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Replacement Tire Decision

Discussion in 'Gen 3 Prius Care, Maintenance & Troubleshooting' started by Mendel Leisk, Oct 27, 2012.

  1. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

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    One of our OEM tires (Michelin Pilot HX MXM4 in 2515/45R17) has a slow leak for maybe a year. Putting the snow tires on last weekend, I finally found the culprit: a small nail in the tread, confirmed when wet, it's bubbling a bit.

    I phoned our nearest dealership service department, and they confirmed they do flat repairs, the full repair with patch from the inside, and they said just bring it in, they'd have a look. Today I did that, but they noted the nail was too close to the tread edge, and on the inside the patch would be into the curve. Bottom line: a patch was not practical/safe, and the tire should be replaced.

    Getting home I checked tread depth (they're all sitting in a stack in the garage), they're all at 7 ~8/32's remaining, depending on whether they came off the front or rear. I see on TireRack the Pilots are lower-middle of the pack in their class:

    Consumer Survey Results By Category

    At the same time, at Costco (Canada) website the Pilots have the distinction of being one of the priciest choices, at $268.99. Meanwhile, the (near the top of TireRack list) the Michelin Primacy MXM4 are $229.99. Not far behind are the Bridgestone Ecopia EP422, at $194.99.

    To muddy the water, there's currently a $70 off coupon on set of 4 offer from Michelin, and at Costco that $70 comes off at the till, before taxes.

    Bottom line, including taxes, coupons:

    To replace one Pilot HX MXM4 with same: $301.27
    To replace all with Michelin Primacy MXM4 (w/ coupon): $920.60 ($619.33 more)
    To replace all with Bridgestone Ecopia EP422: $873.56 ($572.29 more)

    So, a bit of quandry. Again: the OEM Pilots are at 7~8/32th tread depth remaining. Not much wear, but some.

    Plus both the Primacy and Ecopia are listed as LRR, while the Pilot's are not. Unless the OEM's were a special version.

    Questions I have:

    1. Is it off-the-wall to replace all at this point?

    2. Any opinions on the Ecopia EP422 vs Michelin Primacy MXM4, for rolling resistance, handling etcetera? At least on Tirerack the Primacy is ahead "in the polls" for handling, grip. No real comparison of RR though.

    3. Get a plug repair and forget the whole thing? The nail looks to be going straight in, 1/2" from the tread corner.
     
  2. JMD

    JMD 2012 Prius 4 Solar Roof

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    Replace the one damaged tire with identical make a model.
     
  3. Former Member 68813

    Former Member 68813 Senior Member

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    Learn how to patch the tire yourself. Cost of kit for multiple uses: $10 or under.

    Keep in mind that tire places make more money by selling tires and will find BS excuses not to repair it. Been there myself.
     
  4. JMD

    JMD 2012 Prius 4 Solar Roof

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    The original tires have little life left. The damaged tire cannot be repaired. If you doubt the reputation of he tire store go to a different place an get a new opinion. Tire safety is a big issue. If the tire fails on the freeway going at a High rate of speed you risk a roll which can total the car and may be serious injury to the occupants . What would you live with if a spouse or child was injured ll to save a few dollars. If it was me I would replace the damaged tire. If you we're ready to replace all 4 and ave th $ than do so. Better safe than sorry. You say the tires are close to worn out. Get new ones. Shop around an get a good deal. I once drove on bald tires at 19 years old and it rained and I totaled the car. Will never do that again.
     
  5. F8L

    F8L Protecting Habitat & AG Lands

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    Mendel, can you order from Discount Tire? If so you can get up to $170 off a set of 4 Michelin tires TODAY only or$180 on Goodyear tires. Because they don't charge for shipping their prices are comparable to TireRack. The Goodyear ComforTread could be a good choice in a 205/50/17. They are actually a little more fuel efficient than the MXM4 tire.
     
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  6. Former Member 68813

    Former Member 68813 Senior Member

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    Yes, this is exactly the scare tactic tire shops use. BTW, he said 7-8/32 thread depth.
     
  7. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

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    No, no, no: the original tires have 7~8/32" remaining tread depth, they're maybe 1/3 through their tread life.

    Reading up, I see the outer block of "tread" is not considered part of the tread. And the nail is in that block, 1/2" from the corner. According to the Toyota mechanic, their rule of thumb for determining the cutoff for proximity to that edge is (you guessed it): one thumb width, lol.

    I guess my main issue is:

    Do I throw good money after bad? Or bite the bullet. The Pilot's are way down the list, apparently not LRR, and pricey as heck.
     
