Rattle clunk from front end

Over the last few months I've noticed a clunking/rattling in the front end somewhere -- probably started at around 60,000 miles. Maybe the "warranty expired" bit got set in the MFD or something. Anyway, I've considered T-SB-0300-08, but it can range from a clunk-noise to a metallic clank-noise, and is often felt on smallish bumps. Sometimes I can feel a knock in the steering wheel, especially at very low speeds. I get the distinct feeling that the front wheels might be wobbling a bit as things clunk going over small bumps. Predominately a left-side thing, but not exclusively.

The steering shaft Special Service Campaign "60C" was done years ago, and at the 65000 mile service the dealer couldn't find anything, but it's a fairly subtle thing, and is definitely getting worse. I'm attracted to the front struts idea, but not attracted by the price. Is this something a moderately handy guy could do myself? One PriusChatter said his local Shell station did it, which is encouraging. Anybody know a good mail-order parts place offhand? A recommended supplier list might be a good sticky.

Please see my post here:
http://priuschat.com/forums/gen-ii-...ts-regarding-replacement-2g-front-struts.html

Wow. Great in and of itself, with some good leads as well. I found Evan's thread earlier, still trying to figure out why I didn't see yours. Thanks...

Mike

The only weird sound my 2007 with 27K makes is that exact sound your describing when I roll backwards out of the garage and apply the brakes. Clunking with a little clang in there too. I'm almost certain its the struts and did notice last weekend when I had the car up on stands to change the oil both struts are leaking alot of oil.
Forgot to take pics.

Peek at your struts over the top of the tires with a flashlight and see if your leaking oil too. Its plain to see. The strut will be wet from where the piston comes out down.

I have an appt next week to see if I can get new ones uw.

PS: Struts are hard. Very physical as you will need a spring compressor to compress both springs to remove them from each strut and install them on the new strut. Not to mention taking the struts out. Most auto parts stores will rent you the spring compressor for free with a $100 refundable dep.

I have never done them on my car but apparently you can reach the top bolts with a ratcheting wrench which circumevents taking the ww wipers and cowl off to get to the nuts. Basicly lots and lots of wrenching. A smart shade tree mechanic will use air tools and a 100lb compressor to speed that up. But you will understand why they charge so much to replace them. So try to be sure thats the issue. I'm really guessing at my issue based on the oil leakage on mine and if they can repalce it for free why not? But I am hearing that same clunk but not as bad. I'll let you know if they fix my clunk!!

Thanks for the tips. Whatever it is, my clunk is getting worse. I wondered about how to confirm the struts were the problem, and the necessity to dsassemble the car to get at these things. Looking forward to hearing how your trip to the dealer went, especially the cost. I've got the wrench and the air, so I'll see if I can squeeze it in there.

Mike

I'm not alone! My '07 is exhibiting the same symptoms ... a subtle clunking/rattling noise from the front end while driving over roughness or bumpy roads AND I have a knock in the steering wheel.

I've had the steering column replaced (twice) and the engine mount replaced, both under warranty. But the car continues to make front end noise.

Is yours fixed? Any update to your situation?

Thanks!

(see related thread)

Nope, not fixed yet, but the dealer claims that a) it's the motor mount TSB, b) it's a $400 fix, and c) it can be ignored, so I'm going to ignore it for now. I'm not completely happy with this diagnosis, or the front struts idea, because of the hard-knock feel in the steering wheel when it happens. It's not getting any worse, for whatever that's worth. Haven't tried lightly applying brakes, but I'll head over to my favorite diagnostic test area (a rough RR crossing) and give it a shot next week.

Reviving -

My car seems to have come with this problem, which is annoying at only (purchased around 35k miles) 40k miles at this point.

Patrick and others, why is it that I only notice it at slow speeds (under 10 mph, usually coming up to stop sign or light) going over little bumps or potholes. It doesn't seem to be an issue at higher speeds. Is it still occurring and I just can't hear/feel it over other road noise?

P.S. Engine mount TSB was done on my car, so that's not it.

My guess is that this is a front strut problem and that it is occurring continuously but not noticeable at higher speed due to the other road noises.

I'm still convinced (sorta-kinda) that it's in the steering somewhere, because of the pronounced hard, metal-to-metal feeling "clunk" or "clatter" that can be clearly felt in the steering wheel. The steering TSB was done early in its life, and the dealer has twice failed to find any other possible cause other than the engine mount TSB. For that matter, the dealer has never been able to reproduce the problem by driving around his parking lot, and shows no interest in driving to a RR crossing a couple of miles away where the problem is very pronounced. Time to try another dealer, methinks, or a small independent who I have a lot of confidence in.

