong.

    HV Pack Voltages & Grid Charging | PriusChat had some discussion of grid charging.

    There were plug-in kits like Hymotion that didn't work on Gen 3 Prius, they ended production and A123 (company behind it) went bankrupt. There are kits like Enginer, but their reliability is questionable.

    What you want to do isn't going to be particularly easy nor cheap. If you wanted more EV range, you should've bought a PiP or other PHEV instead.
     
  8. Joe-G

    Joe-G Member

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    I like my Prius a lot, amazed by the technology.

    I come from the Corvette world where modification is very common, so was just wondering if anyone tried what seems as pretty simple to me, just buying a second battery and running in parallel.

    Probably not that easy but I'm sure I'm not the first to think if it...there must be some tinkerers out there.
     
  9. Joe-G

    Joe-G Member

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    I have a specific reason for asking. I have 3 miles of stop and go, 5 mph or less traffic every day due to long term construction. I run the battery from full to 2 bars every day, and then sit with the engine running while stopped while it recharges.

    If I had twice the capacity I could do this stretch on battery and recharge both while cruising.

    Obviously it's not cost effective to do this...but I'm the tinkering type.
     
  10. cwerdna

    cwerdna Senior Member

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    I found a bunch of hits by Googling for stuff like this:
    Code:
    site:priuschat.com extra battery parallel
    site:priuschat.com extra battery traction
     
  11. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    unfortunately, it's not as simple as adding a second battery. there are a lot of computers in the prius, and a lot of software designed for the size battery it has. if you are a hardware/software guru, the battery might be the biggest expense. but at 2 grand or so for a rebuilt battery, you may want to shop around for a pip and see what the cost difference is minus your trade in. i know it's going to be a lot more than 2 grand, but your getting a 3 year newer car with even more amazing technology and 10-15 miles of ev. all the best!(y)
     
  12. David Beale

    David Beale Senior Member

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    Further, adding a second battery was originally done to try to achieve better mileage. For rather complex reasons it didn't improve mileage.
    Your statement that recharging the second or "larger overall" battery shouldn't "cost much energy" is ignoring basic physics. Producing energy costs money (actually converting energy from gasoline to electricity). You would burn more fuel to charge the battery, period. Which is only -one- of the reasons the original attempt to improve mileage by doubling the battery didn't work!
    The PIP or "plug-in Prius" gains mileage from a triple (or larger) battery by charging the battery from the electric grid. There is no energy savings or any other smoke and mirror effect. There may be a monetary savings due to the energy from the grid being a bit less expensive, but that is debatable. The car costs a lot more. How far do you have to drive and long do you have to wait to recover that?

    But don't feel too bad. A lot of people still apparently don't believe basic physics!
     
  13. Joe-G

    Joe-G Member

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    I have a basic understanding of physics, thanks.

    In my specific case I have 3 miles if stop and and go and I wear out my battery half way through. I had double the battery it would carry me through this without the engine running while stopped to charge the battery. I could charge the battery while cruising, using energy that is being produced in a more efficient manner (the engine is running anyway to cruise).

    So it's a simple question, I wish someone had tried it and say it either works or doesn't work with experience.
     
  14. Joe-G

    Joe-G Member

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    Thanks for posting this cwerdna, those were very informative posts. I wouldn't plan to make a plug in, so they weren't exactly on point but surely evidence of the complexity built into our cars and what can happen when things go wrong. Even Boeing has trouble charging the batteries properly so there is serious science there!

    My idea is due to specific circumstances, to double the range on EV and charge both batteries when cruising when the engine is running in its most efficient range, rather than sitting not moving and charging the batteries which is when the engine is in its most inefficient range.

    Frankly at $2k for a spare battery the economics don't make sense, but, I was hoping it might generate some good conversation on this board and since I'm new I'm excited to learn more about the car from experts. After a lifetime of wrenching on cars and specifically Corvettes for the last dozen years, I have a lot of knowledge about effective mods on those, but the Prius world is new to me and I'm exciting about learning more about the technology in the car.:)
     
  15. Joe-G

    Joe-G Member

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    The computers don't scare me, I've been using HP Tuners to tweak my GM cars for years. I used to set timing and fueling looking at spark plugs and listening to the engine but now my knock sensors and wide band do a much more detailed job than I could ever do. I embrace the technology and like that I don't get gas all over my hands anymore swapping jets in a Holley!

    But your point is excellent, apparently there is no "HP Tuners" or "EFI Live" for the Prius that allows tweaking the factory set parameters so that might kill the idea.

    I have to get a scanner for the Prius so I can see what's going on. I'm on the iPhone platform and I understand the bluetooth OBDii adapters don't work with iPhone which is too bad at the Torque app looks great. But that's a subject of a different thread and I haven't researched it yet so will do so before I post.
     
  16. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    and i'm not saying it can't be done. there was one guy here who could do anything, but the prius was too simple for him and he moved onto the leaf forum. he was heads above everyone else technically.
     
  17. cwerdna

    cwerdna Senior Member

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    Heh, I'm not sure if it was too simple for him, but he has definitely shifted his primary focus to the Leaf, probably because he ended up buying one long ago.

    You're probably referring to Update and technical details on my PHEV project | PriusChat. Danny, myself, efusco, cproaudio and possibly a few other folks actually drove around his project car at Green Drive Expo 2011.
     
  18. mad-dog-one

    mad-dog-one Prius Enthusiast

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    That's a good point. Are the drive electric motors different from the regular Gen 3 Orius in the PIP?
     
  19. Chaloney

    Chaloney Junior Member

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    Joe--get a wifi obd2 adapter and the engine link app. It appears to do most of what torque does. It's very new so the developer seems interested in feedback and responded to my email very quickly.
     
  20. Joe-G

    Joe-G Member

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    That is a great idea. I'm well experience with scanning and tuning so perhaps I can help him too.