It's interesting how back during WWII, the nation came together for the common goal of survival.
Today, even though it is obvious logic that we send billions of our hard earned dollars out of our country and over to our military enemies and [potential] military enemies for oil, and that there is plenty of data in support of global warming, a LARGE number of Americans [irresponsibly] ignore the consequences and selfishly continue to drive around in SUVs not because they can't trade them in but because they "want to." Back when I was in college, I remember that the kids that partied and hungout with their friends all the time were the ones that ended up failing and dropping out. The kids that were responsible were the ones that survived. Sadly, I see the same mentality when most Americans weigh keeping their SUVs versus responsibly preparing for their childrens' future. (And no, I'm not talking about just their grandchildren; I'm talking about their children)

Andy Grove, former head of Intel? And Google is working on solar. It fascinates me how the brains in Silicon Valley that brought us computers (remember when we didn't have PCs and the internet?) and brought us the internet, now have their minds also set on global warming and development of renewable, sustainable sources of energy.
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This nation came together during 9-1-1 pretty well I remember as everyone, including me, exclaimed that we were New Yorkers after that in support.

I have no doubts that the peoples of America can and will wake up and will survive. The problem is, as I see it, that for so long the government and those who work our problems and wars, etc; have just taken care of our issues and the common man has not had to change his life to the extent that they did in WW2.

It will take a Presidential speech to that effect, and no President wants to make that speech. It is political suicide to tell the citizenry that they have to work hard and give something up. We need it and most of the population would do it, but some of the vocal minority types would kvetch and spit and make it impossible for the ploitical process to operate as before.

It isnt about Repubs or Dems. It's about maturity- which some of the spoiled US citizenry does not have. Most have not fought in wars, or watched terror attacks, or even served anything other than self interest their whole lives.

It will take a leader that is OK with a one term office. He will pay for the hurt the population has to endure to help fix things and he will bear the brunt of the blame for the issue that the country has built for itself for many years. Thats how we do things here. We like to blame our leaders for our failings.

Carter said it and was vilified for it. Reagan laughed and said never mind and was loved for it.

Sigh. Who will we blame when Bush is gone? But fortunately, the dems will take over in 6 mos and it will be all better, a golden age of doing the right thing. Pfft.

Do you believe that we can drill our way out of the looming transportation fuel crisis? Bush certainly does - and more drilling (for more oil) is the ONLY public energy policy being advocated or promoted aggressively by the Bush Admin. Not counting occupying Iraq.

Also remember who killed off the plug-in hybrid US government funded Supercar program in 2001, passed tax incentives to encourage buying >6000 lb SUVs, and fought against increasing CAFE fuel efficiency standards.

If anything, I was overly generous asserting that the Bush Admin lacks leadership in promoting PHEV's. Instead, a more accurate statement would be to assert that the Bush Admin has done it's best to encourage consumption and discourage the development of high mpg vehicles.

As pointed out in the Andy Grove editorial, everybody knows what needs to be done, it's 'simply' a question of leadership.

wether it's the dems or repubs, we best hope the new President has the stuff to make the hard speech to America. And the right stuff to put our energy future on the front burner and turn up the heat!

Whether the Bush administration is all alone in the wilderness is beside the point. They're irrelevant at this point. You took an editorial by a pretty smart guy who I believe didn't mention bush once and rather than discuss the merits of the editorial took some shots at Bush. That's okay, it happens a lot here.

Oh, and bonus points for working Iraq into your rebuttal. I'm now convinced.

Nonsense. Bush has been in office 7 1/2 years and has done nothing towards solving the myriad of problems associated with US oil consumption and as pointed out above, Bush Admin policies have in fact made the situation worse. When the US needs leadership, all we get out of Washington is more lies. Unlike what the Bush Admin is currently advocating, we can't drill our way out of this problem. Andy Grove understands what needs to be done. The technical merits of the article don't require discussing since it's clear that PHEV's are the solution. The debate instead is more along the lines of the costs and new public policy initiatives required to quickly move America to an all PHEV fleet, which Andy Grove also touches upon along with describing the technical merits.

This thread is a good example of Americans not pulling together for the common good. Less than ten posts and it has turned into a pissing match over politics.

Tom

Plugins sound good on paper, where's all the new electricity going to come from?

If oil is bad, nuclear is even worse. Coal, don't go there. Natural gas, cleaner but still a carbon footprint. No more rivers to dam. Solar's a start but only practical in certain areas of the country. Wind, not in my backyard. Tidal, kills fish.

Just as is claimed we can't drill our way out any time soon, we aren't going to plugin our way out either.

