Tanabe R&D for the 2010 Prius

Hey guys,
I just got back my car from Tanabe USA this evening and while it was too dark to take any good pics, I will as soon as I find some time. As for an summary of my experience, here goes:
2010 prius pkg II, 15" wheels.

the short version: Tanabe tested out some exhausts, chassis bracing, and spring kits....they installed and let me keep one of each.

the longer version:
Michael Gamboa over at Tanabe couldn't have been a cooler guy. He understood my concerns about the car, the mods, and the affect on my warranty. We both understood that while these are modifications, they are reversible.

I brought in the car on Monday morning for Tanabe's R&D session 2009 (for 2010 models), and was told that a few spring sets, a few exhausts, and chassis braces were going to be installed for fit-testing. Michael asked me what parts I'd prefer to keep (should they be available for me to keep 'em) and I said I wanted the medium low springs (as opposed to the lowest springs they tested), any exhaust they would give me, and all the chassis bracing they'd give.

Apparently, these parts were all fit-tested to a Japanese 2010 prius, and were brought from Japan to be fit-tested on a US model.

I picked up my car today, and they literally gave me everything they told me they might. Under-body chassis bracing, an upgraded exhaust, and the spring kit, all installed. they were even cool enough to neatly and cleanly box and bag my stock parts for me (which fit easily in the trunk space, by the way).

I haven't had a chance to talk to michael since I've picked up my car but it seems the only thing they didn't give me was a strut tower brace. I spoke briefly to James over at Tanabe, and he told me the strut tower brace didn't fit properly, since the shape of some parts of the hood were different than the shape of the Japanese Prius (at least thats what I understood him to mean from his explanation).
*I want to thank the Tanabe guys for being very very cool people, and for the parts. You've saved me what likely amounts to a lot of money for modifications I'd consider, but likely never get my wallet around.

My initial obersvations (looks):
Tanabe gave me the NF210 spring kit. (NF means normal-feeling, if that helps explain my experience). One might not notice that the car was lowered upon first glance. I will say, however, that the car looks sportier (tanabe uses "elegant" which is also an accurate description), and however subtle that might be, my girlfriend noticed right away without me saying anything. I chose this spring set over the lowest ones because I don't like the idea of having to drive it so cautiously over anything long-term. I feel these new springs are a happy medium of sporty performance, looks, and daily-driver convenience.

The exhaust, which is a Concept G Exhaust System, looks....really cool. its shiny, its big (well, bigger than stock), and it doesn't look out of place on the car, surprisingly.

I havent had a chance to look at the chassis bracing under the car, but I did see under the hood, and there is no tower strut brace, sadly. But I'm not complaining, I am very pleased with what they gave me.

My initial observations (driving):
The car like it reacts a little more stiffly and with much less body roll (if thats the correct way to put it), though not noticeably lower to the ground with the NF210 kit over the sock springs. I was careful around dips and speedbumps, though I don't really know I need to be so much. The chassis bracing and the new springs definitely add a stability and stiffness to the car that were not present before.

There is a curvy onramp near my house that on occasion I floor it through in power mode, for the hell of it. I did it again with the new parts installed and it felt much more stable, much more in control, and way less roll. I feel like the strut tower braces would have helped though. The one thing I will say, is that the parts have increased the amount of speed I can maintain through a sharp turn. I do feel however, that much of this could be further reduced or eliminated with performance tires. The car tracks much better now. Driving from the 405 to the 605N has always been odd. on the 605N, just after the 405, my prius always had trouble tracking the road. I felt the car whip back and forth, as if it were following wavy grooves in the road or being easily swayed by wind. This no longer happens, at least not to the extent that it did. also, I was always slightly annoyed coming to a complete stop, where the car used to pitch forward with a little jerk right at the complete stop, it no longer does this. it just stops, and I, thankfully, feel nothing.

The exhaust isn't very loud (thank god) and doesn't just "kick-in" loudly at 30mph or whatever. In terms of sound, it takes the stock sound we all have, and adds a (this is the only way i can think to put it) masculine voice to it. maybe im trying to say "adds lower frequencies'' when compared to the stock exhaust. Basically, there's a lower, deeper, purring sound than you'd normally get when the engine is on. The only time the exhaust really lets you know its there is when you're maxxing out the accelerator and even then its gradual, based on how hard you're pushing it. When its floored, the car sounds great. there IS noise, but its pleasing and very appropriate for a car that is being floored, where the stock engine sounds like its working "too" hard. Again, the term masculine comes to mind. Its designed to let out more exhaust (read: emissions) though Im not sure if in a Prius, that would even increase HP. I can't tell yet if the car is any more powerful, or quick, really. I mean, I do feel like it is, but I know better than to trust my initial gut feeling, considering I just got a bunch of free performance parts, and I'm eager to find out what's doing what. I feel as if the car has more oomph. That might be the sound of the exhaust influencing my experience though. We'll see tomorrow.

