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    cwerdna Senior Member

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    Chevrolet Volt -- the Art of Driving for Free - TheStreet
    I have some real problems w/this review. It's unclear how many charging stations will remain free and for how long.

    Some of his math is fuzzy too, like mentioning the $7.5K tax credit but then saying the Leaf is $35K w/o mentioning its tax credit.

    The one part that I'm really unhappy about is:
    Right... the CS mode mileage of the Volt is far inferior to that of the Prius.
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    stefano5777 Member

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    Cwerdna It is a wonderful form of propaganda being spewed by GM. Money talks and right now GM is poring 100's of millions of dollars into any and every form of advertising to try and ensure the Volt does not fail.
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    john1701a Prius Guru

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    Same old propaganda. They compare to the most expensive cordless model of Prius and carefully avoid any mention whatsoever of the plug-in model.
    .
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    gwmort Active Member

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    It seemed pretty fair and balanced to me. The article didn't shy away from the negatives of the car including the price, the limited seating, the reduced rear passenger room, etc..., and basically came to the same conclusion many of you have that it is about $10,000 more than a prius and difficult to justify economically.

    "What's the bottom line on the Chevrolet Volt? First, you have to decide if a very low four-seat car with a small back seat and a small trunk space is for you. If it is, and you disregard the price for a moment, I give the Chevrolet Volt essentially a 10 out of 10. That said, $43,000 is a lot of money compared to the otherwise easy choice: Toyota Prius. It's hard to justify the price premium on pure economic grounds, unless you believe gasoline will go significantly above $5 per gallon while electricity prices won't increase as much. But the Volt feels like so much of a richer car than the Prius, and it drives much better (faster, quieter, more comfortable, etc.). Overall, $43,000 for the Volt is not totally unfair, but does reduce the overall grade to something below 10. Perhaps an 8."

    He should have mentioned the tax incentive on the leaf and that stripped down prii can be obtained cheaper, but I don't think the plug-in prius bears mentioning other than in a prospective "other manufacturers will soon have other options available in the future" kind of way, especially in a discussion of costs because no one knows what Toyota will charge for it yet.
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    austingreen Senior Member

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    If the plug in prius would be mentioned, I can only imagine it being mentioned in a negative way. For example "Toyota had said they were going to come out with a plug in version of the prius at the same time as the volt. It is now delayed until the first half of next year, the price is unknown, and the range is unknown but much less than the volt."
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    john1701a Prius Guru

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    So rather than being constructive by pointing out intent, just spin it to look negative?!?

    The intent by Toyota is to deliver an affordable plug-in solution for the masses that significantly boosts efficiency.

    What's so difficult about that? Of course, we still don't actually know those details about Volt. Even Lutz admitted it would be just a halo initially and GM is intending to rollout BAS to fill the void... or should we said, provide a stop-gap.
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    austingreen Senior Member

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    Just balancing your negative spin, why do you have to hate on the volt so much. Come on john, it was a review of current cars, but you had to say it was bad because it didn't include your pick, and had some balanced praise for a car your hate.

    and that matters to this review how? Without a price how can you say its affordable versus the volt, leaf, and prius discussed. That's what I thought your fake spin. Anyway this is america where you are rewarded or rejected based on results not intentions. I don't think gm or toyota should be judged based on what they wanted the car to be, otherwise they would run on rainbows.

    Its a car review on a financial site. What in the world would this have to do with Lutz? Or is that just your common complaint that needs to go into any comment about the volt?

    What detail about the volt didn't it tell you? Price, check. Mileage, check. Range, check. Size, performance. Which thing do you think was missing? Now tell us those details about the prius phv for the reviewer to compare. Yup. Toyota has not released them yet. Please stop whining about the volt in every single thread.
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    billnchristy Active Member

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    You guys should know by now...

    If it's not Prius...it's CRAAAAAP!
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    john1701a Prius Guru

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    Hence the spin. Supply of Volt is extremely limited and available in only select areas, yet intention is to improve upon that.
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    gwmort Active Member

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    That was GM's intent too, but all you do is give them a hard time for saying it. Seems ironic you want it said more about Toyota.

