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Enginer Indicator Problems (and Solution)

Discussion in 'Prius PHEV Plug-In Modifications' started by skschoch, May 25, 2010.

  1. skschoch

    skschoch New Member

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    2004 Prius
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    A good thing about Prius PHEV conversions in general is that they mostly don't change the appearance of the car, except for an outlet on the bumper and a switch on the dash. However, this can also be a problem, because you don't know when something isn't working.

    The Enginer system has two "indicator" problems:

    1. You can't tell when it's charging and when it's done, without opening the bottom hatch (which may require unloading cargo).
    2. The "low battery" indicator can't be seen in daylight.
    I attempted to solve these two problems, with partial success:

    The charger has a light that turns red when charging, and green when charged (or when the battery pack is disconnected). My preference was to move this light to the power connector on the bumper, but this was not practical. Instead, I found that it was very easy to get access to the reverse light in the tail light assembly, without even removing the cover.

    My first step was to get access to the charger:
    [​IMG]

    Once the charger was removed, I opened the side panel and removed the existing light:
    [​IMG]

    I installed a jack in the hole where the light was. I used nylon washers because the 48v battery pack is not grounded to the case.
    [​IMG]

    Here's the charger with the new socket:
    [​IMG] [​IMG]

    I bought a 2-color LED and soldered it to the end of the cable that is plugged into the jack seen above:
    [​IMG]

    Here's the only small modification made to the stock Prius. I cut a notch in the left reverse light socket to allow the wires to the LED to pass through:
    [​IMG]


    The result: Here are pictures taken at dusk of the pack charging and charged:
    [​IMG] [​IMG]


    The light looks much better than it does in these pictures. I can look out my front window and see the Prius parked in the driveway about 30 feet away. After dusk the light is very visible. This tells me several things at a glance: I can see if the cord is powered even when the car is locked. If the light turns green immediately when plugged in, then the pack is disconnected for some reason, such as a bad connection, the BMS under-voltage circuit triggered, or the 100A circuit breaker tripped. Since we have a time-of-use electric meter, my charging cord is plugged into a timer so the car doesn't charge until after 6pm. This light tells me that the timer is working.

    The 2nd Enginer "indicator" problem is the dim "battery low" light. In an attempt to solve that problem, I removed the DC-DC converter and looked at the circuit where the red indicator light plugs in with the 6P6C socket. Limited tracing showed that the red LED on the dash was connected directly in parallel with the red LED on the DC-DC converter. When two LEDs are connected in parallel with a common current-limiting resistor like this, the current through each LED will be reduced by 1/2, reducing the brightness also by 1/2. So as a quick fix, I removed the LED in the DC-DC converter:
    [​IMG] [​IMG]


    Unfortunately, I couldn't test this on the bench, so I put it all back together and used the car normally. The red light is brighter now, but it's still not bright enough to see in daylight. I'm going to have to ask Jack about a better solution, perhaps a lower resistor or a transistor driver circuit. The way the converter is constructed, it's very hard to get inside to modify it.
     
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  2. pbui

    pbui Member

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    Location:
    Los Gatos, northern CA
    Vehicle:
    2004 Prius
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    N/A
    Nice job.

    Is it bad to drive with the red LED on ? i thought it is just an indicator that the batt pack has dropped below 46v and has automatically shut down. I've thought about making this brighter but didn't think it was essential. My idea is to tap in the 4-wire phone jack to get the LEDs leads to drive a couple of transistors to power two additional LEDs mounted higher up. There is 12v on that little circuit behind the Enginer switch and the LEDs will draw very little current.

    From your first foto, it looks like there is a low voltage cut-off relay, i guess part of your BMS low-voltage cut-off. Please elaborate your circuit, how are u monitoring individual cell voltage ?

    does your BMS also shut-down from individual cell reaching high-voltage ?

    thanks, Pb
     
  3. skschoch

    skschoch New Member

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    2004 Prius
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    N/A
    That's what I understand as well. Often the light will stay on for a few minutes, then (when the pack recovers?) it will turn off and the system will charge the battery again for a few minutes. It would be nice to know when this happens, for example if the PHEV battery goes low, I probably want to switch out of EV mode unless I'm close to my destination.
    That's a great idea! I'll consider doing something like that.

    As I posted in this thread, the BMS circuit is designed by the installer, 3ProngPower. They use a BMS module from Australia.
     
  4. pbui

    pbui Member

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    Vehicle:
    2004 Prius
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    thanks, I guess you had your complete system installed by 3prong.

    Do you charge pretty much unattended ? it looks like the BMS simply disconnect the pack battery and let the charger response as it pleases. Unless the small 12v replay is also wired as a latch, once the high cell voltage settle and some energy bled-off by the "balancer"; wouldn't the pack battery get re-connected again ? thus repeat the on/off cycling ?
     
  5. skschoch

    skschoch New Member

    Joined:
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    Location:
    Sunnyvale, CA
    Vehicle:
    2004 Prius
    Model:
    N/A
    Yes, I charge overnight. I plug it in when I get home and leave it plugged in until I drive again.
    No, the BMS does not normally disconnect the battery pack, unless the voltage on a cell is extremely high or low.

    The BMS low voltage cutoff is to prevent a cell from being damaged by total discharge. It is a backup in case the automatic low-battery shutdown in the DC-DC converter fails.

    The BMS high voltage cutoff is a safety to prevent a cell from being overcharged to the point of exploding. It is a backup in case the automatic charge-complete shutdown in the charger fails.

    If the DC-DC converter and charger are working properly, then the BMS will leave the relays energized at all times, and the battery pack will always be connected.

    The normal operation of the BMS module is to draw current and dissipate excess charge energy when one cell is finished charging before the other cells in the pack. When all cells have finished charging, the charger itself will stop charging and turn the "charged" light green. According to Enginer, the charger is made by the same company that makes the cells, and is designed to charge unattended.
     
  6. pbui

    pbui Member

    Joined:
    Dec 9, 2009
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    Location:
    Los Gatos, northern CA
    Vehicle:
    2004 Prius
    Model:
    N/A
    may be your system is of later revision, though i think in one of your post you said you've been plug-in for 4 months. My system is off dec 2009. Since you are not monitoring cell voltages and not there all night, the charger could be cycling on/off and you wouldn't know. But it seems like the system is working for you. I just checked with 3prong, that BMS is priced $500. I am rigging up a temporary circuit to shut off the charger for unattended charging, until Enginer upgrade me...hopefully.

    You are essentially balancing at the top and the low cell voltage is saving your pack. What is your tank MPG ?