The negatives: First and foremost is the stock vs. modded car vs. warranty issue. Luckily this is a minimized issue seeing that I still have all the stock parts and by the looks of it, these mods are easily undone. which kinda brings me to the next "negative".
So, like I said, I have all the stock parts still sitting in my trunk (so keep that in mind), but my perception initially was that car drives like its a little heavier. flooring it from a stop in power mode doesn't seem to have the same snap, although, I feel like the car is "snappier" at higher speeds than it used to be. I can accelerate around cars in a way I don't think I used to be able to do. This perception of a "slower start" diminished, though, over my drive, and Im starting to think there are a few possible reasons for this being very hard to judge:
1. its not so much less "snappy" as it is that the exhaust keeps the car from sounding like its revved to such a high pitch right away. that high pitch engine revving likely played a part in my perception of acceleration.
2. I, likely, was just "expecting" some sort of large performance jump, and am attributing a decrease to the lack of an increase (if you catch my drift).
3. While the car was at Tanabe, I was driving a G35 sports coupe around. The feel of this car likely played a role in my perception of my prius, power mode or not.

I'll post pics soon, as well as update my experience with it. overall, though? EXTREMELY SATISFIED. I think its time to order some wheel caps and take off the rim covers. Thanks again Michael, and the rest of Tanabe.

-David

P.S. I'm not so extremely into performance cars, but I do know what's what. Please take my observations as just that, and know that my opinions, such as they are, are from an average driver's point of view. Im not a hypermiler, but I did buy a prius for the gas milage. end of disclaimer.

pics:
lowered with NF210 springs, no rim covers


lowered with NF210 springs, no rim covers


lowered with NF210 springs, no rim covers


Lowered with NF210 Springs, rim covers


Concept G Exhaust


Concept G Exhaust mounted


NF210 mounted


The Sustec Under Brace is a 2-Point bar that braces the transmission tunnel.


Sustec 2-Point Under Brace (notice the stock black bracing elements)

The chassis brace, is the in the center of the bottom of the car? And can you verify how many pieces it is and how many points it connects to the chassis at? I've been trying to figure out what to get...pics would be awesome!

one thing i learned when modding subaru's..........




let somebody else do it first

I'm kind of surprised we aren't seeing people play with the performance side a bit more (HP and mileage). Funny thing is we (at least in CA) do not have to go through smog testing - so in theory, there are many mods that could occur - without standard emission issues...

Flame away - it's just an observation...

no need to flame....unless you're the guy who was mad that his prius was losing races against other street racers

UPDATE:
Spoke to Michael again and he confirmed that yes, the Japan 2010 Prius is different under the hood from the 2010 US Prius, which is why the strut tower brace did not fit...it was designed for a Japan 2010. Also, It appears that of the 2 piece Tanabe Sustec under brace on the Sigma site, only the front piece was installed on my car. The rear was not tested. Perhaps the 2010 doesn't need it? Perhaps the car might benefit more with the addition of a stiffening plate? What do you guys think?

Stock rear under-brace, no modification done at R&D session.



Ive driven the car as hard as I could all day today, and Im more and more letting go of the idea that my observation is simply a placebo effect: the car definitely has more "go" at higher speeds. Stock, the car felt like there was a HP bottleneck at around the 75+mph range. Like the car was slower to accelerate past about 75-80mph. Now, at that speed, I can still gas it and quickly accelerate higher. In fact, I was cruising at 85 with a few other cars, gassed it and quickly shot past them and up to 99mph for a minute or so. The car didn't feel like it was trying too hard either. It was definitely working hard, but it didn't feel like it was maxxed out. The exhaust sound is really pleasing. It sounds deep and muscular, but not at all loud or overpowering.

The chassis brace and springs work together for a sportier suspension feel overall, and a slightly lowered look. It's most noticeable at high speeds though, the car feels completely in control and tight.

Man, Christmas came early for somebody! Thanks for the great write-up and pics!

Also a big thanks to Tanabe-USA for taking the time to test fit parts for the gen III Prius! Did they mention when the parts would be available for sale?

