<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(jtmhog @ Nov 5 2007, 11:02 AM) [snapback]534908[/snapback]</div>

AGREE

If you don't have a car to sell, the next best thing is a gigantic advertising campaign to make people think you do. Its called smoke and mirrors, and its all GM has right now.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(kingofgix @ Nov 5 2007, 12:45 PM) [snapback]534979[/snapback]</div>

Yes!!

Buy GM because we pretend we are investing in the future. :lol:

It's not a lie, if you believe it's true.
;-)

Did anybody get a good look at the Volt add on Sunday Night Football?

I only got a glimpse; missed comments.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(hschuck @ Nov 5 2007, 12:16 PM) [snapback]535000[/snapback]</div>

I saw it but didn't register that it was a
PHEV commercial until I heard the guy tell the kids asking questions that it had superior technology because it used Lithium-ion batteries. Thats when I looked up to pay closer attention :lol: It looked kind of like a sports car to me for the brief time I saw it. Now we need to go out and try to buy one and then sue the crap out of GM for advertising like it is available when they most likely have no intention of producing it at least in the forseeable future.

Hi All,

Did you see the October Prius sales numbers!? What GM is doing is trying to delay people from buying Prius. Because its their opinion is that there are only so-many people who are going to buy a hybrid car, and have the financial position to do it now. And the more that buy the Prius, the less a instant success the Volt will be. These are short-term thinkers!

Over time, however, its my opinion that half the metropolitan and city drivers will buy 50 mpg plus hybrids, at least. People do not want to admidt this (I have that effect on people in person). But in time, when they see the mileage numbers they know its inevitable.

This ad is just a waste of money, GM could be spending on battery development.

They could make it a PHEV-20 and since its a series hybrid, use a small diesel and people will buy it. The Prius PHEV is a PHEV-6 and people are eager for it because it will do allot better in hills with bigger battery, or they only commute a short distance. And even if that means only one trip a day on battery, it has a good chance of making economic sense.

I don't believe I will buy from GM ever again. They could be leading the pack but chose to make a U-turn.

Just my opinion.

I didn't see the ad. But the OP says the ad says they don't yet have a battery for it. So the reason for the ad becomes clear: The ad's purpose is to make an excuse for why they're not building the Volt: In effect they're saying:

We care. We want to build a car for the future. But we can't yet. The technology does not exist yet.

The fact that the EV-1 got 100 miles on a charge puts GM in an awkward position. They could build the Volt today. They need to run dishonest ads like the one referred to, to distract people from the truth, that plenty of batteries are available today, and try to convince people that somehow the EV-1's technology was inadequate, and we have to wait a while longer.

An interesting perspective (because of its source) comes from the dealer who sold me my Zap Xebra. He thinks that GM will build the Volt and that it will be on car lots in two years (model year 2009, fall of 2008). He feels they will be forced into it to compete with the Chinese. He also thinks the Volt will put him out of business, but he wants an EV transportation system so badly that he'd welcome it.

I say the viewpoint is interesting, because this guy is intimately involved with EVs. My opinion is still that GM will do whatever it must, legal or illegal, to prevent electric cars from coming to market.

I'll buy a Volt if it's PHEV-40, performs well, and is the first freeway-capable car capable of going 40 miles on pure electric. But I don't expect ever to see a Volt on a car lot.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(jtmhog @ Nov 5 2007, 08:02 AM) [snapback]534908[/snapback]</div>

That's a matter of opinion. Unless they changed it radically in that ad, I rather like what I've seen of it so far. Looks beefy...

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Mr. Zorg @ Nov 5 2007, 10:51 PM) [snapback]535260[/snapback]</div>

I also like the looks of the Volt. I would buy if it had 40 miles electric range and was less then 30k.


I also don't think it will happen. Its too good to be true.

I would say the ad was a success, you are all talking about GM.

I thought it was against the law to advertise something that doesn't exist. But I guess not since everyone knows it doesn't exist. But it seems pretty stupid to advertise something you can't sell.

GM is pouring money into the economy on an advertising campaign for nothing. You can't make money when you have nothing to sell. And they're not going to recoup the cost of advertising the Volt by selling something that is NOT the Volt.

It's just.....stupid.

I thought GM was over making really bad business choices but I guess not.

maybe they are trying to push toyota to proceed with better technology. they are good at that.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(kingofgix @ Nov 5 2007, 08:45 AM) [snapback]534979[/snapback]</div>

Are we allowed to flame or psuedo-flame here? Because GM is a joke, and knowing them, they'll probably pull the same fiasco with their original (ugly yet functional) EV's.

Personally, I wouldn't buy American anyways, unless I wanted a Diesel truck, but on the hybrid topic - GM's Saturn line has their Greenline hybrids - what a joke, about 25mpg average for a hybrid? And then they market it like it's really saving the environment.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(pkhoury @ Nov 6 2007, 01:51 AM) [snapback]535333[/snapback]</div>

I think the Volt looks really great and want one.

Although I wouldn't trust GM to make a complicated hybrid power train like the Prius where power is going and coming from many different directions, the Volt will be a fully electric vehicle with a gasoline engine to act as a generator to recharge the batteries. I think there will be less to go wrong, which will mean high quality and Toyota is going to have a serious competitor.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(155 @ Nov 6 2007, 03:20 AM) [snapback]535353[/snapback]</div>

Toyota engineers and executives are VERY concerned at the moment.

GM has signed non-compete agreements with the best lithium-ion battery producers around the world. This means that as GM is paying for automotive battery development with these companies, no other auto manufacturer can use the resulting batteries now or in the future.

The crucial point of this is that the next big leap in automotive technology is using iron-phosphate or titanate based lithium-ion batteries. Toyota can't do this as they're stuck (for IP and business reasons) to Panasonic's ancient cobalt-oxide based batteries, which are like todays laptop batteries, prone to thermal runaway (poor safety) and have poor cycle / calender life.

Once GM start producing vehicles with these batteries, they will have a decisive advantage over Toyota (actually they already have in battery technology terms), and Toyota are VERY worried about this - but what can they do????

Gee, to me that looks like GM couldn't give a toss about the environment, does anyone else get that impression? Sounds a bit like oil companies tying up fuel saving technology doesn't it? And we all love oil companies hey? I'm developing that kind of deep love for GM.