American freedom and ingenuity will lead the way, the government is just one of the hurdles to jump.

If EVERY car were a plug in that would be an issue.
Do you expect this to happen within a year or two??
I certainly don't. Look at all the people that still insist on driving vehicles that get <20mpg when vehicles that get over 40mpg are available.
Since plug ins typically will be plugged in overnight, there really is no additional generation needed until plug in hybrids or EVs become quite common.
My plug in from Hymotion has a 5kw battery. That is actually almost unnoticable. My neighbor has 8 100 watt house lights on all night. That is .8kw/hr on for 7-8 hours is 5.6 - 6.4kw. Turn the lights off, power the car, no problem

While we move toward PHEVs, smart cars and greater energy efficiency, we need a robust national program of walking and bicycle routes, electric & high speed rail - similar to the Interstate Highway effort of the 1950s. This must all be based on renewable, sustainable energy - solar, wind, hydro and geothermal. This is the effort Germany is following and follows the Rocky Mountain Institute - US Dept of Defense "Winning the Oil Endgame" strategy.

Diesel trucks must cease being "warehouses on wheels" and instead be used between trains & ports for short term hauling to cities. We must emphasize energy efficiency in everything we do.

I agree!!
We must all come together and work to free us from Oil! :usa2:

The OP referenced a story that talks about plugins as a megatrend, obviously megatrend = megawatts. If plugins are really the way out of the oil mess it's reasonable to ask where the electricity is going to come from.

If only a relative few use plugins thats fine, the grid can no doubt support that, coupled with conservation as pointed out. That doesn't move us materially closer to freedom from oil. And even for those who do go plugin, if it turns out to be a good idea, once the rest of the herd catches on the law of supply and demand will apply to electricity.

I'm fortunate to live where electricity is quite inexpensive and renewable but there is very little prospect given current technology to expand the supply further. Heck, some want to tear down several of the dams already built in order to restore the river to it's original state. Some time ago Washington State embarked on an ambitious nuclear power plant expansion which I think to this date still stands as one of the worst public bond failures. We got one nuke out of it.

I'm not suggesting plugins are a bad idea, just if renewable, sustainable electricity is to really make a dent in oil's stranglehold, we're going to need a lot more of it, and that picture looks dim to me right now.

For starters, by making significant improvements in regerative braking efficiency, we could reduce power consumption significantly. By requiring all passenger cars to weigh less than 2500 pounds, we could reduce consumption even more. In the popular recycling slogan, notice the order of the words: reduce, reuse, recycle. Reduce consumption first, then focus on where the energy is going to come from. The Prius runs on gasoline, yet is three times more efficient than a Ford Expedition.

Above, someone listed drawbacks with every form clean energy. The windmill people said "not in my backyard." I think that's what the people who are still driving SUVs would say; fashion before function. PEOPLE ARE DYING HERE!!! THERE IS DROUGHT, FLOODING, HURRICANES!!!!

I have always thought that harnessing the ocean's currents is a dependable, always-on source of energy.

A little bit of looking will show that the current electric grid can accommodate a 'few' PHEV's

As for using fossil fuels to supply the electricity required to charge a PHEV. Agree, more coal will have to be burned. However, coal fired power plants are much more efficient than burning gasoline (in a vehicle) and the net use of fossil fuels will drop - which translates to less green house gas emissions.

As for switching from coal or natural gas to renewables - that's about another 10 (or many more) threads.

One thing to note regarding plug-in hybrids that hasn't yet penetrated the publics consciousness is that Plug-in's are much cheaper to operate than a conventional gas only car. There is a large segment of the population complaining about the price of gas that doesn't realize the a plug-in hybrid can be driven for the equivalent of less than one dollar a gallon for gas. This is the cost using coal or natural gas generated electricity (from the utility). Depending on where you live, the cost will double or triple if you power your plug-in using solar energy instead of fossil fuel generated electricity. But even as pricey as solar is today, it's still cheaper to run your car on solar-generated electricity than it is to use oil (gasoline).

Tom, what do you expect? Before the Repub and Dem presidential candidates were even clear, the Presidential Election had already degraded into a pissing match over politics.... It's like a SuperBowl that doesn't end, the 'sport' of the new century.

OK, so we all have a prius, but how are we going to heat our houses?

For now, the problem is the availability of large rechargeable batteries at acceptable prices. As long as that's the case, more fuel will be saved by 'spreadling them thinly across the fleet'. Which is to say in hybrid vehicles with approximately the battery size of a Prius.

A few PHEVs won't make a difference; will neither help nor hurt the fleet fuel consumption. When the batteries are available, then it will be appropriate to build a large number of PHEVs.