A few questions regarding springs, were you allowed to "test drive" the DF210 springs? Or were they even compatible with the US model? If so, what were your impressions?

Judging from your initial pics with the NF210 springs fitted, it's difficult to notice the drop in ride height from stock.

Thank-you for taking the time to confirm parts fitment for us!

Nope, unfortunately they did not. I doubt it would be very long though, considering the parts that DID pass fitment were already manufactured Prius parts. The strut tower brace will likely take a while, though, depending on whether they adjust the current model, fabricate a new prototype, or whatever.

I basically dropped off my car and said "Michael, please try to get them to keep as many parts on the car as possible". That said, we agreed that they'd test the lowest springs (DF210) first, then the NF210 and leave em on. This is because between the two, the NF210 was almost sure to pass fitment and since they'd already be on the car, it's less work for them. I probably could have gotten the DF210, but to be honest, I've already bottomed out twice with the NF210, and for my taste, wouldn't care to go much lower (though it probably looks great).

Yeah, thats absolutely right. It definitely takes a second of looking at it to notice exactly what's going on with the car. but, without a doubt, you can tell somethings different. I even had the luck of parking next to another 2010 here in Silverlake, and yeah mine was lower, despite the drop not being obvious. The subtlety adds something really "elegant" to the car, just a nicer stance overall. If and when I get new wheels, I think the drop will be more pronounced.


UPDATE: I filled up my tank last week and decided to drive the car as hard as I could, get the lowest milage I could, and have some fun. About 1/2 way through the tank I brought the car in to Tanabe with the car at a 41mpg. Post modifications, I've driven the car just as hard if not harder, and at the blinking gas blip, I'm at 44mpg. dunno if there's an actual correlation to be found there, but take it for what it is: its hard to get below 40 mpg in this car. I tried, really really hard.

Also: does anyone know enough about the 2010 stock suspension to know whether or not a "stabilizer plate" is necessary?


Dakine, can you (or someone) measure the clearance from the car to the tire? I'll post what I have and we can figure out just how much drop I got. thanks in advance!

Car looks great thanks for giving us a great review..... definitely will be in the market for a set of springs.... I wonder which is giving u the better mpg the lower center of gravity or the exhaust? This was just springs with stock shocks correct?

I'm thinking this combo plus a set of 10lbs volk eco wheels and this thing might see 50mpg driven hard! that would be amazing. Again appreciate any feedback... Brandon

So... you still have the stock strut and shock absorber install? Only the springs are new right?

I was so hoping you weren't going to make the R&D session. I was #2 on the list. Looks and sounds great. Would really like to see the car in full view to really see the stance of it. I have to say it is really weird that the suspension pieces would be different between cars from here and there. I can understand spring rates being different, but I am seriously interested in getting coilovers but obviously want to hear from someone who has done it to make sure. One would think at least mounting spots would be the same. I will agree with you that Michael was great talking to him on the phone. Really looking forward to those pieces being available here in the states so we don't have to import this stuff. My car is going to cost a fortune at his rate to get it looking the way I want, but either way it should be done by next summer some time. Congrats on the new goodies!

*Here's the first post of the Tanabe R&D 2010. I'm sure it'll be updated regularly.

Tanabe USA R&D Blog | Research & Development Session Updates Day-to-Day

* The exhaust they gave me was NOT a Medalion Touring, rather, its a Concept G exhaust system.

* Yeah it was just the springs they tried out (no shocks/struts) and as far as I know, there were no fitment problems in the suspension area (the only issue was for the strut tower brace), so coilovers probably wouldn't be an issue.

* It might be worth noting that the R&D session results page for the 2009 Prius show that the NF210 springs DID pass, while the DF210 springs DID NOT pass, citing "Not enough suspension stroke".

* Also, while Sigma seems to offer a 2-Part under-bracing kit, both R&D sessions (2009/2010 Priuses) only tested the 2-Point under-brace, and not the rear, where something like a BT Tech Stiffening Plate might go. I'll see if I can get any info on these issues from Michael, I don't want to bother them too much though.

* Speaking to Tanabe yesterday, the Strut Tower Brace issue was made more clear: The Japan version of this brace *did* fit on the US model. However, the bar was touching a rubber grommet or something to the effect that it was deemed a "Not Pass" for fitment. Personally, I would have liked to have kept it anyway, touching parts be damned!

Can you get more photos of the Concept G Exhaust System?

