Welcome to PriusChat

We'd love to have you join our community and participate in the conversation! Sign up for FREE today.

Sign Up

Midsize Hybrid Emission Comparison

Discussion in 'Prius, Hybrid, EV and Alt-Fuel News' started by usbseawolf2000, Mar 4, 2011.

Social Buttons

  1. usbseawolf2000

    usbseawolf2000 HSD PhD

    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2004
    Messages:
    13,024
    Likes Received:
    2,354
    Location:
    Fort Lee, NJ
    Your Vehicle Year:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    Plug-in Base
    We now have emission data for Hyundai Sonata Hybrid as well as Kia Optima Hybrid. I figured I make a comparison with the other midsize hybrids already in the market.

    Exhaust Emission:
    [​IMG]

    Fuel Evaporative Emission:
    [​IMG]

    Attached Files:

    2 people like this.
  2. aztoyotascion

    aztoyotascion New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 19, 2010
    Messages:
    18
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Chandler, AZ
    Your Vehicle Year:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    V
    What does the "hot soak" refer to?
  3. SageBrush

    SageBrush Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jun 4, 2008
    Messages:
    10,316
    Likes Received:
    2,073
    Location:
    Southwest Colorado
    Your Vehicle Year:
    2012 Prius v wagon
    Model:
    Two
    ^^ the car is parked in high ambient temperatures for the prescribed time. I think 12 or 24 hours, but I am no sure. I am sure you can guess there is also a 'cold soak.'
  4. SageBrush

    SageBrush Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jun 4, 2008
    Messages:
    10,316
    Likes Received:
    2,073
    Location:
    Southwest Colorado
    Your Vehicle Year:
    2012 Prius v wagon
    Model:
    Two
  5. GrumpyCabbie

    GrumpyCabbie Senior Member

    Joined:
    Dec 14, 2009
    Messages:
    6,034
    Likes Received:
    1,651
    Location:
    North Yorkshire, UK
    Your Vehicle Year:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    N/A
    How useful is the vapour recovery units? They're not a legal requirement here in Europe (though some cars do have them) and I wonder is the amount recovered significant or minute? How does it compare to exhaust emissions etc?
  6. Flying White Dutchman

    Flying White Dutchman Senior Member

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2007
    Messages:
    4,367
    Likes Received:
    299
    Your Vehicle Year:
    2014 Prius c
    Model:
    N/A
    anyone with a charge compared to the "clean"diesel from vw?
    bleutech stuff
  7. usbseawolf2000

    usbseawolf2000 HSD PhD

    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2004
    Messages:
    13,024
    Likes Received:
    2,354
    Location:
    Fort Lee, NJ
    Your Vehicle Year:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    Plug-in Base
    I have data for Jetta TDI but it is a compact. Any suggestion for a VW or Audi mid-size TDI?
  8. UsedToLoveCars

    UsedToLoveCars Member

    Joined:
    Aug 19, 2009
    Messages:
    307
    Likes Received:
    63
    Location:
    SF
    Your Vehicle Year:
    Other Hybrid
    Model:
    N/A


    whelp, I think unburned hydrocarbons are a major smog contributor. They are very strict about vapor recovery systems in California. Part of the emissions test includes pressurizing your fuel system and checking for leaks.

    Even the fuel pumps here have vapor recovery doodads on them to keep vapors from going into the air.

    [​IMG]
  9. Flying White Dutchman

    Flying White Dutchman Senior Member

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2007
    Messages:
    4,367
    Likes Received:
    299
    Your Vehicle Year:
    2014 Prius c
    Model:
    N/A


    the next is the passsat right? and thats bigger then the prius
    and VW is putting the jetta out there to be a prius basher... so come on with those numbers and see.:)
  10. usbseawolf2000

    usbseawolf2000 HSD PhD

    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2004
    Messages:
    13,024
    Likes Received:
    2,354
    Location:
    Fort Lee, NJ
    Your Vehicle Year:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    Plug-in Base

    Attached Files:

  11. Rybold

    Rybold globally warmed member

    Joined:
    May 14, 2008
    Messages:
    2,760
    Likes Received:
    320
    Location:
    Southern California
    Your Vehicle Year:
    Other Non-Hybrid
  12. evpv

    evpv Active Member

    Joined:
    Apr 19, 2010
    Messages:
    510
    Likes Received:
    153
    Location:
    West Coast
    Your Vehicle Year:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    II
    Thanks, but I was looking for the PZEV version if you have it.
  13. usbseawolf2000

    usbseawolf2000 HSD PhD

    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2004
    Messages:
    13,024
    Likes Received:
    2,354
    Location:
    Fort Lee, NJ
    Your Vehicle Year:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    Plug-in Base


    There is no PZEV version as the emission is the same SULEV. SULEV + 10 years / 150k miles emission hardware warranty would make it PZEV.