  8. a priori

    a priori Canonus Curiosus

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    You still have another year's tread life on decent (not great) tires. If I understand it correctly, the leak is from a straight-in nail in the tread. This is a straightforward fix, and I've had this done several times.

    The cheapest fix is to join Sam's Club. They fix tires for free for members (even if you didn't buy the tire there).

    Save up your pennies and buy a new set next year, unless you really want new tires. In that case, follow F8L's advice. I was able to buy MXM4s at Discount Tire for $150/tire.
     
  9. JMD

    JMD 2012 Prius 4 Solar Roof

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    My miss-understand. 2/3 life left than keep the tires. If you can repair and be safe than go for it.
     
  10. F8L

    F8L Protecting Habitat & AG Lands

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    That is a lot of usable tread!
     
  11. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

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    Considering I've got 4~5 months to sort this, I'm going to give the plug patch a try. I'm a little concerned with the nail being close to the edge. Will try the plug repair, raise the pressure and check over the winter. The rim has the tpms sensor, and I'll be vigalante when running it next spring.

    While there's a couple of low end plug repair kits readily available, I found something a little nicer, with 2 diameters of plugs, more robust/complete, with a nice case. Locally available at KMS Tools:

    BlackJack Tire Repair | (New Design) Tire Repair Kit with T-Bone Handles & Screwdriver

    Good thing to keep in the underhatch floor tray. Along with a decent bicycle pump, I think you could fix most any on-the-road nail puncture, without having to put on the compact spare.
     
  12. JMD

    JMD 2012 Prius 4 Solar Roof

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    Sounds like a Plan.
     
  13. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

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    Thanks.

    I had touble getting my head around how the needle works: I see now they have a small opening at the tip of the eye, so when you pull the needle back out the plug is able to slip through.

    Here's a video demonstration (one of many), using a good quality plug repair kit, and a bit of Aussie dry-humour:

     
  14. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

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    Well..., picked up the BlackJack Tire Plug kit today, did the deed, and pressured it up (with a bicycle pump :ROFLMAO:), and it looks to be holding. Set it to 40 psi, just with the dial gage integrated into the pump, will check overnight and over the next week or two with proper pressure gauge (my wife's off with the car, and all the gauges), but looks good to go! :)
     
  15. Former Member 68813

    Former Member 68813 Senior Member

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    Strong work!

    It's amazing how easy is to fix tires that are often otherwise scrapped.

    Just this summer my daughter curbed a tire in my Prius and it developed a small leak from a sidewall (without significant damage to the sidewall). Since I still have 50% tread left I considered if I could save that tire. I did some searches and found some discussion how you can fix sidewall air leaks by using well directed application of green tire slime. I positioned the tire that gravity would direct the slime to go to the area of interest, inflated and things are well several months later.

    BTW, slime is safe for TPMS sensors.
     
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  16. Whirlwind

    Whirlwind Well, it's not REAL!!!

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    I fix tires with plugs frequently on the work van. I keep a kit on there at all times. So far had few problems. It wont suddenly fail, but leak slowly if its not holding. Just keep the tire pressure checked. TPM males this easier. Over loading or driving on a tire with a noticeable vibration is bad though. Even a balanced tire can have an inner delamination that will cause a shake or wobble, and thus will not show up at the tire place. Have stuff like that fixed pronto.
    Ww
     
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  17. Den49

    Den49 Member

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    I had the same issue on my daughter’s Corolla. The nail was in the edge tread and no tire or repair shop would repair it. In my locale, the tire is considered non-repairable if the puncture is anywhere in the outside tread. All the shops had documentation stating that. Her other three tires all had about 8/32” remaining tread.

    There is another option you may want to consider which is what I did for my daughter’s car. Buy two new tires of the same type as the remaining three and scrap the punctured tire. Put the two new tires with 10/32” tread on the front of the vehicle and rotate them so they spend more time on the front so they can wear out at about the same time as the older 8/32” tires. You can sell or keep the extra 8/32” tire for a spare. This worked well on the Corolla. We kept the extra 8/32” tire for a spare since both her car and our Prius had the same size and brand of tire (Harmony 195 x 65 x 15).

    I am sure you know that you do not want to put only one new tire on the same axle with an old tire that is worn more than 10%, which is what you have. This can cause problems in the drive train, ABS and VSC.

    I also think it is too risky to patch or plug a tire in the outside tread area, even though it was considered OK in the past. There usually is a good reason for new and tighter standards. It could be related to the lower profile of today’s tires and increased stress in the edge tread area. I also slept better at night knowing I had done the right thing for her and not some cheap half-measure that put her at risk.

    PS: A plug is now considered a temporary fix only until your first opportunity to get to a tire shop and have the tire properly repaired, if possible, with a professional patch-plug.
     
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