    I wait patiently for the day I can see if the PHV is more expensive after tax credit than a Volt, on that day you will eat crow sir.
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    john1701a Prius Guru

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    Again with the intent... the credits are only temporary, an expense to taxpayers, not available to everyone, and they don't address engine efficiency & emission goals.
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    mmcdonal Active Member

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    I find it amusing that GM equivocates on what the Volt really is (a plug- in parallel hybrid) and makes out like it is a range extended serial hybrid, and constantly wants it compared to the Leaf.

    The Volt is as much an "electric" vehicle as the Prius and Fusion, except it has an extended range based on plug-in capabilities. Prius will have that next year, along with some tiny Ford models. The only other difference is that the gas engine only directly drives the wheels over 70 mph.

    The Leaf is in a class by itself, unless you want to include very expensive sports models and some vaporware yet to hit the streets.

    The Volt should only be compared to other parallel hybrids. I think GM wants the fuzzy good feelings of electric only, without the range anxiety feelings of pure electric, and has only once admitted it isn't what it was originally billed as.

    Wait till next year. And Toyota, if you are listening, please spend more than $10.00 per year advertising the features of your cars.
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    Corwyn Energy Curmudgeon

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    "...and it drives much better (faster..."

    I can't tell you how many times I have been annoyed not to be able to go faster than 100mph in my Prius.
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    gwmort Active Member

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    I know it may seem that way on paper, but I assure you that is just not so. I agree it is not in the same class as the pure EV's, but there really is a substantive difference to normal hybrids.

    Most of the time I operate as a pure EV. My entire commute, my trips to the store, etc... That just wouldn't be the case in any other car available today except a pure EV. Total I've got 2497 EV miles in the last 2 months, more than 67% of my total miles.

    Tomorrow I'll hit 1200 miles since my last fill up (which was 7.4 gallons 20 days ago).

    I would never go back to a cordless vehicle, and hope by my next to be able to go pure, until then the PHEVs are a real a true step closer than an HV.
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    usbseawolf2000 HSD PhD

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    Ford hybrids are great. C-Max hybrid would be a great alternative to the Prius v.

    Hyundai hybrid also look promising and it is clean (SULEV).
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    Skoorbmax Senior Member

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    I agree. It is a plug-in hybrid, it fits that definition closer than any other.

    Nobody ever has thought the plug-in prius is anything but, well, a plug-in hybrid and it will be a direct dead to rights competitor with the volt from that perspective and, i think, going to smack its B up.
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    usbseawolf2000 HSD PhD

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    I thought I should share this one here.

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    Sergiospl Senior Member

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    It is interesting that GM talked for almost 4 years of extended EV and waited until the last minute to admit that the engine is actually going to mechanically drive the front wheels. Some at GM and other car manufacturers spent the better part of the last decade trashing the Prius, they discussed all the reasons why the Prius did not make sense. So, when it came time For GM to build a car, they went to great length to tell people that they are building an EV, not hybrid! Yes, an EV with ICE, Oil, Gas and a muffler. In the end, I think GM built a good car, they built a plug-in Prius with better EV range, about 35 miles EV, then operates in series and parallel hybrid modes.

    About "Auto Journalists", It became easier since the internet for anyone to be an automobile journalist, all you need is an official press release from the car manufacturer and the ability to cut & paste, Voila!
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    mmcdonal Active Member

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    Hence, wait till next year. When the Prius plug-in comes out, then there will be a direct comparison. Even though you are operating in EV mode most of the time, that still does not make the car a serial hybrid, as it was originally billed by GM. It is parallel hybrid, and the Prius plug-in performance, as well as other models coming out soon, will provide a direct comparison.
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    mmcdonal Active Member

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    Agreed, based on the testimony of the Volt drivers on this forum and elsewhere. But as you say, it is a Plug-in Prius with a higher direct drive speed.

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