    Even Prius doesn't have AT-PZEV version of the PDF / certification.
  14. evpv

    evpv Active Member

    Joined:
    Apr 19, 2010
    Messages:
    510
    Likes Received:
    153
    Location:
    West Coast
    Your Vehicle Year:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    II


    Hmmm, I thought there was more difference than that. Thanks for posting the data.

    "In order to qualify as a PZEV, a vehicle must meet the SULEV standard and, in addition, have zero evaporative emissions from its fuel system plus an extended (15-year/150,000-mile) warranty on its emission-control components."
  15. evpv

    evpv Active Member

    Joined:
    Apr 19, 2010
    Messages:
    510
    Likes Received:
    153
    Location:
    West Coast
    Your Vehicle Year:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    II
    Where the heck are they hiding the emission pdf sheets on the arb.ca.gov web site???
  16. Flying White Dutchman

    Flying White Dutchman Senior Member

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2007
    Messages:
    4,367
    Likes Received:
    299
    Your Vehicle Year:
    2014 Prius c
    Model:
    N/A


    the phev got wurs Co2 then the normal pruis?
    what about that
  17. SageBrush

    SageBrush Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jun 4, 2008
    Messages:
    10,316
    Likes Received:
    2,073
    Location:
    Southwest Colorado
    Your Vehicle Year:
    2012 Prius v wagon
    Model:
    Two
    I took Dutchman's data and normalized the graph to the Accord emissions. The second graph includes SULEV thresholds, but unfortunately things get squished because of the high CO number.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    Attached Files:

    2 people like this.
  18. usbseawolf2000

    usbseawolf2000 HSD PhD

    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2004
    Messages:
    13,024
    Likes Received:
    2,354
    Location:
    Fort Lee, NJ
    Your Vehicle Year:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    Plug-in Base


    The file name in the link I provided in post #10 said "pz.pdf". The certification inside it said SULEV. They may not have separate PDF with PZEV certification.
  19. austingreen

    austingreen Senior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2009
    Messages:
    9,348
    Likes Received:
    1,593
    Location:
    Austin, TX, USA
    Your Vehicle Year:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    II


    The testing procedure is antiquated and does not properley account for the way hybrid and plug in hybrid cars are run. I think you meant carbon monoxide in your post. Lev II does not give any credit for electric miles. When the ICE kicks in on the phv, I can only assume it does not do the full warm up as it does on the regular prius. This will give a short term increase in carbon monoxide. This increase is exaggerated by the testing procedure. If you add in the electric miles, the phv should always produce less CO per mile, with the number approaching the normal prius as the mileage gets large. There have been suggestions to fix the problem in Lev III, but I am not sure what if any progress has been made. The numbers on the phv are very low even with the outdated testing procedure.
  20. austingreen

    austingreen Senior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2009
    Messages:
    9,348
    Likes Received:
    1,593
    Location:
    Austin, TX, USA
    Your Vehicle Year:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    II


    That is exactly it. Toyota got a CARB waiver as have other car companies to have a 10year warranty on the battery. In typical CARB speak, zero in the case of evaporative emissions are not zero, but they are very low.
Similar Threads: Midsize Hybrid
Forum Title Date
Honda Hybrids and EVs Does the Prius still make sense when midsize-car Hybrids are getting almost 50mpg?(Accord Hybrid) Aug 30, 2013
Prius, Hybrid, EV and Alt-Fuel News Volkswagen's American Chief says Volkswagen hybrid midsize sedan coming in 2011 Aug 14, 2009
Gen III 2010+ Prius Main Forum Prius operating costs vs. another midsize car Jan 27, 2011
Other Cars New Chrysler small and midsize cars: coming in November or in 18 months? Oct 5, 2009
Gen II Prius Main Forum Is the Prius a compact or midsize car? Oct 20, 2007