In particular, I would like to see:

• flash photo from the rear - I'd like to see if it has baffles of any kind or if it is a 'glass pack'
• photos of the exhaust fitting - in particular the pipe from the front of the muffler to the exhaust pipe. I'm curious if they had to fab a special adapter pipe segment for the muffler (my guess.)

Do you still have the original muffler? The new features discusses an valve that opens under high power to reduce back flow. Any photos you might have to that area of the muffler or the connector/wire would be helpful.

Of all the things you mentioned, the muffler is one area that I believe our NHW11 and NHW20 could use some help.

Thanks,
Bob Wilson

I saw your car there and looks like they did a good job doing clean installs... congrats to you man! and congrats to Tanabe!! keep up the good work!

Hey Bob,
A digital dissection of the Concept G can be found here Tanabe USA Inc. - Concept G Exhaust (there are 5 red squares with pics in them. click the left-most square to see the dissected view).

as far as pics go, let me know if this is what you were looking for.


the Concept G kit extends all the way to the front of the car, about 3 feet of piping, and looks to be designed specifically to fit the 2010 prius. I'm not quite sure what you mean tho....

I took a look at the stock muffler, and I cannot see anything on it that would indicate any sort of valve or anything atypical for that matter. there is piping, the muffler, exhaust tip, and mounting brackets. perhaps this feature is inside the muffler itself?

Objective impressions would be nice.

It sure would be nice if two cars a stock and modified were compared blind. That is the drive would not know which he was driving when reporting on the feel and when he tracked it.

You so seldom see people do good testing on this stuff, it is so easy to want it to be better.

Double blind is best, nobody knows what is being tested.

Now if you like the way it looks, that's another matter all together.

The stock muffler has a spring loaded valve with no exposure to outside the muffler shell. Purely based on back-pressure.

Wayne

Re: Objective impressions would be nice.

i can definitely appreciate that. unfortunately, i doubt it would be very realistic, given the sound and feel differences between the stock and a modded car. There is no blind. It'd basically be a numbers game, with numerous drivers running the same tests over and over (how many times do people research a product and only trust one review?).

The only sort of "credibility" that i,small as it is, can offer is that :

A. i got the parts for free, so there's less Pride-of-Ownership. many times, the reason people are so quick to sing a product's praises has a direct connection to the fact that they parted ways with a lot of money to get it. given my situation, i really have very little reason to say the parts do something that they clearly do not.

B. there's definitely no disputing the new handling characteristics. i have a number of daily drives where i've come to know how the car will react, and post-modification, there have definitely been changes in how the car responds to these. the handling in turns and at higher speeds is simply different.

C. in my initial observations, i was very careful about staying skeptical, but I honestly feel the changes and am convinced something is different here.

Basically, its all hearsay until someone people actually trust reviews the parts. all im doing is giving my observations.

the issue is, i dont know anyone enough (and by extension, trust anyone enough) to be willing to let them take my car and drive it. however, if anyone is in the OC/LA area and wants to meet up, I'd be happy to drive you around a little and you can tell me what you think. unfortunately even then, its impractical that i'd spend that much time convincing enough "test-drivers" to eliminate all the extraneous variables that come into play (like people wanting there to be a difference, people not wanting there to be a difference, people's perception of what "different" is etc etc).

anyway, dunno if that's of interest to anyone, but its out there for anyone who's interested. its become more fun to drive now, so sharing the experience might be cool for the forum.
-david




also, for the person who wanted to see a whole-car shot to see the "pose" of the car; here's a before and after using tanabe's pics to compare:

before:



after:


before:



after:


tanabe's site will no doubt do a better comparison, so take this one with a grain of salt.

David,

Thanks for posting your observations and pictures. Although it is a bit hard to tell given the nature of your Prius's paint color, I could see that there's less of a "gap" between the tire and top of wheel well. I think it definitely looks better, and I take your word that it handles better also. Like you had said, when coming to the end of a stop, my car seems to lurch a bit, as though I stepped on the brakes a little too hard even though I try to ease into it. Sounds like the upgrades fixed this issue.

Sorry for not replying any sooner....

Tire to fender clearance is approx 2 5/8" on my car. Info may be skewed a bit since I'm running 18" rims although I kept the overall tire diameter the same as OEM.

Tire diameters will vary somewhat between manufacturers. Also keep in mind when I took this reading I had about a 1/4 tank of fuel.

Can someone who has 15" rims measure their tire to fender clearance?

On NF210's I think it's typically a 1" drop. I would personally like an 1 1/2" drop.....

That drop does look nice.