Thanks for reviving! I posted on this same issue earlier in this thread. Here's the latest on my end:

As posted earlier, my '07 with ~50K miles exhibits the front end noise just as others have described. As I said earlier, "a subtle clunking/rattling noise from the front end while driving over roughness or bumpy roads AND I have a knock in the steering wheel." The engine mount TSB has already been performed.

I'm able to consistently reproduce the clunk/rattle noise by driving over a speed bump with the brake pedal slightly depressed. (brakes are not engaged enough to grip, just lightly pressing the pedal.) Note, the noise does not happen exclusively when the brake it depressed, just reliably.

I test drove with a dealership master technician and demonstrated the condition on more than one occasion. Dealership could not locate any problem and advised that I bring the car back so that a visiting Factory Service Technician (Corporate Rep) could inspect and diagnose.

I obliged. Upon inspection, the Factory Service Technician determined it is "normal operating condition". No repairs performed.

I then called the corporate Customer Experience Center. I was told that Toyota is currently investigating the issue, however there is no Service Bulletin related to the issue at this time. (nor was there any indication there will ever be one).

If you are experiencing this issue, I urge you to call Toyota Customer Experience and file a complaint.

Finally resolved, maybe. I'm sitting in the Courtesy Toyota (Orlando) waiting room (best I've ever been in in dealer), waiting. They claim that even though the struts themselves are fine, the rubber bushings holding the upper end of the strut into the frame are hardened, wallowed out, and misshapen, allowing the strut to wallow around and make all kinds of noises. They also said the tires are starting to cup a little, and it may have an affect on the steering as well. They say that I could change just the bushings, but the major cost is in the labor, and since you've got to remove the struts to replace the bushings, well.... A little over $650 to change them both ($$), which they recommend and I guess makes sense. That requires alignment, of course ($), and as long as it's up in the air, they'd love to service the rear brakes ($).

I'll let you know how it works out after I get home. There's one short stretch of road which can reliably produce the problem on the way home. (Fingers crossed.)

I've spent far too much money here this month: New Prius v for my wife, first major service on my '05 (96,000 miles); hope I'm done for a while.

I think that did the job. I have one more test road to try, but the trip home from the dealer was promising. I requested all the old parts when I signed the service order, but of course they ignored that, as most dealers do in my experience. But I pressed the issue and they went back into the shop and produced a set of old struts for me that, as expected, looked fine, although they were pretty soft. I asked where the bushings were, and he said, "Oh, you wouldn't wnt those -- they disintegrated when we took them out." Why don't they get it? But, I'm pretty sure it's fixed and all in all I"m pretty happy with the "service experience."

That definitely fixed the major clunking problem, There's still some minor clunking and steering clattering going on, but they said, "Oh, that's just the intermediate steering shaft." So I guess I just wait until it fails altogether? Seems to be a common problem that no one is terribly concerned about.

The intermediate steering shaft was the subject of a Prius recall. If in fact that is causing clunking and clattering I would encourage you to have that part replaced.

My records show that Service Campaign 60C - Intermediate Steering Shaft - was done at 14,535 miles on 6/27/06. I didn't have any symptoms at that time, but I do now... I wonder if Toyota would like to do this again under the SC coverage?

Congratulations on finally solving the problem after two years and 30K miles!

Is the "guilty" rubber bushing visible or accessible by touch? If so I would like to add it to the list of items for periodic inspection.

By the way the Honda dealer for my wife's car started to give back replaced parts in nicely printed plastic bags a while ago. Apparently it had become cheaper to order the plastic bags than dealing with waste disposal.

You can ask. The worst that will happen is that they will say no, you already got one free part and labor, now you get to pay for subsequent repairs.

I personally would not tolerate known degradation of steering components since this represents a significant safety issue. So whether you have to pay for the repair or not, I would have that done sooner vs. later.

After lunch, I had a chance to drive over the Bumpy Railroad Crossing from Hell, and I've still got a LOT of rattling coming from down there. The "clunk" part is truly gone, though, so I don't think replacing the struts was a waste. Now I've got to have a discussion with the Toyota folks to decide between T-SB-0300-08 (Engine Mount Assembly), or SSC 60C (Intermediate Steering Shaft), or both.

I don't think so, but others who have taken their own struts out may know better. I'm not even sure what "bushing" (my term) they were talking about when they said it just crumbled, but I'm thinking it might have been in the "Front Suspension Support Sub-assy" in the illustration. I'm hoping one of the guys who knows better will comment.