Prius vs Echo -- Cost of Ownership

You crafty dog!

You only paid less the $3,000 for the Prius and what, another $1,000 for your first repair? And you're already getting 60 MPG!!!

We can't count your hobby stuff ... fuzzy dice, trick horn, e.t.c. Just the ordinary maintenance and operating costs. <GRINS>

Bob Wilson

 

Sorry, I missed this one the first time:

	Column 1	Column 2	Column 3	Column 4	Column 5	Column 6
0	1987 Camry	$ value	frequency	total
1	Purchase	$14	500	1	$14	500
2	Sale	($0)	1	($0)
3	Insurance / year	$500*	22	$11	000
4	tags and taxes	$100*	22	$2	200
5	fixed costs (costs/mile)			$27	700($0.08/mile)
6
7	miles		354	000
8	MPG		29
9	gallons		12	207
10
11	fuel cost	$1.75	12	207	$21	362
12	annual maint.	$200*	22	$4	400
13	repairs	$0	0	$0
14	tires	$320*	6	$1	920
15	operational costs (costs/mile)			$27	682($0.08/mile)
16
17	total cost			$55	382
18	cost per mile	$55	382	354	000	$0.16

* estimated costs

	Column 1	Column 2	Column 3	Column 4	Column 5	Column 6
0	2009 TCH	$ value	frequency	total
1	Purchase	$26	000	1	$26	000
2	Sale	$0	1	$0
3	Insurance / year	$500*	1	$500
4	tags and taxes	$200*	1	$200
5	fixed costs (costs/mile)			$26	700 ($1.34/mile)
6
7	miles		20	000
8	MPG		39
9	gallons		513
10
11	fuel cost	$3.00	513	$1	539
12	annual maint.	$200	1	$200
13	repairs	$0	0	$0
14	tires	$0	0	$0
15	operational costs (costs/mile)			$1	739($0.09/mile)
16
17	total cost			$28	439
18	cost per mile	$28	439	20	000	$1.42

* estimated

Understand that all I'm interested in are actual costs. The beauty of this particular analysis is showing how the fixed and operational costs can, over time, approach each other ... an optimal performance goal.

Bob Wilson

 

No problem, sometimes I miss a post in a long thread and not always by design. Never confuse my fatigue (or lack of morning coffee) for malice or disrespect. <GRINS>

One of the reasons I don't include current 'sale price' is because it hasn't occurred. Worse, it changes daily and even faster by events beyond our control. It also opens the door to speculation on how many miles and years the car will be owned. These at best are educated guesses and one Gulf of Mexico storm or sudden backyard, biomass-to-gas invention (grass clippings power engines) and all assumptions get thrown out the window. An engineer, I have to live with things as they are but I also recognize there are other ways to handle accounting.

Actually, not our Echo but now owned by one of my co-workers, Meyers. Now I don't know how he and his family are driving the car but he lives about a mile away from us. Let's make some educated guesses:

	Column 1	Column 2	Column 3	Column 4	Column 5	Column 6
0	2001 Echo	$ value	frequency	total
1	Purchase	$3	000	1	$3	000
2	Sale	($0)	1	($0)
3	Insurance / year	$450	1	$450
4	tags and taxes	$100	1	$100
5	fixed costs (costs/mile)			$3	550($0.36/mile)[/COLOR]
6
7	miles		10000
8	MPG		34
9	gallons		294
10
11	fuel cost	$2.50	294	$735
12	annual maint.	$200	1	$200
13	repairs *	$150	1	$150
14	tires	$0	1	$0
15	operational costs (costs/mile)			$1085($0.11/mile)
16
17	total cost			$4	635
18	cost per mile	$4	635	10	000	$0.46

* replaced wireless key entry system. Meyers' 2001 Echo. He also added bluetooth as part of a radio upgrade. As a new addition, Meyer will have to figure out how he chooses to handle these additions.

The rule I'm trying to follow is:

• maintenance of the 'as delivered' car - costs that must be considered as part of total cost of ownership. The replacement keyless entry system preserves an original function of the car.
• enhancements to the car - optional, in my case, not counted because these are not part of ownership of the original car. I sold him a car without bluetooth and a perfectly adequate, 2001 era radio.

What I've noticed is we have a partial fractions problem:

• one time costs - purchase, predominate from day one but rapidly ages to insignificance over time
• recurring fixed costs - insurance, tags, taxes are a recurring, overhead function that does not go away even if the car never moves from the driveway
• operating costs - wear and tear and fuel, are a recurring usage costs that happen only if the car moves

Please feel free to update the actual numbers. Hopefully you see why I kept the salvage value at "$0" for currently owned vehicles but this doesn't 'set my hair on fire' (first I have to find the hair.)

