Sonata Hybrid or Turbo?

Why is it that, other than Porsche, DFI is only being used with FI, Forced Induction..??

in order to get the most reasonable benefits under BOOST forced induction requires a base derated/detuned engine. While the Porsche "standard" for NA (Normally Asperated) engines is in the range of 12:1 the FI engines (Ford EcoBoost/TwinForce) are using 10:1 or less.

That results in poor, EXTREMELY poor FE when off-boost, 99% (??) of the time.

Why, what's going on...?

What does Porsche know that no one else can figure out..??

 

Cool. So, will the Hyundai Sonata Hybrid will be on sale in the U.S. before 2011 then?

Any chance the U.S. could get a hybrid-turbo version?

 

More info now available on new Hyundai Sonata Hybrid, and this is the photo of the hybrid:


37mpg City, 39mpg Highway.

Dressing up Hyundai Sonata: the turbo and hybrid - Drive On: A conversation about the cars and trucks we drive - USATODAY.com


http://www.autoweek.com/article/20100331/NEWYORK/100339960
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I don't like the front grill. Maybe it'll look better with the license plate installed.

 

"..Any chance..."

No, a hybrid-turbo system would be just plain, patently, FUELISH.

Hybrids have adopted the Atkinson cycle engine concept for good, SOLID, engineering reasons, use more of the fuel/air energy of combustion within, WITHIN, the cylinder for "drive". Basically just enough energy left in the exhaust system to keep the catalytic converter up to operational temperature, NEVER enough, certainly, to spin a turbo.

The real answer lies in the use of a SuperCharger providing boost ONLY during a hybrid system WOT operation. Make use of the Totota HSD CVT/PSD concept to drive an SC.

The full range boost pressure variablity of a CVT/PSD driven positive displacement SC's boost level would also allow elimination of a throttle plate.

 

I want a car that has a completely sealed, front. Then as cooling air is needed a gap opens, low, to suck in the minimum cooling air needed.

Looks like I'll have to make my own.

Hummmm, I've got this 2003 Prius . . . .

Bob Wilson

 

ford is actually working on that exact technology. Vents that close for aerodynamics, then open as the radiator needs cooling. I'm sure others are working on it too, but you'll have to implement your own on the prius. I'm sure others will want to buy your system though.

I also would like a super charged hybrid. Even a mild electric flywheel could smooth out the lag. I'm sure there will be some better choices when I buy the next car. 250hp mild plug in hybrid with enough juice to even out the city mileage and ac.

 

Mitsubishi and Nissan are working on Turbo hybrid versions of the Evolution and GT-R (respectively), so you'll get your wish sometime soon.

 

I have always thought, wondered about, a Porsche 911 turbo with minimum drag NASA style intake airflow ducts at the "hips" (just aft of the door rear).

But I think I'll start with my Craftsman lawn tractor, 25HP air-cooled Kohler engine. Seal the top of the hood air intake to reduce the intake noise in favor of NASA airflow intake ducts at each side front.

 

Turbo-hybrid versions....

Asking for a visit to bankruptcy court, that.

The core design desire, TARGET, of modern hybrid systems is to provide the smallist, HIGHEST efficiency engine that still has "just enough" HP/torque to move the car along briskly during simple cruise mode.

"Simple cruise mode"....98-99% of the time for most of us..??

That's why almost all modern day hybrids have adopted some form of the Atkinson cycle design for the gasoline engine "cruise" operating mode. The Atkinson concept use results in a comparatively higher percentage of the POWER of gas/air combustion to be used up in the process of PUSHING the cylinder DOWNWARD.

Just think of the hybrid battery/electric motor combination as a new way of SUPERCHARGING an otherwise low torque engine most tuned for CRUSING. The BATTERY provides the BOOST for quicker acceleration when/as needed.

Absent a method for converting the engine quickly and inexpensively from the highly efficient, low torque, Atkinson cycle mode into the POOR engine efficiency required of TurboCharging you simply cannot SPIN a Turbo.

TurboCharged engines REQUIRE that the gasoline engine, BASE engine, be seriously INEFFICIENT during ON-BOOST operations.

Obviously it is highly desireable to compress the intake airflow to the highest pressure possible EXTERNAL to the piston/cylinder so it can be pre-cooled before entering the combustion chamber.

A positive displacement variable speed (speed variability independent of engine RPM) SuperCharger can provide the perfect solution. Studebaker's SuperHawk model used such a concept quite successfully back in the mid-fifties. The engine "drove" the SC directly via a CVT V-belt arrangement.

IMMHO the Toyota HSD's CVT/PSD concept provides an excellent design approach to SuperCharging an Atkinson cycle engine.

Anyone have one of those mid-fifties Studebaker SuperHawks around that could be used as a test mule..??

 

I think I should have prefaced the comment with: for people who just want a faster car, and don't give too much of a crap about fuel economy (although efficiency is fantastically important in race cars)

 

My advice...WATCH out for Mazda.

They already have experience with SuperCharging an Atkinson cycle engine.

The Mazda Millennia "S". Shame it was only available as FWD.

Combining an SC with Atkinson is a design idea first thought up by an engineer by the name Miller back in the late 40's. SuperCharge a Atkinson cycle engine, it becomes a Miller cycle engine.

One would think that having now licensed the Toyota HSD concept the Mazda engineers will be able to add 2 + 2 and come up with 5. Or maybe even 6.