Resale value, it is nice to use Kelly Blue Book or in my case, Ebay completed sales, but these are estimates good only for today's brief moment in time and opportunity. For example, the dealer offered $2,700 for our 2001 Echo. I went to one of my co-workers, Meyer, complaining about the miserable offer and we agreed on $3,000. He got an Echo with just under a dozen hail dimples on the hood; a keyless entry system without fobs; and the original tires ... and Bob maintained. Later, I found two others at work who heard of the deal and 'wished' they'd had a chance to bid on the car but I glad Meyer got the car.

Bob Wilson

 

Perhaps because it contrasts our respective points of view ... our reasons for being here. I'm here to help folks keep their Prius running, including turning a wrench as needed.

The actual costs are current and accurate so there is no need to fix what ain't broke.

Bob Wilson

 

Interesting, this reminds me of:

Regardless, the subject is "Prius vs Echo -- Cost of Ownership." This thread was started to include what is known, the cost of ownership of our 2001 Echo and 2003 Prius. Our 2003 Prius only has 75,000 miles, not the 250,000 miles of Daryl's 2001 Prius. So now we have a more inclusive model:

	Column 1	Column 2	Column 3	Column 4	Column 5	Column 6
0	2001 Echo	$ value	frequency	total
1	Purchase	$14	250	1	$14	250
2	Sale	($3	000)	1	($3	000)
3	Insurance / year	$450	9	$4	050
4	tags and taxes	$100	9	$900
5	fixed costs (costs/mile)			$16	200($0.54/mile)
6
7	miles		30	000
8	MPG		34
9	gallons		882
10
11	fuel cost	$2.00	882	$1	764
12	annual maint.	$200	9	$1	800
13	repairs	$500	1	$500
14	tires	$0	0	$0
15	operational costs (costs/mile)			$4	064($0.14/mile)
16
17	total cost			$20	264
18	cost per mile	$20	264	30	000	$0.68

Wilsons' 2001 Echo experience.

	Column 1	Column 2	Column 3	Column 4	Column 5	Column 6
0	2003 Prius	$ value	frequency	total
1	Purchase	$17	300	1	$17	300
2	Sale	$0	1	$0
3	Insurance / year	$450	5	$2	250
4	tags and taxes	$100	5	$500
5	fixed costs (costs/mile)			$20	050($0.26/mile)
6
7	miles		75	000
8	MPG		52
9	gallons		1442
10
11	fuel cost	$2.50	1442	$3	605
12	annual maint.	$200	5	$1	000
13	repairs	$500	1	$500
14	tires	$225	2	$450
15	operational costs (costs/mile)			$5	555($0.07/mile)
16
17	total cost			$25	605
18	cost per mile	$25	605	75	000	$0.34

Wilsons' Prius experience.

I'm really quite happy with this model and to quote Arlo Guthrie:

Bob Wilson

 

That would be OK if we sold the Prius but it my commuting car and I have no plans to sell it. We only carry liability insurance on it so if it were lost in an accident tomorrow, the residual value would be zero and is not a realized benefit.

This was one of the lessons learned when our 1991 Camry was lost in a rain-slick accident. It was a nice enough car but I didn't realize that by having 'collision,' the insurance company would seize the title. After the deductible, we only got $1,300 back. When I looked at the premiums paid versus the loss return, it turned out to be a bad deal.

Had I avoided the 'collision' seizure, the 1991 Camry repair estimate was just under $3,000. The car was drivable after the accident except at night due to headlight damage. A $3,000, 32 MPG car would have been a lot cheaper and might even have made a credible trade-in.

Hummm, I driven the 2003 Prius, 75,000 miles and divided it by the actual, recorded mileage, 52 MPG, and came up with 1,442 gallons. Ahhhh, I see it now, problem fixed.

I've seen two styles of accounting: accrual and actual. My understanding is accrual can be applied when the obligation is incurred. In contrast, actual means the date of the transaction. I'm trying to follow actual transaction dates.

Thanks,
Bob Wilson

 

Understand I have no problem how you value your own cars. But I can only relate to my experience, not 'could have':

Perhaps but I know the 91 Camry with over 180,000 miles was lost in the accident and the insurance company 'took the car.' They told me the only way I could get it licensed is with a 'salvaged title' from a 'salvage certified mechanic.' As for their valuation, they used Fair condition. So I had a choice:

• turn down their payment - I keep car and all of the collision payments were our 'donation' to the insurance company
• take their offer - a check for $1,300 ... I took the check

I just went to Kelly Blue Book and this is what they listed our 2003 Prius with 125,000 miles, 'Fair condition': $3,525. Take away the $500 deductible and IF I had collision, a salvage value of $3,000.

Now if the Wilson's 2003 Prius were in your driveway and you held the title, use whatever salvage value you want. But in my case, I use the most conservative, worst case, salvage value. If or when we ever sell it, we'll fill in the sale price but not until then.

Bob Wilson